Rumor New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[RamblinWreck]

That’s where Len’s team of number crunchers came in. From observation of the blue light entries plus those that followed w/o tapping in, they determined that around 70% of guests using the LL lane were DAS users and their parties. Now this was for a popular but not top tier ride (HM I think).

And apparently that agrees with conversations he’s had.

I don’t think this description is accurate.

He said he wasn’t looking at light colors.

Also, there’s no such thing as someone entering a LL without tapping in.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I don’t think this description is accurate.

He said he wasn’t looking at light colors.

Also, there’s no such thing as someone entering a LL without tapping in.

Correct me if I’m wrong but the only way to know is by “guessing” if they are DAS correct? Which is honestly kinda creepy to me.

 

[RamblinWreck]

Correct me if I’m wrong but the only way to know is by “guessing” if they are DAS correct? Which is honestly kinda creepy to me.

No, it was strictly based on the number of people entering the LL queue

The entire estimate hinged on how many G+ reservations they thought Disney was distributing for the ride per hour. And the reason for estimating 300 was not given.

 

[Brian]

Correct me if I’m wrong but the only way to know is by “guessing” if they are DAS correct? Which is honestly kinda creepy to me.

The enrolled DAS guest must tap in before anyone else in their party. It turns blue regardless of whether they have a valid entitlement or not. If it is valid, the CM sees the guest's name and picture on screen and has to tap the screen to admit the enrolled guest. It then turns green, and any other members of that guest's party can now tap in and they will turn green without intervention.

By observing the interactions between guests in the line to scan, you can ascertain which guests are together, and then use that information to make a fairly accurate estimate of how many DAS guests there are versus Genie+/ILL.

 

[nickys]

I obviously misunderstood then.

BUT the reality is that for whatever reason, Disney thinks DAS is unsustainable in it’s current form. Debating the why and how will be an endless endeavour.

What really matters is what happens next. And from reports nothing will change until May 20th. Up until then it seems they aren’t changing anything.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

That’s where Len’s team of number crunchers came in. From observation of the blue light entries plus those that followed w/o tapping in, they determined that around 70% of guests using the LL lane were DAS users and their parties. Now this was for a popular but not top tier ride (HM I think).

And apparently that agrees with conversations he’s had.

Correct…I was quoting him without quoting him (I don’t want to get sued or let him think I’m a sleeper agent for Birnbaums )

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yeah, unless you knew and did the planning FP+ sucked. But if you knew it was nice. 180/60 day planning was ridiculous though.

I agree with everything you said except the last few. G+ from my experience is like playing a slot machine version of bop it that if I mess up I will ruin the day. Not to mention trying to do it on your phone using a browser that seems like it is from 2000 in a cave. Slow, unstable web pages that you hope load and give you the results you want.

To counter your “abuse” point on though, If you contact Disney and say what accommodation can you make for me, this is my situation, and they offer DAS, I fail to see how thats abuse. Do you need all day every park LL? Maybe not but if they come back and say this is the only thing we offer not sure that’s on you. If you are calling in and claiming you have some hidden problem and you don’t, f you, but if you need accommodation I personally think that is ok.

But, if they say this is how we are going to accommodate you now since we had to many DAS users, that’s should be fine as long as the accommodation allows you reasonable access. I don’t get the vitriol on both sides of this who blame DAS for all the ills of line waits or those who won’t be able to go to Disney without DAS without knowing what the new system will be for them.

I think “abuse” is harsh and there’s a different label/category for the use.

Getting DAS when you can use the queues out of convenience or to avoid fees is straight up abuse…full stop.

Qualified use is not “abuse”…but it’s an operational problem because having VQ access on all rides allows the user to then use other standby or short wait rides during the queue - which is not how say guardians or tron works. That’s a virtual wait to ENTER the queue and why it’s a boarding group.
So going on other things during the DAS wait puts more strain on the rest of the system…lengthens the queues and makes others change habits and choices.
But it’s not “abuse”…just a bad side effect of the system.

If every one ate or shopped during their DAS wait…this wouldn’t be a problem. Obviously that isn’t whats happening.

But again…it’s all due to capacity they have not provided…
Spent 12 years tweaking prices on a daily basis when they could have built enough B-C-D to solve most of the problem

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I obviously misunderstood then.

BUT the reality is that for whatever reason, Disney thinks DAS is unsustainable in it’s current form. Debating the why and how will be an endless endeavour.

What really matters is what happens next. And from reports nothing will change until May 20th. Up until then it seems they aren’t changing anything.

Correct…but saying “until then” is 23 days away…so the discussion isn’t hypothetical at this point.

The problem with this thread is it became yet another battle line and people are way to hyperbolic. It breeds suspicion and mistrust.

 

[Happyday]

That’s where Len’s team of number crunchers came in. From observation of the blue light entries plus those that followed w/o tapping in, they determined that around 70% of guests using the LL lane were DAS users and their parties. Now this was for a popular but not top tier ride (HM I think).

And apparently that agrees with conversations he’s had.

I am confused,when we used DAS everyone that traveled with the DAS individual also had to scan in so I would think they would have some numbers to run on this.
That being said I have a feeling they do and that is part of the reason for some of the changes.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Qualified use is not “abuse”…but it’s an operational problem because having VQ access on all rides allows the user to then use other standby or short wait rides during the queue - which is not how say guardians or tron works. That’s a virtual wait to ENTER the queue and why it’s a boarding group.
So going on other things during the DAS wait puts more strain on the rest of the system…lengthens the queues and makes others change habits and choices.
But it’s not “abuse”…just a bad side effect of the system.

But the discussion has been that the problem is the lightning lane use, not the standby use while waiting for the lightning lane (aside from that being an incentive for people to actually abuse and lie to get the DAS). The discussion hasn't centered, nor has the data centered, on DAS users causing a problem when entering short standby queues while they wait for their DAS return.

 

[Happyday]

ILL usage was being estimated as high as 75% of the total usage also

Something isn’t right

I think they are including the people that join with the DAS individual. They were allowed up to 6 guests and from what I have read here that was just a "suggestion" CM were given the ability to 'over ride' that #

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

And the reason for estimating 300 was not given.

Insider information about how many g+ reservations are allocated every 5 minutes.

 

[ditzee]

I obviously misunderstood then.

BUT the reality is that for whatever reason, Disney thinks DAS is unsustainable in it’s current form. Debating the why and how will be an endless endeavour.

What really matters is what happens next. And from reports nothing will change until May 20th. Up until then it seems they aren’t changing anything.

The DAS CM told me today when I was registering, that nothing will be released until May 20th. Don't know who would have insider info to share, so I'm going with what I was told.

 

[Vacationeer]

40% of guests don't didn't have DAS, but I think 40% of guests were utilizing DAS with the up to 6x party multiplier. So if 8-10 percent were granted DAS, the average party size including the individual requiring accommodation was 4-5 people.

Does it go further than just the ratio of guests? The percent DAS/nonDAS in any given line is also impacted by how many attractions are attempted through each group on average. Maybe a math wiz can help here.

Example (not real data) - say 30% of park guests on average are linked to a DAS pass (8% are holders with avg 3ppl also attached). On average this group is also accomplishing 25% more lined attractions than their counterparts. The result could be that this 30% of guests is making up closer to 40% of an average line.

I understand guests with more severe disabilities commonly do a below average amount of lined attractions with their party vs the average guest. But there are also many common conditions where a DAS party was not limited differently than average nonDAS standby group. Some people are limited; what ratio are not limited? This is not to compare to most aggressive able-bodied/minded guests going commando through the park, rather the limits of just typical average guests that cannot burn the candle at both ends. What is the difference in how they can maximize the park vs not limited DAS party? Who is averaging more and why. What affects are these groups having on each other. Etc.

When Genie+ was released Oct 2021, DAS went digital through MDE. Improved data. Now more than ever they are seeing who is going where and all the favorable things attached to those accounts. When I think about what was added to DAS in late 2021, the ease of requesting return times digitally and pre-registering from home for 2 pre-selects encouraged guests to accept giving WDW more data and more accurate data.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I am confused,when we used DAS everyone that traveled with the DAS individual also had to scan in so I would think they would have some numbers to run on this.
That being said I have a feeling they do and that is part of the reason for some of the changes.

If I’m not mistaken…the 8-10% number is the total being granted DAS…but the larger balloon number is due to their “travel with” parties that increase on a 2x/3x/4x/5x factor…

And also if the CMs are just worn out (and little doubt they are) and letting “whoever” through on a bypass? That would really wreck it

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

But the discussion has been that the problem is the lightning lane use, not the standby use while waiting for the lightning lane (aside from that being an incentive for people to actually abuse and lie to get the DAS). The discussion hasn't centered, nor has the data centered, on DAS users causing a problem when entering short standby queues while they wait for their DAS return.

The standby lines are beholden to lightning lane…an unfortunate holdover from plus…

So any alteration of the patterns based on LL numbers in DAS creates a cascade effect that affects the whole park capacity and traffic flow.
The discussion wasn’t about using shorter lines and making them longer in the virtual…but it should be in part because that’s a trickle down effect too.

If there’s a 90 minute on mine train and the party goes on Pooh at 45 minutes and haunted mansion at 30 minutes…that spot on mine train is still being factored into the computer and accounted for lengthening the standby…and the other lines as well.

 

[Happyday]

If I’m not mistaken…the 8-10% number is the total being granted DAS…but the larger balloon number is due to their “travel with” parties that increase on a 2x/3x/4x/5x factor…

And also if the CMs are just worn out (and little doubt they are) and letting “whoever” through on a bypass? That would really wreck it

Exactly, that's why I think they should have some numbers unless what you said about CM's being burnt out dealing with rude guests (definitely not going to be surprised and in a way don't blame them)

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think they are including the people that join with the DAS individual. They were allowed up to 6 guests and from what I have read here that was just a "suggestion" CM were given the ability to 'over ride' that #

They are…and it’s a problem
For a couple of people in this scenario

 

[Happyday]

there’s a 90 minute on mine train and the party goes on Pooh at 45 minutes and haunted mansion at 30 minutes…that spot on mine train is still being factored into the computer and accounted for lengthening the standby…and the other lines as well.

I know this is just an example but... if this were true they really don't need DAS We wouldn't be able to do anything over 10 minutes

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I know this is just an example but... if this were true they really don't need DAS We wouldn't be able to do anything over 10 minutes

Obviously the legitimate need users of DAS would likely not be able to pull that off.

But the inference here from
Disney is that it’s it’s the outright abusers and “borderline” cases that could do it.

And yes…before someone whines it’s ALSO about money…but in a rare case - I kinda agree with Disney there too.