Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[hopemax]

Especially against a backdrop of recognition of two realities. Housing starts post financial crisis was too restricted. Off-shoring has strategic and supply chain downsides. Construction and manufacturing are the backbone and unlike other times in history are shifting domestically instead of abroad. It won’t have to be a massive shift, and the US and their allies suddenly need to replenish and upgrade their war closets and the raw material production to do so. Lots of things happening that ultimately need humans to produce physical, less discretionary goods. This is a transformative period. There will be friction, but it doesn’t mean recessionary.

 

[wannabeBelle]

Looks like the NY Post is in on the game too: https://nypost.com/2023/10/26/business/how-the-rich-spend-40k-on-a-week-at-disney/ Marie

 

[eliza61nyc]

Looks like the NY Post is in on the game too: https://nypost.com/2023/10/26/business/how-the-rich-spend-40k-on-a-week-at-disney/ Marie

Nah, the post just cut and pasted the bloomberg article. cheap reporting.

Generally I hate "sensationalism" in reporting. If someone is dropping 40K on any vacation and rolling the way they did in that article, they ain't worried about money much.

but I agree with a lot of the points in the article.

and I would have smothered the "old guy" with a pillow in his sleep if he told me he raided the retirement account to do anything.

 

[Lilofan]

I keep expecting to see more news about a coming recession (us and globally), but either I'm not looking in the right places or a lot of ppl are just not seeing it. (Now, admittedly, those ppl are likely WAY more versed in these things and smarter than I.) I would love to think it isn't coming, but with how much costs for almost everything has gone up in these post-COVID years (and before, honestly), without a corresponding increase in net incomes, I just don't see how consumer spending can maintain at this rate. And beyond that, being Gen X, I'm VERY much looking forward to retirement, which we have actively been saving for over the last 25+ years. That retirement will hopefully include trips to WDW, but if pricing continues to increase as it has over the last 5-10 years, those trips will be few and far between.

Recession not for some... A relative not happy with his previous job interviewed and received several offers. These companies were looking for able bodied to actually come to work instead of this remote crap that mostly did not exist pre 2020. He accepted an offer and is currently commuting to work.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I keep expecting to see more news about a coming recession (us and globally), but either I'm not looking in the right places or a lot of ppl are just not seeing it. (Now, admittedly, those ppl are likely WAY more versed in these things and smarter than I.) I would love to think it isn't coming, but with how much costs for almost everything has gone up in these post-COVID years (and before, honestly), without a corresponding increase in net incomes, I just don't see how consumer spending can maintain at this rate. And beyond that, being Gen X, I'm VERY much looking forward to retirement, which we have actively been saving for over the last 25+ years. That retirement will hopefully include trips to WDW, but if pricing continues to increase as it has over the last 5-10 years, those trips will be few and far between.

What has always been true is that for folks with money there is no such thing as recession or inflation.

Bob loves the folks with money.

 

[wannabeBelle]

Recession not for some... A relative not happy with his previous job interviewed and received several offers. These companies were looking for able bodied to actually come to work instead of this remote crap that some want to remain forever. He accepted an offer and is currently commuting to work.

A relative's office that I know went full remote during the COVID thing and has stayed that way. That having been said most companies that I have heard of are doing some form of a hybrid, a certain number of days in the office per week, and a certain number working remotely. There are still some that are doing full time in the office. I think it depends on the business. In any event, I hope your relative loves his new position! Marie

 

[Lilofan]

A relative's office that I know went full remote during the COVID thing and has stayed that way. That having been said most companies that I have heard of are doing some form of a hybrid, a certain number of days in the office per week, and a certain number working remotely. There are still some that are doing full time in the office. I think it depends on the business. In any event, I hope your relative loves his new position! Marie

Thanks he was pleasantly surprised a number of companies are actively hiring potential staff to actually come to work in the office.

 

[madmartigan]

I understand the strategy of wanting to offset losses in streaming and movies and declining revenue in broadcast televion, but what's crazy to me is that the price gouging at the parks is endangering the disney flywheel. I'm less enamored with the Disney brand overall (toys, movies, parks, etc.) because of what has felt like opportunitistic and excessive pricing at the parks.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Nah, the post just cut and pasted the bloomberg article. cheap reporting.

Generally I hate "sensationalism" in reporting. If someone is dropping 40K on any vacation and rolling the way they did in that article, they ain't worried about money much.

but I agree with a lot of the points in the article.

and I would have smothered the "old guy" with a pillow in his sleep if he told me he raided the retirement account to do anything.

Yeah, if someone can easily afford 40k on a vacation - be it to Disney or wherever - it is what it is

I am more flabbergasted by the reporting of the person who took $5k out of his 401k just so he could spend $17k on the Disney trip vs 12k. Like that mindset is fascination - and a bit scary - to me

 

[LudwigVonDrake]

I just came back from a week at Universal. They gave me a buy three get two free days in the parks. We were there from Tuesday through Sunday and the crowds were not busy until the weekend so maybe both companies are suffering a decline?

 

[el_super]

The scary part is these declines are just the beginning.

Things are going to get much much worse.

Call us when the sky has actually fallen...

Yeah, if someone can easily afford 40k on a vacation - be it to Disney or wherever - it is what it is

I am more flabbergasted by the reporting of the person who took $5k out of his 401k just so he could spend $17k on the Disney trip vs 12k. Like that mindset is fascination - and a bit scary - to me

It's not smart, but I can understand it to a degree. People keep forgetting what Disney is for a lot of people. It's not just a theme park with rides, but a place that people go with their families. When you look at the opportunity to take a once-in-a-lifetime family trip, what you are really paying for are memories. You're paying for photos on the walls of your house and good stories to tell at Thanksgivings for years to come. You get wrapped up in knowing that your kids can never stay the same age forever and you want to hold onto those memories as best you can.

Yet people here keep thinking the value of a trip to WDW is really in the cost of Genie+ and how many rides you can get done in one day. It's not.

 

[Drdcm]

Thank god those kids got to go to Disney. I mean, mom and dad are going to be living with them once he’s spent all his 401k on those mickey pretzels and magic bands he has to have.

 

[Disstevefan1]

So attendance is down? So its just MOBBED at the parks and not SUPER MOBBED now?

 

[HauntedPirate]

Thank god those kids got to go to Disney. I mean, mom and dad are going to be living with them once he’s spent all his 401k on those mickey pretzels and magic bands he has to have.

And they can decorate the walls with the magic bands and the photo's they had to pay to print from their $99 $119 PhotoPass.

 

[Drdcm]

So attendance is down? So its just MOBBED at the parks and not SUPER MOBBED now?

No no no no no. You’ve got it all wrong. You’re focused on the crowds. You have to focus on “value”. The “value” clearly hasn’t changed at all - thus everyone is still going. Especially those pesky hard to get hotel rooms.

So, to answer your question, the level of MOB is irrelevant.

 

[Grimley1968]

It's not smart, but I can understand it to a degree. People keep forgetting what Disney is for a lot of people. It's not just a theme park with rides, but a place that people go with their families. When you look at the opportunity to take a once-in-a-lifetime family trip, what you are really paying for are memories. You're paying for photos on the walls of your house and good stories to tell at Thanksgivings for years to come. You get wrapped up in knowing that your kids can never stay the same age forever and you want to hold onto those memories as best you can.

That's a pretty good description of how I used to feel about WDW. Disney has squandered a lot of this nostalgia many people felt with their recent decisions. I think the linked articles and many of the posts in this thread have shown that.

When the great enjoyment ended for us, nostalgia alone kept us coming from about 2012 to 2020. But even that considerable factor isn't enough to overcome our distaste with what a WDW vacation has become since about 2012 to return, until we see some fundamental changes.

 

[Trauma]

Call us when the sky has actually fallen...

Like when they lose 60 percent of Market Cap in 2 years?

Maybe when they have to fire the current CEO during a Elton John concert in emergency fashion?

How about when they show weakness in almost every segment of the business ?

Even one of the best performing sectors Parks and Resorts has a massive alarm going off.

15% decrease in attendance ??

Don’t feed me the bs about increased guest spending making up for it.

That is not sustainable.

The entire country is hitting record levels of debt and uncontrolled spending on non essential items can not continue to ramp forever.

 

[Drdcm]

Like when they lose 60 percent of Market Cap in 2 years?

Maybe when they have to fire the current CEO during a Elton John concert in emergency fashion?

How about when they show weakness in almost every segment of the business ?

Even one of the best performing sectors Parks and Resorts has a massive alarm going off.

15% decrease in attendance ??

Don’t feed me the bs about increased guest spending making up for it.

That is not sustainable.

The entire country is hitting record levels of debt and uncontrolled spending on non essential items can not continue to ramp forever.

It’s not worth it… You gotta be hit by the train even after you’ve heard the horn to realize the train was coming.

 

[Lilofan]

No no no no no. You’ve got it all wrong. You’re focused on the crowds. You have to focus on “value”. The “value” clearly hasn’t changed at all - thus everyone is still going. Especially those pesky hard to get hotel rooms.

So, to answer your question, the level of MOB is irrelevant.

When one has to stand in line for approx 45 min a few weeks ago at 4am at MCO with thousands of others to clear TSA at Terminal A , one knows Central FL is busy. One cheap way of not paying for a hotel room was when we saw many travelers sleeping on the floor and every couch at the Main Terminal at MCO.

 

[Drdcm]

When one has to stand in line for approx 45 min a few weeks ago at 4am at MCO with thousands of others to clear TSA at Terminal A , one knows Central FL is busy.

That’s wild