A Spirited Perfect Ten

Tigger1988

Tigger1988

Well-Known Member
John said:
I am not going to defend ford......he is a big boy and can defend himself....I don't want to come across doing so....but my point was that you said he wasn't an expert, I don't know if he is or isn't....do you? What we do know if we were taking his post at face value is that he has had business dealings in China. That right there makes him more of an "expert" then most of us. Is building and operating a theme park different then just having some widgets manufactured or what ever type of business he was dealing in different? Sure, but even the most uniformed poster ( such as myself) knows that doing business in China means doing business with the Chinese government. Which gives ford a certain insight most of us don't have. Is he an expert? Does he have to be?

How many on here comment about WDW and its operation here in the states? How many of them are experts on running a theme park in the United States?
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No offense but his inability to keep simple facts straight when making a comparison seem to lead people towards him not being an expert.
 
Lee

Lee

Adventurer
John

John

Well-Known Member
Tigger1988 said:
No offense but his inability to keep simple facts straight when making a comparison seem to lead people towards him not being an expert.
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No offense taken.....I understand your point but I don't think he claimed to be an expert. I see your point and point well taken.
 
Cesar R M

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
ford91exploder said:
Well Excuuussse Me for incorrectly stating the studio And the invincible Frozen made a paltry 49.1 Million in china. yeah Disney is a rousing success there. Visit china soon, Check out the characters you see - they are not DISNEY but Hello Kitty is everywhere from babies to urban professional women.

But we all know Disney will be number one in China because they are Disney, Right - That seems to be your point. Having BEEN there myself I don't see Disney's success as inevitable more of a coin toss which can go either way
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lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
Disney doesn't operate the parks in Japan (they may operate Paris now, not sure how that breaks down anymore since he structure has changed). The parks in Japan just pay a royalty to Disney for using the brand. Not sure how Honk Kong is structured, but I think they at least have a partner.
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Euro Disney SCA, because it is an SCA, is not wholly owned by The Walt Disney Company but it has always been run like a wholly owned subsidiary of The Walt Disney Company. Hong Kong Disneyland Resort is also operated by Walt Disney Parks and Resorts (ownership and operations are two different issues) and Shanghai Disney Resort will probably also be operated by Disney, since the agreement is very similar to the one with Hong Kong.

Universal only operates the U.S. parks. Universal Studios Japan and Universal Studios Singapore are owned and operated by other, local companies like Tokyo Disney Resort.
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
GoofGoof said:
I agree that I'm nervous about the prospects of this project. That opinion hasn't changed for me since the beginning. I don't think anything that has happened so far in the construction process is surprising or unprecedented. Disney projects run over budget and behind schedule. It's a given.

One slight point of contention I have with your post. I don't think having been to China makes you an expert on the market. I've been to Vegas a bunch of times but I wouldn't know the first thing about running a casino;). It's quite possible for people to understand a market without frequently traveling there.
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All I can say is doing business in China is NOT like doing business in the west and I'm no expert but when there I'm usually with native or 1st generation Chinese who do ALL the talking FOR me all I do is set a goal and let the Chinese figure it out for westerners there are barriers of language and culture and being Gwai lo (ie not Chinese - literally 'Ghost Person' ) you are looked down upon, The Chinese do see themselves as the master race.

The 'Middle Kingdom' is frequently misunderstood by westerners. In reality it means that China is the center of the universe.

So unless Disney has a leadership team for SDL who are culturally Chinese the odds of SDL being a failure for TWDC are VERY high.

HK and Macao is NOT China and have a completely different business culture than the mainland there are some commonalities of course but they might as well be from different planets.
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
GoofGoof said:
This is my whole point. I don't agree with the idea that you have to have been to China to have an opinion on Disney's plans there. Throughout discussions on this park I've seen that sentiment.
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No you don't have to go to china, The point I'm making is people keep thinking Chinese are like Americans who look different you even have policy makers who make the same error.

They are NOT The Chinese are an ancient race who had country wide government and sophisticated technologies when most of our ancestors were living in caves and mud huts and had a hunter/gatherer lifestyle.
 
ford91exploder

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
John said:
No offense taken.....I understand your point but I don't think he claimed to be an expert. I see your point and point well taken.
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And tigger likes to start fights but hey, No, I did not watch Transformers as 2+ hours of CGI explosions from Michael Bey just are not my idea of entertainment so getting the studio wrong was indeed an error on my part but I'm only interested in the delta between DIS Movie IP and Other than DIS movie IP and so far DIS is lagging other studios.

The basic trend seems to be the Chinese seem to be more receptive to non-Disney IP, than Disney IP, The average income of a Chinese family is about 2,500 Yuan a US movie costs 100 Yuan per ticket - so it's VERY expensive. So a pattern of not doing well at the box office does indicate that your IP is not resonating with the audience.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
ford91exploder said:
All I can say is doing business in China is NOT like doing business in the west and I'm no expert but when there I'm usually with native or 1st generation Chinese who do ALL the talking FOR me all I do is set a goal and let the Chinese figure it out for westerners there are barriers of language and culture and being Gwai lo (ie not Chinese - literally 'Ghost Person' ) you are looked down upon, The Chinese do see themselves as the master race.

The 'Middle Kingdom' is frequently misunderstood by westerners. In reality it means that China is the center of the universe.

So unless Disney has a leadership team for SDL who are culturally Chinese the odds of SDL being a failure for TWDC are VERY high.

HK and Macao is NOT China and have a completely different business culture than the mainland there are some commonalities of course but they might as well be from different planets.
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I assume that is what the Chinese partner is for. They should be able to smooth things over with the locals. Plenty of American businesses have succeeded in China. Most probably adopted the strategy of partnering with local companies.

Who is in charge of SDL from the Disney side?
 
Phil12

Phil12

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
I assume that is what the Chinese partner is for. They should be able to smooth things over with the locals. Plenty of American businesses have succeeded in China. Most probably adopted the strategy of partnering with local companies.

Who is in charge of SDL from the Disney side?
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I agree. After all I hear that GM is doing very well in China. If GM can do well, then most any business can do well.
 
the.dreamfinder

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
I assume that is what the Chinese partner is for. They should be able to smooth things over with the locals. Plenty of American businesses have succeeded in China. Most probably adopted the strategy of partnering with local companies.

Who is in charge of SDL from the Disney side?
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The purpose of the Chinese partner is more to keep money made by western enterprises in China in China and to help develop domestic industry. This is done with the long term goal that foreign corporations do not have a stranglehold on Chinese markets. Disney's partner for Shanghai Disney Resort is the state owned media company Shanghai SHEDNI group. Technically a conglomerate, they own television and radio stations, a tourism business, and a construction company. If @WDW1974 could, I would love to know why Shendi specifically was chosen as TWDC's partner and how they go about that process.
Phil12 said:
I agree. After all I hear that GM is doing very well in China. If GM can do well, then most any business can do well.
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Buick is huge there and they have been slowly developing a manufacturing and marketing presence since the late nineties. Heck, I'd argue Buick has more cultural resonance there than Disney.
http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/201...-leader-for-buicks-survival-and-record-sales/
 
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Goofyernmost

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
ford91exploder said:
Most companies even large ones in NE do not offer paid vacation even any longer, Has nothing to do with being in the service sector unemployment is high and paid vacation is no longer a perk they need to offer to attract and retain employees.

Thanks to A$$holes in Congress and the White house business in the US is a race to the bottom.
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What part of NE are you taking about? I just left Vermont less then 4 years ago, where I lived for almost 50 years and I can guarantee you that although the pay is low, by comparison, they do still have benefits even in some service jobs. The pay alone is sending people, like my family, out of the state. No Vacation time would turn the place into a ghost town.
 
TalkingHead

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
Rteetz said:
New York times article saying WDW is the only gauranteed vacation. They even bring in Lou...

http://nypost.com/2015/03/01/why-disney-world-is-the-only-guaranteed-vacation-in-america/?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_medium=SocialFlow
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New York Post, not Times. Can we expect 10 subsequent pages discussing whether or not there's a difference between the two? ;)

It’s the kind of guarantee that, say, Yosemite National Park is not offering. Touring the monuments and museums in Washington, DC, can be kind of hit or miss too. Even New York has bad weather and the view from the Empire State Building is nice, but it’s not interactive. In any urban or rural tourist destination, there are interesting things to see, but it takes a while to get from one to the other. And sometimes the kids get bored.
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Poor written article, to say the least. What's the author mean by "guarantee"?

Yosemite doesn't offer a "guarantee"? Is El Capitan going to be down for refurbishment in May? Is the National Gallery in D.C. going to go 101 the afternoon I'm there?

Not to mention, he says how boring the lines are and then proceeds to imply that kids don't get bored at WDW. :rolleyes:
 
Cesar R M

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
ford91exploder said:
No you don't have to go to china, The point I'm making is people keep thinking Chinese are like Americans who look different you even have policy makers who make the same error.

They are NOT The Chinese are an ancient race who had country wide government and sophisticated technologies when most of our ancestors were living in caves and mud huts and had a hunter/gatherer lifestyle.
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This kinda reminds me when they had the "great" idea of try to insert taco bell to Mexico
they tried 4 times I think.
they all went bankrupt.
because these things arent even real tacos!

know your audience!!
 

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