This Old Park: Sentinel expose on maintenance

Jungle Skipper

New Member
Originally posted by OnWithTheShow
I also think that is incredibly unfair to label the cast and management as uncaring and terrible. While you will occasionally find a cast member of manager who is not up to the Disney Standard, the vast majority of the cast and management are truly caring individuals who do everything they can to embody the Disney spirit. It is unfortunate that a few bad apples are ruining the rep of the rest of us.

I agree with you there! I think in general most CMs really do care...unfortunately during my time at WDW I definately saw a disturbing trend toward apathy amongst new hires.

As for maintenance, there have been huge cutbacks...it really sucks...I remember my first few months on main st there was always work being done after hours. Even in the shops we would stay for a long time restocking, tagging, straightening up....then the schedules were cut back...Im talking by a full hour a night less work. Fewer painters out, very rarely would there be wet paint signs in the mornings when we opened. it was surreal.

The Jungle always seemed to be in disrepair too...the natives were constanly down, ginger the croc would get stuck with her mouth open all the time....it was sad.

Heres to hoping things get better soon...

Jungle Josh
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
Originally posted by Jungle Skipper
I agree with you there! I think in general most CMs really do care...unfortunately during my time at WDW I definately saw a disturbing trend toward apathy amongst new hires.


Apathy is not unique to Disney, the education system/media has made today’s western youff believe that they are owed a living and it is their right. That coupled with diminished communication and interpersonal skills is the root of the problem. Perhaps if guests could communicate by text messaging it would save having to speak:)
 

marni1971

Park History nut
Premium Member
You want to see a BAD park? Blackpool Pleasure Beach, UK. Bet it makes six flags look like DLP!

Things arn`t what they used to be at WDW, fom what i have read, but it still seems to be head and shoulders above the rest. Lets just hope the gap dosn`t narrow too much...
 

kal1484

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by cherrynegra
Yeah. The closest park to me is Six Flags Great America. After my last visit, I christened it with a new name. Six Flags Ghetto America.:lol:

I just call it H***.....:lookaroun
 

McArcDes

New Member
I wonder how many of the upper management people spend any real time in the parks. Like some one else said they probably just go to the newest biggest parts of the parks and dont spend any time just walking in the parks and watching the guests and god forbid looking at the condition of the parks seeing how they can make improvements. Walt and many of the origional imagineers did that and suggested that others do it also. Who does that now?

I remember a story about Walt and how one day he came across a secuity guard who was not smiling or even pleasant. Walt told the park managers that the security guard just did not get what Disney was all about and had him fired. Heavy handed yes but he would not compromise on the quality of his parks or any thing else Disney produced.

I know how hard it is to keep a great attitude while making very little money but it we as guests have to work for our money long and hard to afford our trips there. I have run into rude CM's and great ones. Their attitude can be helped by the managers. Someone mentioned that one manager made breakfast for the overnight crew. That is the sign of a manager that cares about their people and shows the people that he does. I do not fully accept the "we dont get paid well so we dont have to be nice" arguement but I do understand some of what they are saying. BUT.....

If I am paying $10,000 to stay at a moderate resort for 2 weeks and I had to work 16 hour days for a year before I went I expect to have a great experience and not have to go on SSE and see how run down it looks, or be treated rudely by CMs. What the heck ever happened to Disney being the best and not getting out done by anyone? There was a day when no one even came close now Disney is second or if they are lucky tied for first.....(Universal should not even be in the same league but they are giving Disney a real run for their money and winning from what I am hearing from some)

I do not believe there is any commitment to "Disney" quality left in the company. I love Disney as much as anyone else but I believe unless there is great change with in the company all of this will just get worse.

Eisner needs to go as does most of the upper management and the board of directors....bring in new blood, not other corporate fat cats....
 

Lee

Adventurer
Originally posted by GaryT977
However, isn't Anaheim pretty cool all year round? How do they keep their park fresh?

Until the recent huge increase in budget....they didn't keep it fresh.
For the last 7-8 years, Disneyland looked far worse than anything in MK, and if it wasn't for a) Matt Ouimet "getting it", and b) the 50th coming up, it would still be in bad shape.
In order to get DL up to shape they've been scratching up money from everywhere, and it's starting to really make a difference.
 

GaryT977

New Member
Originally posted by OnWithTheShow

I also think that is incredibly unfair to label the cast and management as uncaring and terrible.

As I said, cm's don't set the budget for maintenance. And despite some of the posts recently, I've yet to meet a rude cm. Even the reservations people on the phone are always a joy to deal with.

Not to beat a dead horse (it died about five pages ago, I think), the cutbacks in maintenance have become noticable, which was what that article was all about.

BTW - It's nice to hear DL is getting some attention. Maybe someone in upper management will notice the difference it's making and apply the same remedies to WDW.
 

wdwmom2+1

Active Member
This article made me and my husband sad :( how can they let theese things happen to disney, hopefully someone will take notice and maybe things will change. or is that just wishful thinking :confused:
 

prberk

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Originally posted by hoppypooh
This article and the subsequent photos and posts have just left me rather stunned. I guess I must have been wearing rose coloured glasses on my trip. It was my first time and I was struck by the beauty and magic of WDW. I certainly didn't notice any of the problems that have been mentioned. Also, all the CM's we met went above and beyond, from the lifeguard who tried to find my husband's wedding band at the bottom of the All Star Music pool to the one who helped me after a very rough experience on M:S. As a newbie, I don't know enough about the Disney Co. to make comments about their business practices - but I'm glad that the magic wasn't spoiled for me.

Welcome aboard, Hoppypooh!

I am glad you had a great time. I think some of us here, though, just do not want to see Disney decline from its world standard of excellence and attention to detail....

But welcome aboard! Let us know more about your trip and what you thought (not here though: start a new thread or contribute to one in the WDW Trip Reports area)...
 

cherrynegra

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by McArcDes
I wonder how many of the upper management people spend any real time in the parks. Like some one else said they probably just go to the newest biggest parts of the parks and dont spend any time just walking in the parks and watching the guests and god forbid looking at the condition of the parks seeing how they can make improvements. Walt and many of the origional imagineers did that and suggested that others do it also. Who does that now?


I agree completely. I definitely think they need to turn the management inside out and force all of them to walk the parks. How would they even know if their guests complaints are even correct if they don't go out there and look?? They need to walk the parks a lot more often. Heck, hire me to do it. Definitely would get a lot of exercise that way.
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
Originally posted by cherrynegra
I agree completely. I definitely think they need to turn the management inside out and force all of them to walk the parks.

When I got my first management job I had to watch all these cr@ppy training films but one always stuck in my mind. The film told the story of everyday production folk and their trials and tribulations. It showed a poor manager struggling to identify what’s going wrong and what should be done about it especially as all the things he tried didn’t work. In the end he went round the place talking to staff and watching what they did, these people were all too aware of the problems and often had solutions. By getting a complete picture he was able to draw an effective solution.

Why was it so memorable? Well the technique it proscribed was GOYA
Get Off You’re , in other words go look for yourself, its something I practice to this day.

:D :D
 

McArcDes

New Member
Originally posted by hoppypooh
don't know enough about the Disney Co. to make comments about their business practices - but I'm glad that the magic wasn't spoiled for me.

For me even though I get upset at the state of the parks and Disney company its self the magic has not been ruined. The magic is very much alive and well and stronger than ever in me. I think this is the same for many of us who point out where the company is falling down on their job. Actually I think the magic is strongest in those of us who do. That is why we point all of these things out because we want them to change and live up to the magic Walt created.

I am glad hoppypooh had a wonderful vacation. I have had many many wonderful memories of our times there as well. I just want the company to TRY and live up to Walts and our expectations.
 

cherrynegra

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Pumbas Nakasak
Well the technique it proscribed was GOYA
Get Off You’re , in other words go look for yourself, its something I practice to this day.

:D :D

Exactly!! How can you figure out problems via second and third hand accounts when you can get up off your and go see for yourself. Your post also brings up a good point. How many managers or supervisors are there in the world who have no idea what it is the people they supervise do?? And then they think they can manage from the comforts of their office. That may work with other types of industries, but not when you're running a park.
 

Lee

Adventurer
Pardon the length, but here is a message from the Cast Portal.
It's from Magic Kingdom Vice President Phil Holmes.
Enjoy:

Hello Magic Kingdom Team,
This weekend the Orlando Sentinel published a story about maintenance and upkeep at the Magic Kingdom Park. Last week in an effort to reduce the bias of the article and share how proud we are of what we do and how great we do it, Bill Warren, Vice President of Public Affairs; Trevor Larsen, Vice President of Engineering Services; and I shared our side of the story - the facts - with reporter and four editors at the Sentinel.

Knowing how important it is for you, our Cast, to have timely and accurate information, I want to take this opportunity to provide all of the facts we shared with you:

According to our guests, we're doing a great job of maintaining the Magic Kingdom Park. Recent guest satisfaction ratings are as high as they have ever been.
During a recent survey, 90 percent of guests surveyed said that the upkeep and cleanliness of the Magic Kingdom Park was either excellent or very good.
Currently, we are spending more than $100 million per year at the Magic Kingdom Park in this arena. Last year, we spent $6 million on The Crystal Palace alone to bring it back to its original luster. Other recent or pending refurbishment projects at the Magic Kingdom Park include, but are not limited to, the following:
Big Thunder Mountain was closed for renovation that included a complete repainting of the mountain. Splash Mountain also recently went through a refurbishment.
The roof of Cinderella Castle was recently repainted.
In the future, we have an extensive refurbishment planned for "it's a small world" among other projects.
A re-paving project is already underway in the Magic Kingdom parking lot.
In addition, more people are focused on maintenance and custodial work across the Walt Disney World Resort than ever before. In the area of engineering and maintenance, there are more than 5,000 cast members. This includes 650 people who are focused on horticulture and 600 painters.
More than 20 percent of our sustainment executive team worked at the Walt Disney World Resort on opening day. In addition, more than 5,000 cast members work in custodial services and housekeeping.
Something that many people don't realize is the fact that we go to extreme measures to keep our parks looking great. For example:
We don't just wash our streets -- we steam clean streets every single night.
If you were driving a 2002 automobile, and it was a Disney attraction, it would have already gone through a rebuild process involving a sand-blast and repaint and a full chassy rebuild. Every Space Mountain vehicle goes through this every two years.
We have more than 100 intricate designs for our trashcans to ensure that they match the themes of our theme parks. These trashcans have their very own refurbishment cycle to be repainted, and this is an elaborate process given the detailed designs of each and every trashcan.
We have Cast Members who have very specialized roles in maintenance. For example, there are people who are assigned to painting the antique carousel horses. They actually use gold leaf on these antique horses - which look brand new, and they go through an elaborate process to maintain the integrity of the carousel.
There is an entire checklist for each attraction with animatronics to ensure that they are keeping up to original standards -- including the color palettes and the mechanics of each animatronic figure.
We grow our own trees at a tree farm so that if a mature tree in a park needs to be replaced, we can do so with a full-grown tree that is 30 years old. We remove it and put in another full-size tree.
It is also worth noting that during a very challenging economic time following September 11, Walt Disney World preserved Cast Members' jobs and managed to continue to invest in exciting new attractions, significant refurbishments, extensive marketing campaigns and important community programs such as the Rosen School of Hospitality at the University of Central Florida and the Disney / SBA National Entrepreneur Center in downtown Orlando. These commitments made a difference to the people who live and work in our community on many levels.
Some of the attractions the Walt Disney World Resort has continued to invest in new attractions over the past three years include the following.
At the Magic Kingdom alone, we have added Mickey's PhilharMagic and launched our new "Wishes" fireworks.
Stitch's Great Escape! opens here this fall.
At Epcot, Mission: SPACE opened last year and has exceeded all expectations for guest popularity. Mission: SPACE has achieved one of the highest guest satisfaction scores of any Epcot attraction.
Magical Gatherings was launched in October 2003 and provides planning services and online tools to make it easier than ever for groups to travel together to the Walt Disney World Resort.
Disney's Pop Century Resort opened in December 2003.
Are we perfect? Of course not. Are we doing more than ever to keep the Magic Kingdom Park and the rest of the Walt Disney World Resort show ready to Guests visiting today and in the future - absolutely.

As we all know, show is one of our Four Quality Standards. It has been since our opening day in 1971 and will continue to be what sets us apart from the rest. I am inspired by the heritage and traditions we uphold each and every day to deliver an experience unlike anything else in the world. After all, we are where magic begins.

I'll see you out there!
 

Dayma

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the great post Lee.

I think this is a very positive message that is needed on this board since everyone seems to be slamming Disney. Just my opinion but I tend to belive the message since the Article referenced many things said here.
 
Most of the upper WDW management are aware to the problems and would love nothing better than to fix them. Unfortunately they have to work with the funds they are given from Burbank. Many managers at WDW are great people. Lee Cockerell (VP of Operations) frequently walks the parks and brings his grand kids as a guest. When I was at the Studios our VP (Malcolm Ross) walked the park regularly and and Typhoon Lagoon our Park Manager did the same thing. My own manager would actually come out and stand with us everytime it rained just to show he cared. I think it is extremely important for management to do walkthroughs and not just during their 9-5 hours. There is a lot of work that goes on both before and after those times and they should have a feel for their park.
 

johnvree

Member
$6 million on the Crystal Palace refurb? Whoa! Who got the job, the Dept. of Defense?

I personally am still impressed with the cleanliness when I walk around the parks and certainly the resorts. Is it perfect? No. But there are certainly a lot more people on property today than there were in the 1970s when there was only one park and three resorts.
 

Poncho1973

New Member
Originally posted by mkt
you've obviously never been told to act in a professional manner, while being expected to support a family at $6/hour

First, I want to preface this by saying that you seem like a very nice guy. Someone with a lot of knowledge and a passion for Disney in general. You used to seem so alive and well-spoken.

I have to say that you've turned into quite the BITTER BETTY since your departure from WDW... holy crap man... weren't you raised with dedication and commitment?

My grandmother used to say: "Any job, large or small, do it well or not at all."

If you are making $6/hr or $60/hr... I don't care! Do your job WELL or sit on your butt watching Springer on welfare like the rest of the people with no real urge to be a valuable part of society. Sure it's hard to support a family on minimum wage salaries... but that doesn't mean you have to be rude or hostile or even apathetic. You do your job well and you gain some sastisfaction that the family you are providing for can respect you at the end of the day and MORE IMPORTANTLY you can respect yourself.
 

Yen_Sid1

New Member
My friends work in maintenance and most of them love working for Disney. They work in Attractions Maintenance, so they know when some effects or animation is not working. They all do high quality work, when allowed to. But with all the cutbacks and the bottom line on everything and don't buy replacement parts. It is hard when you take pride in your work but upper management won't let you do your job, it is very frustrating.

It used to be if something in a ride wasn't working, they would try to repair it immediately. Now it is, just turn it off and hope no one notices it and most guests don't.

So upper management thinks if there are no guests complaints then everything is just fine maybe even better than ever. Most of them have no maintenance background. In fact, Trevor Larsen, Vice president of maintenance has only been in maintenance for 6 years. He used to be a Ride Engineer. Remember the Test Track fiasco, about it not opening on time and had so many problems and downtimes. Trevor was in charge of that.

So he decided to change to Attractions Maintenance and he was in charge of the newly opened Animal Kingdom. He tried to cut costs by closing attractions ie, Discovery River Boats, etc and greenlighting cheap rides like Dino-Rama. He did such a good job of cutting costs, they made General Manager at Magic Kingdom. After 2 years of Trevor at the helm at maintenance, cutting costs and personnel. They promoted him to Vice-President of Maintenance for all Parks and Resorts.
 

mkt

Disney's Favorite Scumbag™
Premium Member
Originally posted by Poncho1973
First, I want to preface this by saying that you seem like a very nice guy. Someone with a lot of knowledge and a passion for Disney in general.

which is why it is very hard to come up with a reply for this, since you've just said praises for me, and I have nothing against you.


Originally posted by Poncho1973
You used to seem so alive and well-spoken.

I still am, but my passion in life is no longer Disney. While I still love Disney, and will continue to do so, I have changed.


Originally posted by Poncho1973
I have to say that you've turned into quite the BITTER BETTY since your departure from WDW... holy crap man... weren't you raised with dedication and commitment?

I was raised with dedication and commitment. And I also was never screwed over by an organization that I dedicated myself to so much. But that's another story altogether that can be continued via IM or PM.


Originally posted by Poncho1973
My grandmother used to say: "Any job, large or small, do it well or not at all."

ditto... but in Spanish


Originally posted by Poncho1973
If you are making $6/hr or $60/hr... I don't care! Do your job WELL or sit on your butt watching Springer on welfare like the rest of the people with no real urge to be a valuable part of society. Sure it's hard to support a family on minimum wage salaries... but that doesn't mean you have to be rude or hostile or even apathetic. You do your job well and you gain some sastisfaction that the family you are providing for can respect you at the end of the day and MORE IMPORTANTLY you can respect yourself.

now now now... I'm not that bad.
 

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