Fix or replace the monorail

[LAKid53]

My first point was more in reference to those that are arguing that TWDC/TDO is likely to remove the monorails. The company just spent a chunk, no doubt, to implement the automation upgrades across the entire system. While the automation system clearly still needs to be fine-tuned, that's a major investment to undertake for a transportation system that you're going to just throw away.

My second point (as they were intended to be distinct - I was clear as mud, in retrospect) was that maintenance seems to be improving.

Lastly, unfortunately, you are correct that a true reinvestment to fully refurbish the system is indeed what's needed, but very unlikely to happen. They will do what is required to keep the system safe and operational (albeit with downtime), but nothing more.

And what a shame. How many municipalities wouldn't love to have an overhead, quiet mass transit system. Disney really needs to view the monorail as a mass transit system that's cool, rather than a cool ride that moves lots of people....

And before you say, "but they do", stop and think how many large municipalities would let one of their major thoroughfares get to this point (other than for lack of $$).

 

[s8film40]

Because a property wide monorail system would be on the scale of $30-50 BILLION dollars.

This number is astronomically incorrect. The Bombardier system they just did for Brazil was right around $1.5 Billion. It includes 54 seven car trains, 15 miles of track and 17 stations. That in itself would be a very substantial WDW monorail expansion and probably enough to cover most of the remaining property. Taking those numbers and the cost, $40 Billion (the middle of your range) would cover 1,436 seven car trains (10,052 individual cars!), around 400 miles of track and more 450 stations.

 

[Kamikaze]

It doesn't have to be done all at once. The federal interstate highway system took decades to complete. My part of Florida didn't get I-10 until the mid 70s.

It wouldn't. It would take them probably 20 years.

 

[MrHappy]

Considering an, what appeared to be, extended and enhanced monorail loop through epcot is in the blue sky future world drawing, and they hired a new transportation chief, I'm hoping the monorail system will be pleasantly maintained and enhanced in the next few years.

EDITED for grammar...stupid phone.

 

[EOD K9]

But you still have the space inside...and abandoned tracks.

TDWC can easily shift budget around in their divisions - just would need board approval.

They'll build a platform over the tracks and you can now dine above the Grand Canyon Concourse. It'll be a great new restaurant concept. It'll be huuuge.

 

[LAKid53]

They'll build a platform over the tracks and you can now dine above the Grand Canyon Concourse. It'll be a great new restaurant concept. It'll be huuuge.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Open the seal on their collective wallet!? Are you out of your Vulcan mind?

Where do you think the money comes from for things like NFL, Pandora, and Star Wars? It's not coming from their wallet. Remember - "Cost containment", "profit margin", and "increase per guest spending" are the only words they understand.

 

[Kamikaze]

This number is astronomically incorrect. The Bombardier system they just did for Brazil was right around $1.5 Billion. It includes 54 seven car trains, 15 miles of track and 17 stations. That in itself would be a very substantial WDW monorail expansion and probably enough to cover most of the remaining property. Taking those numbers and the cost, $40 Billion (the middle of your range) would cover 1,436 seven car trains (10,052 individual cars!), around 400 miles of track and more 450 stations.

You're saying its $100m/mile. (1.5b/15). Fine. A complete monorail system for the entire property would be at least 50 miles of track.

However - using $100m/mile, that means the Skyliner system would only cost $300m. You're saying they could have the gondolas for $200m or a monorail for $300m? No way. You have to inflate the cost because its Disney. Lets say $150million/mile. Add on tons of trains and stations and the number creeps up. Figuring out a project's cost isn't as simple as just multiplying.

Theres also the little problem that the monorail is not the most efficient way to move guests using the WDW traffic flow.

 

[LAKid53]

Where do you think the money comes from for things like NFL, Pandora, and Star Wars? It's not coming from their wallet. Remember - "Cost containment", "profit margin", and "increase per guest spending" are the only words they understand.

Reserves, borrowing, equity increases.

 

[Monorail Lime]

They'll build a platform over the tracks and you can now dine above the Grand Canyon Concourse. It'll be a great new restaurant concept. It'll be huuuge.

It even has a fireworks view! Truly a Premium offering that guests will love! $$$

 

[s8film40]

You're saying its $100m/mile. (1.5b/15). Fine. A complete monorail system for the entire property would be at least 50 miles of track.

However - using $100m/mile, that means the Skyliner system would only cost $300m. You're saying they could have the gondolas for $200m or a monorail for $300m? No way. You have to inflate the cost because its Disney. Lets say $150million/mile. Add on tons of trains and stations and the number creeps up. Figuring out a project's cost isn't as simple as just multiplying.

Theres also the little problem that the monorail is not the most efficient way to move guests using the WDW traffic flow.

Fist of all if you're discussing the cost of monorails as a cost per mile you simply don't understand the way transit systems work. It's not like they walk into the Bombardier store and some guy says "hey we're running a special $100 Million a mile and buy ten miles or more and stations and trains are included". These systems have to be well planned out stations have to be planed based on need and the number of trains can vary based on the service needed. They simply don't price these per mile. Putting all that aside the Brazil line included dual beamway track so that's 15 miles each way (30 miles of track total). Additionally 50 miles of track for WDW is insane!

 

[flynnibus]

Money collected from dvc dues must stay within dvc.

Yes and no... DVC dues must meet the standard that they are collected for the operation and upkeep of the property the owners are leasing.. that doesn't preclude Disney from ultimately pocketing money from those dues... by being the vendor selling services to the DVC property management. Disney can make a profit selling to it's subsidiaries.. including DVC property management. So in effect, Disney can still make money for 'big disney' from DVC dues. It's just not a piggy bank.

 

[WildRide]

Abandoned monorail beams would be an eyesore - and hazard - no one would miss.

I just don't get it. Everyone's trying to reduce their carbon footprint. Disney built a small solar farm, for goodness sakes. Why not upgrade the monorail, expanding it through the property and reduce the number of desiel exhaust genetating buses on the roads?

1. Cost and upkeep are insane for anything rail compared to a bus or gondola, or Uber style transportation. The only places in the country building trolleys and new rail projects since 1900 are places getting federal funding for feel good green projects. In the case of WDW, there isn't even a fee for riding to help sustain the overhead costs.

2. Forward progress and desire (to loosely reference another attraction), is pushing our society towards flexible transportation. In the era of Uber, the desire for static transportation becomes less and less appealing (even in a place like WDW with common theme park destinations). Getting from Coronado to the California Grille for dinner is a pain. The gondola is the compromise solution allowing static transportation for cheap.

 

[WildRide]

That all being said, I love the monorail for its nostalgia. It would hurt to lose it!

 

[Figment2005]

So I was going to the Magic Kingdom from the TTC and we took monorail lime I think and we sat in the 2nd car... First off, The A/C was broken the whole ride but not only that the car kept making these cracking sounds and was dirty as hell! Someone needs to do something about the monorails... I also heard there was a monorail beam crack somewhere by the Grand Floridan... Is there any news or rumors if they are fixing or replacing the monorails and tracks anytime soon? (They are in very poor conditions and are in need of being replaced)

This section of beam has been fixed for about a week now. Its on the resort side of the MK Station. However, thank you for starting yet another "complain about the monorail" thread.

 

[LAKid53]

1. Cost and upkeep are insane for anything rail compared to a bus or gondola, or Uber style transportation. The only places in the country building trolleys and new rail projects since 1900 are places getting federal funding for feel good green projects. In the case of WDW, there isn't even a fee for riding to help sustain the overhead costs.

2. Forward progress and desire (to loosely reference another attraction), is pushing our society towards flexible transportation. In the era of Uber, the desire for static transportation becomes less and less appealing (even in a place like WDW with common theme park destinations). Getting from Coronado to the California Grille for dinner is a pain. The gondola is the compromise solution allowing static transportation for cheap.

I thought the gondola system was going to connect the resorts on that side of the property to AK and Epcot. So you'd still have to switch from Gondola to Epcot monorail to resort monorail. I'm taking the Minnie van....

 

[peter11435]

Yes and no... DVC dues must meet the standard that they are collected for the operation and upkeep of the property the owners are leasing.. that doesn't preclude Disney from ultimately pocketing money from those dues... by being the vendor selling services to the DVC property management. Disney can make a profit selling to it's subsidiaries.. including DVC property management. So in effect, Disney can still make money for 'big disney' from DVC dues. It's just not a piggy bank.

A very good point. WDI, Disney Design Group, BVCC and several other Disney entities are profiting off of DVC dues.

 

[LAKid53]

A very good point. WDI, Disney Design Group, BVCC and several other Disney entities are profiting off of DVC dues.

Forgot about BVCC. Disney truly is a monopoly in its 27,000 acre kingdom..

 

[ford91exploder]

Yes and no... DVC dues must meet the standard that they are collected for the operation and upkeep of the property the owners are leasing.. that doesn't preclude Disney from ultimately pocketing money from those dues... by being the vendor selling services to the DVC property management. Disney can make a profit selling to it's subsidiaries.. including DVC property management. So in effect, Disney can still make money for 'big disney' from DVC dues. It's just not a piggy bank.

It sure feels like DVC is a piggy bank every time dues go up and maintenance cut back

 

[asianway]

Yes and no... DVC dues must meet the standard that they are collected for the operation and upkeep of the property the owners are leasing.. that doesn't preclude Disney from ultimately pocketing money from those dues... by being the vendor selling services to the DVC property management. Disney can make a profit selling to it's subsidiaries.. including DVC property management. So in effect, Disney can still make money for 'big disney' from DVC dues. It's just not a piggy bank.

And considering they have 3 DVC resorts which now chip in to pay for monorail operations, the pill would not be quite so large to swallow.