What's Next For DHS And AK??

[_Scar]

Haha...everything else...there's hardly anything in that everything you speak of. Everest, Kali, Dinosaur, Nemo...not much in this park. Trekking through it...yeah, it's themed well in most places, and it is a pretty park, but there's just way too much walking and not enough attractions along the way.

DAK needs more rides badly. That's obvious. Studios needs some more too. MK...sorry, but it's the freaking busiest theme park in the world. It NEEDS all the capacity it can get. The FLE isn't going to be enough. They need another E ticket elsewhere in the park, and any other expansions will be very welcome. That park is almost always crowded year round. Basically, all of WDW needs some things added.

Also ITTBAB if you count that, FoW, Dinorama, and the Maharaja. Considering how many attractions DHS offers that park goers constantly can go on (TSMM, ToT, RNRC, ST2) I think DAK offers as much if not more re-rideability.

And while I agree DAK needs "more rides," it actually needs family rides much more than (and I hate to say this) another huge E-ticket. Studios is fine for now imo considering MI coaster is probably coming soon.

And MK will be fine I think. If there is a continuing capacity problem, I'd bet that it wouldn't be enough to prompt another expansion in the near future for those reasons. But I'd LOVE to be wrong about that- especially in the Frontierland region...

The biggest issue (and biggest area for expansion) is behind Kali River Rapids. There really isn't enough room for a walking path to an entire land unless either the Wildlife Express Train and/or Maharajah Jungle Trek are removed/modified. This is part of the reason why I feel that this area should be used for a nighttime show, just because a winding path can be used for a queue, just not for a walking path to a land.

The other possibility for expansion is the removal of the Discovery Island trails behind the Tree of Life and replacing them with elements of Flik's Fun Fair. This is a very well done done kiddy land in DCA, and while I enjoy walking behind the Tree of Life along those trails, those are animals that can easily be relocated or even integrated alongside the kiddy attractions.

Do you think a nighttime show would be a good idea when you physically have to pass all the animals to get to the show? The TRR area is in such a pickle because it's such a great amount of space in such an awkward place. Maybe they should just move forward with TRR.... :lookaroun $$$

IMO, DAK needs a nighttime show near Dinosaur. But what? WoC?

Good idea about Flik's Fun Fair! I think that land is so darn cute and well-themed. I'd rather put it near FOTLK or DHS though. There's something about Discovery Island and its lack of everything you'd expect at a normal Disney park that makes it so cool!

 

[pppapazo]

The other possibility for expansion is the removal of the Discovery Island trails behind the Tree of Life and replacing them with elements of Flik's Fun Fair. This is a very well done done kiddy land in DCA, and while I enjoy walking behind the Tree of Life along those trails, those are animals that can easily be relocated or even integrated alongside the kiddy attractions.

I would hate for this to happen. There used to be a time when a lot of thought went into the B/C/D-ticket attractions the whole family could enjoy. Yes, Disneyland's Fantasyland opened with a handful of reskinned carnival rides (Dumbo, Mad Tea Party, Carousel), but they complemented some original rides that have remained classics to this day (Mr. Toad, Snow White, Peter Pan, Storybook Land).

Nowadays, it's more likely that a new land will be anchored by a single original D/E-ticket and filled in with a slew of reskinned carnival rides. A Bug's Land is built around It's Tough to Be a Bug, but all of the rides that fill out Flik's Fun Fair are just off-the-shelf kiddie rides. Yes, they're "themed" but only to the lowest common denominator. You can find the same stuff at any country fair.

The same thing goes for:
- Paradise Pier, also at DCA -- although with the addition of Toy Story Mania and Ariel's Adventure to California Screamin', this land is becoming more balanced.
- DinoLand at Animal Kingdom -- Dinosaur anchors a land otherwise filled with a playground, a Dumbo clone, and an off-the-shelf coaster. Oh, and a musical stage show that doesn't make any sense where it is. Is the Cretaceous Trail even there anymore?
- Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea, which is anchored by the Little Mermaid live show but is otherwise glorified kiddie rides.
- Toy Story Playland in Paris and Hong Kong, which doesn't even have an original attraction to anchor it.

Even Cars Land will open with one brand new attraction and two spinning rides. There was a time when that wouldn't pass muster for a brand new land.

So yeah, this is veering off-topic, but please don't bring Flik's Fun Fair to Animal Kingdom and tell me it's a satisfactory expansion.

 

[RSoxNo1]

:hurl:
Make that beautiful area into Chester and Hester's ?!?! Really?!

I hardly consider Flik's Fun Fair to be on par with Chester and Hester's. In my opinion it's better done than Toontown was/is (Disney World/Disneyland).

Also ITTBAB if you count that, FoW, Dinorama, and the Maharaja. Considering how many attractions DHS offers that park goers constantly can go on (TSMM, ToT, RNRC, ST2) I think DAK offers as much if not more re-rideability.

And while I agree DAK needs "more rides," it actually needs family rides much more than (and I hate to say this) another huge E-ticket. Studios is fine for now imo considering MI coaster is probably coming soon.

And MK will be fine I think. If there is a continuing capacity problem, I'd bet that it wouldn't be enough to prompt another expansion in the near future for those reasons. But I'd LOVE to be wrong about that- especially in the Frontierland region...



Do you think a nighttime show would be a good idea when you physically have to pass all the animals to get to the show? The TRR area is in such a pickle because it's such a great amount of space in such an awkward place. Maybe they should just move forward with TRR.... :lookaroun $$$

IMO, DAK needs a nighttime show near Dinosaur. But what? WoC?

Good idea about Flik's Fun Fair! I think that land is so darn cute and well-themed. I'd rather put it near FOTLK or DHS though. There's something about Discovery Island and its lack of everything you'd expect at a normal Disney park that makes it so cool!

The logical spot for the entrance would be between Maharajah Jungle Trek and the Wildlife Express train. Sound barriers could conceivably be used, however failing that the exhibits for the Maharajah Jungle Trek could be relocated to elsewhere in Asia.

Flik's Fun Fair could also go on the left side of Discovery Island between the shops that lead to Africa, but that may ultimately be the best spot for The Festival of the Lion King.

I also wouldn't oppose something like this going into DHS.

I would hate for this to happen. There used to be a time when a lot of thought went into the B/C/D-ticket attractions the whole family could enjoy. Yes, Disneyland's Fantasyland opened with a handful of reskinned carnival rides (Dumbo, Mad Tea Party, Carousel), but they complemented some original rides that have remained classics to this day (Mr. Toad, Snow White, Peter Pan, Storybook Land).

Nowadays, it's more likely that a new land will be anchored by a single original D/E-ticket and filled in with a slew of reskinned carnival rides. A Bug's Land is built around It's Tough to Be a Bug, but all of the rides that fill out Flik's Fun Fair are just off-the-shelf kiddie rides. Yes, they're "themed" but only to the lowest common denominator. You can find the same stuff at any country fair.

The same thing goes for:
- Paradise Pier, also at DCA -- although with the addition of Toy Story Mania and Ariel's Adventure to California Screamin', this land is becoming more balanced.
- DinoLand at Animal Kingdom -- Dinosaur anchors a land otherwise filled with a playground, a Dumbo clone, and an off-the-shelf coaster. Oh, and a musical stage show that doesn't make any sense where it is. Is the Cretaceous Trail even there anymore?
- Mermaid Lagoon at Tokyo DisneySea, which is anchored by the Little Mermaid live show but is otherwise glorified kiddie rides.
- Toy Story Playland in Paris and Hong Kong, which doesn't even have an original attraction to anchor it.

Even Cars Land will open with one brand new attraction and two spinning rides. There was a time when that wouldn't pass muster for a brand new land.

So yeah, this is veering off-topic, but please don't bring Flik's Fun Fair to Animal Kingdom and tell me it's a satisfactory expansion.

Yes these are carnival rides, but these types of rides have always existed at Disney (Teacups, Dumbo, Fun House type rides/Fantasyland Dark Rides). If you make a ride incredibly elaborate it's no longer a B/C ticket. If it blends into it's surroundings logically it can still be a positive addition regardless of what ticket level it's given.

The only thing I've ever done in Flik's Fun Fair is see It's Tough to be a Bug as a point of comparison. However I've walked through it and it's a small area that's very well done. It's not going to revolutionize whatever park it's put in, but it will be far less tacky than Dino-Rama. I too would be upset to lose these peaceful trails, but I really think this will be a benefit to the park.

As for what's being added to Carsland - the budgets for the two spinning rides are D ticket type budgets. That's more a function of how much money Disney is capable of wasting, but they will be intricately themed.

Your perspective seems somewhat short sighted though - you can boil everything down to stuff you can find at your local fair if you strip away all of the elements. Even something like Dino-Rama would be a step in the right direction for your local county fair or even Six Flags.

Disney needs these types of outdoor kiddy rides - these are the types of things that children gravitate towards. They can see the motion and they are quite simply visually appealing to children. The trick is to be able to blend them in with the rest of their surroundings and not detract from the parks as whole.

 

[Disday]

Will the upcoming Pixar Dinosaur movie have a future at Dinoland?

 

[Master Yoda]

Will the upcoming Pixar Dinosaur movie have a future at Dinoland?

Doubtful. The theme of the movie in no way matches the theme of Dinoland which, as odd as it sounds, is based more reality than the movie will be.

 

[ScorpionX]

I'll ask the Magic Conch.

Magic Conch, what's coming soon for DHS and AK?

Epic. Just plain epic.

 

[invader]

Removal of the hat by 2013.*



*hopefully.

 

[misterID]

The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Not every addition/change can be an E-Ticket, but the parks are all evolving. The problem is people just aren't happy with the current pace.

I know you expanded on some of this later in the thread, but I just wanted to add this: Most of the expansion/additions you offered up really isn't that significant, or what people would consider significant (Kim Possible, the new pizza place in Italy that you mentioned later on, etc.) and if you took out the refurbs that really (really) shouldn't be considered expansion/additions, but really standard operation; basically, what they're supposed to do every so often. And then you count the less than stellar descent of SSE and the neutered SM refurb, it starts shrinking even further. The jury is still out on how significant the TT refurd will actually be.

Now, I do not mind clones. I really don't. Maybe some do, but I think Soarin and TSM are really great addtions. And I add TLM in there, too. But we both know the backstory to these attractions and the fact that if they weren't clones we wouldn't have got them. I really have to consider that. That's why I also can't consider Captain EO as part of a "continuously updated WDW." It's really the eye of the beholder as to whether its really an upgrade or not, or if its actually been successful, but it made money in Cali and then somehow found its way to EPCOT.

But I stand firm that how they've handled the FLE refurb so far is really great and gives me a lot of hope. The fact Staggs addressed peoples concerns really gives me hope, too.

 

[NoChesterHester]

he logical spot for the entrance would be between Maharajah Jungle Trek and the Wildlife Express train. Sound barriers could conceivably be used, however failing that the exhibits for the Maharajah Jungle Trek could be relocated to elsewhere in Asia.

Sorry Tim, I know you like the idea of a night time show in AK near the back of the park, but I think it is bad placement. Can you imagine 10,000 people leaving the park in the dark over those winding trails? So much would be required to make it happen properly. Besides, the animal habitats are back there.

If we ever see a night time show at AK I would put money that it will be in a new theater or something up where Camp Minnie Mickey currently resides. It is just the most logical placement. You could get the masses out after the show.

I agree with most everything else in your posts about HS and AK.

 

[jmick71]

the Asia section of AK seems mostly about India/Himalayas. to expand upon mythical creatures throughout the park(instead of just in BK), it would be good to ad a more Oriental(china/japan) section to Asia and have the ride based around a dragon, and other myths and legends, maybe even being able to take stuff from some of the Asian parks, (something similar to mystic manner)

 

[_Scar]

the Asia section of AK seems mostly about India/Himalayas. to expand upon mythical creatures throughout the park(instead of just in BK), it would be good to ad a more Oriental(china/japan) section to Asia and have the ride based around a dragon, and other myths and legends, maybe even being able to take stuff from some of the Asian parks, (something similar to mystic manner)

Asia is already DAK's hotspot. I doubt they'd add another big attraction here until decades from now.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Sorry Tim, I know you like the idea of a night time show in AK near the back of the park, but I think it is bad placement. Can you imagine 10,000 people leaving the park in the dark over those winding trails? So much would be required to make it happen properly. Besides, the animal habitats are back there.

If we ever see a night time show at AK I would put money that it will be in a new theater or something up where Camp Minnie Mickey currently resides. It is just the most logical placement. You could get the masses out after the show.

I agree with most everything else in your posts about HS and AK.

That's another logical spot - I just think it's a better spot for attractions that would be used all day instead of just at night. That being said there's more than enough room south of the current Camp Minnie Mickey area, and I believe you or someone else suggested that as a logical location because of the ease of exiting at the end of the night. It certainly makes sense.

 

[Mansion Butler]

If the Discovery Island trails were eliminated, I might literally cry.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

IMO, DAK needs a nighttime show near Dinosaur. But what? WoC?

Good idea about Flik's Fun Fair! I think that land is so darn cute and well-themed. I'd rather put it near FOTLK or DHS though. There's something about Discovery Island and its lack of everything you'd expect at a normal Disney park that makes it so cool!

There will be no nighttime show in DAK for the same reasons they have no fireworks, the park closes that early because of the animals and they will not expand the evening opening time to assure the animals are not disturbed.

And PLEASE no fairground on Discovery Island, isn't one Chester and Hester enough? I don't consider fairgrounds very disneyish.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

the Asia section of AK seems mostly about India/Himalayas. to expand upon mythical creatures throughout the park(instead of just in BK), it would be good to ad a more Oriental(china/japan) section to Asia and have the ride based around a dragon, and other myths and legends, maybe even being able to take stuff from some of the Asian parks, (something similar to mystic manner)

Hmm... this reminds me of the "distinctly Disney, uniquely Chinese" line for Shanghai. Maybe something they're planning over there would port well to DAK?

 

[DisneyFan 2000]

There will be no nighttime show in DAK for the same reasons they have no fireworks, the park closes that early because of the animals and they will not expand the evening opening time to assure the animals are not disturbed.

That's ridiculous. Busch Gardens has roaring coasters and longer operating hours and it's just "down the road" from Animal Kingdom. So either the Busch animals are immune to all things noise, or it's just the case that there's still not enough in AK to warrant full day hours. Moreover, a WoC show for AK, located somewhere distinctly off the beaten path (say... that wasted space named Camp Minnie-Mickey), would hardly be a disturbance to the animals of the park. There are some relatively easy solutions to increasing park hours and adding nighttime offerings, it all boils down to when TDO are interested in thinking them up.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Now, I do not mind clones. I really don't. Maybe some do, but I think Soarin and TSM are really great addtions. And I add TLM in there, too. But we both know the backstory to these attractions and the fact that if they weren't clones we wouldn't have got them. I really have to consider that. That's why I also can't consider Captain EO as part of a "continuously updated WDW." It's really the eye of the beholder as to whether its really an upgrade or not, or if its actually been successful, but it made money in Cali and then somehow found its way to EPCOT.
But I stand firm that how they've handled the FLE refurb so far is really great and gives me a lot of hope. The fact Staggs addressed peoples concerns really gives me hope, too.

I also don't mind clones at all and I don't understand why quite a lot people are against them. I couldn't even care less if they are clones of headliner attractions!
I would be highly thrilled if in a kind of Attack of the Clones they would suddenly build:

Indiana Jones Adventure in DHS (and please don't say Dinosaur is already a clone because it has the same track layout)

Journey to the Center of the Earth in MK (probably in Adventureland)

Matterhorn in the Swiss Pavilion for EPCOTs World Showcase

Crushs Coaster in DAK

I also wouldn't be exactly disappointed if, after Soarin' and TLM we would get a third clone from DCA, Radiator Springs Racers.

Yes they are all clones but what an addition to the parks!

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

That's ridiculous. Busch Gardens has roaring coasters and longer operating hours and it's just "down the road" from Animal Kingdom. So either the Busch animals are immune to all things noise, or it's just the case that there's still not enough in AK to warrant full day hours. Moreover, a WoC show for AK, located somewhere distinctly off the beaten path (say... that wasted space named Camp Minnie-Mickey), would hardly be a disturbance to the animals of the park. There are some relatively easy solutions to increasing park hours and adding nighttime offerings, it all boils down to when TDO are interested in thinking them up.

I only say what Disney officials said about that years ago when DAK had the first problems with attendance and it was discussed what to add. It's not my opinion.

 

[Bairstow]

That's ridiculous. Busch Gardens has roaring coasters and longer operating hours and it's just "down the road" from Animal Kingdom. So either the Busch animals are immune to all things noise, or it's just the case that there's still not enough in AK to warrant full day hours. Moreover, a WoC show for AK, located somewhere distinctly off the beaten path (say... that wasted space named Camp Minnie-Mickey), would hardly be a disturbance to the animals of the park. There are some relatively easy solutions to increasing park hours and adding nighttime offerings, it all boils down to when TDO are interested in thinking them up.

That's an excellent point.

Maybe the real problem is that it's impractical to run the Safari ride when it's dark due to increased animal activity across the roads and decreased visibility. Shutting down the parks main attraction would cause severe headaches for capacity and guest satisfaction.

It wouldn't surprise me for the hours to be extended if/when they have more than 5 actual attractions.

Although... how fun would the safari ride be if they somehow integrated infrared goggles into the ride vehicles?

 

[Master Yoda]

That's an excellent point.

Maybe the real problem is that it's impractical to run the Safari ride when it's dark due to increased animal activity across the roads and decreased visibility. Shutting down the parks main attraction would cause severe headaches for capacity and guest satisfaction.

It wouldn't surprise me for the hours to be extended if/when they have more than 5 actual attractions.

Although... how fun would the safari ride be if they somehow integrated infrared goggles into the ride vehicles?

They had a nighttime safari when AK first opened. Since it was dark seeing the animals was near impossible and at the time night vision would have been prohibitively expensive. The attraction took on very different, rather environmental preachy theme. Needless to say, it was not all that well received and required an hour or two to switch over to the night time version. It was quickly discontinued.