News Disney plans to accelerate Parks investment to $60 billion over 10 years

tpoly88

Well-Known Member
You're conflating two things.

1. "whatever amount people would like to believe is going to be spent" shows a skepticism that money won't be spent either in part or in whole. Insiders have told us that in some cases they know of, in which it seems money was cut, the fact is that the money was spent in full, only that some of the things had cost overruns leaving not enough money to do all the things they had hoped to do. All the money was spent, but we got less than than we hoped for from it. Which leads to your second point...

2. "...is going to be spent wisely" goes to your point that there are indeed cost overruns. Was the scope of the build too big? Were the estimates the result of gross incompetence? Was the supervision of the construction grossly incompetent? I certainly don't know what the cause of the systemic cost overruns are. But I acknowledge they exist.

So, when people moan that they doubt the full $60B will be spent -- despite showing up in a plenitude of SEC filings and mentioned by many execs over and over doubling down on it really happening -- by implying that Disney will secretly not spend that much... that's just uncalled for. It's point-scoring against Disney for whatever reason they have for point-scoring. Billions have been spent over the past decade, and so that kind of skepticism rings hollow. Very, very, very hollow.

However, if they want to make the point that the $60B isn't going to buy us all the stuff they say (which, by the way, is very little so far... we have a bunch of insiders relaying a lot of wishes and hopes, but that's not official Disney); then that is indeed borne out by history of cost overruns. Which is a worthy critique to lob at Disney.
Agree with you. Spending money- The issue is infrastructure costs money and the $60billion will be spent but not all of it on rides and other attractions as we would probably like. There are behind the scenes costs for maintenance, plumbing, new wiring and such for existing buildings and structures. Plus everyone forgets that fuel prices are up 50% since 2020! Diesel which is used to transport most of the goods and materials used at one point was on avg $5.20 a gallon and in other spots higher. that all goes into costs for everything. We also at one point hit 9% inflation in 21'-22' and that cost is still trickling through the economy. Money will be spent, its just you're going to get a lot less for your dollar now.
On the money spent wisely... Glad for the new rides the last couple years but they do need to spend on rides and attractions that can soak up capacity like PotC can or soarin. A lot of the new rides dont have large capacity per hour, Slinky Dog is a great example. the new rides in Tokyo look cool, hope a couple of those come this way.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Not Tokyo. I was watching a video on the new fantasy springs, and they put 4 rides in. Sure I wouldn't call them eTickets, but frozen, tangled and pan all look pretty impressive for dark rides.
It’s quite impressive…

The only things going in here in Los Estados unidos comparable are in Orlando…

Guess where?
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Honestly I think a lot of the haters on this board have been screaming the same thing. Feels like a win/win. It can be done pretty cheap and fast, but will absolutely help with the crowds all over the park while giving people other things to do.
Fast no, but the ones who live and work in the high stress rat race Northeast don't live and work in the slower paced laid back South.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I was there last week - it was pretty busy all of the times I walked by it. We walked through it twice, thought it was a lot of fun.

An E ticket it is not. It's a really nice B ticket that draws people in. Never overly crowded but still busy. The parks need more of those experiences.
I don’t disagree. That is the wrong thing in the wrong spot…but the parks DO need a lot of that type.

What the issue is they are embarsssing themselves a bit. You build it and open it. Period

Years…WDI web featurettes, dvc mag writeups, build up and announcements.

It’s not laughable…until you do that.

A pitcher has to vary his pitches or he’ll get knocked around and booed off the mound.
 

monothingie

I'm both Crunchy and Delicious!
Premium Member
…I made it too easy, didn’t I?
1715804948695.png
 

Gringrinngghost

Well-Known Member
I’m back with today’s installment of why Disney is not concerned about Epic Universe and why I agree with them.

First and foremost, Disney, such as NBC Universal did with Epic Universe, would not haphazardly announce any significant projects, such as a new park, in an investor call. They would want to make a spectacle out of it, and in this game, spectacle wins. That is why it’s unlikely to see any proper response to the new park until after it opens to take the oxygen out of the room., especially a fifth gate.

Now, with the pleasantries aside, let me explain. People don’t seem to realize that when Iger says that the company isn’t concerned about Epic, it is because they weren’t caught with their pants down. Epic Universe was by far very much telegraphed since they owned all that property before Vivendi sold it when they were fiscally hurting and when the park was on one of its many close calls of bankruptcy in 2003.

So, this move was entirely telegraphed. The end game for Universal is to buy back all the land so they can own I-Drive. I recall having these discussions at Bayside Diner before a media event two years before Epic Universe was announced. A little fun bonus fact: Epic Universe was originally called Universal’s Fantastic Worlds, with Universal’s Epic Universe being planned for the overarching property moniker, but as we are all aware, Warner Bros. at the time sued them to prohibit the name. Mind you as well; we did see a Fantastic Worlds logo in 2018 on a slide that said “Universal Orlando Resort - The Next Step,” with their plans that were leaked nearly nine months before the official announcement on August 1st, 2019 – with the name originally being trademarked in June of 2018.
Universal Studios Fourth Park - Name.jpg


So, the Walt Disney Company and many of the industry insiders had known about Epic Universe over a year before Universal had even announced it and what was expected. And I can assure you that Disney has been planning their rebuttals for years. Has anyone ever wondered why they had started gaging guests' interest with the blue sky concepts at D23? Or why do we have yet to present a blue sky concept in this setting that was not specifically for Orlando? Disney is playing the long game, and they have the benefit of doing it all in a clandestine nature since they won’t have to acquire land for it.

Now, I am sure someone will say that I am hitting the copium hard, but that isn’t the case. Nobody flipped out to this scale when Universal announced Volcano Bay, but suddenly, a new theme park came into Orlando, and now it’s a problem. Disney’s bread and butter down here is Magic Kingdom, which will very likely expand with the Beyond Frontierland concept because the park has an issue with insufficient capacity. Animal Kingdom is also still a half-day park, and Pandora didn’t alleviate that concern, nor does it have nightly entertainment. So, they plan to fix these two before moving to a fifth gate.

Moving forward to Universal Orlando, by 2027, Universal Studios Florida should look like the middle of Epcot with the amount of walls. The attractions on the short list of being removed soon are Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It, Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, The Simpsons Ride (and all of Springfield), and Men in Black: Alien Attack. Simpson’s contract is rapidly approaching its close by 2027, and the Ride system is original to the park as it hasn’t changed in 30+ years. It’s expected that when The Simpsons closes, Springfield/Fast Food Blvd to the arena that they now use for Nightmare Fuel at Halloween Horror Nights will be finally redone, including Men in Black. Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It is expected to close as early as Q1 of 2025 due to many factors, including the sheer cost of money they've sunk into the ride. El Toro Ryan discusses about the issues with the ride here.


Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, its closure I don’t immediately have a timetable for, but it anticipated that Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It would be replaced with a new rollercoaster that would possibly be Fast in the Furious themed. There have been talks of replacing the current Fast in the Furious building with a Rollercoaster à la Penguin Trek at SeaWorld Orlando. Universal still has the Lost Continent in Islands of Adventure, which badly needs to be redone and has been abandoned. They also made a poor attempt at removing Poseidon’s Fury signage; they only covered up Poseidon’s Fury but never covered up the tagline “Escape from the Lost City.” This does not go into other general improvements they need to make, which will be happening down the line.

2024-05-15 20_24_42-Universal's Islands of Adventure Walking Tour March 2024 _ Universal Orlan...png


Overall, in the short term, Disney will feel an effect that will be guaranteed, and they have lost some Cast for Universal already, but that is to be expected as it looks good on a resume that you helped open a new theme park. Disney is well underway with its plans to provide a rebuttal for Epic Universe beyond what has been teased. If anything, the true unexpected thing from all of this is SeaWorld trying to throw their hat into the ring with both forthcoming hotels, one of which is taking out parking for their employees. That said, if we go back to 2023 comments about Walt Disney World adding 13,000 new jobs for Walt Disney World, as I have previously stated, Universal’s workforce is about 28,000 people. So he’ll need to do a lot of expansion to hit that 13,000-person goal.

Lastly, It also doesn’t help that Universal Creative & Walt Disney Imagineering are very much the same in terms of who they employ for a project. The best way I can describe it is with this joke: These two are so inbred they make a family tree in Alabama blush.
 

eddie104

Well-Known Member
I’m back with today’s installment of why Disney is not concerned about Epic Universe and why I agree with them.

First and foremost, Disney, such as NBC Universal did with Epic Universe, would not haphazardly announce any significant projects, such as a new park, in an investor call. They would want to make a spectacle out of it, and in this game, spectacle wins. That is why it’s unlikely to see any proper response to the new park until after it opens to take the oxygen out of the room., especially a fifth gate.

Now, with the pleasantries aside, let me explain. People don’t seem to realize that when Iger says that the company isn’t concerned about Epic, it is because they weren’t caught with their pants down. Epic Universe was by far very much telegraphed since they owned all that property before Vivendi sold it when they were fiscally hurting and when the park was on one of its many close calls of bankruptcy in 2003.

So, this move was entirely telegraphed. The end game for Universal is to buy back all the land so they can own I-Drive. I recall having these discussions at Bayside Diner before a media event two years before Epic Universe was announced. A little fun bonus fact: Epic Universe was originally called Universal’s Fantastic Worlds, with Universal’s Epic Universe being planned for the overarching property moniker, but as we are all aware, Warner Bros. at the time sued them to prohibit the name. Mind you as well; we did see a Fantastic Worlds logo in 2018 on a slide that said “Universal Orlando Resort - The Next Step,” with their plans that were leaked nearly nine months before the official announcement on August 1st, 2019 – with the name originally being trademarked in June of 2018.
View attachment 785770

So, the Walt Disney Company and many of the industry insiders had known about Epic Universe over a year before Universal had even announced it and what was expected. And I can assure you that Disney has been planning their rebuttals for years. Has anyone ever wondered why they had started gaging guests' interest with the blue sky concepts at D23? Or why do we have yet to present a blue sky concept in this setting that was not specifically for Orlando? Disney is playing the long game, and they have the benefit of doing it all in a clandestine nature since they won’t have to acquire land for it.

Now, I am sure someone will say that I am hitting the copium hard, but that isn’t the case. Nobody flipped out to this scale when Universal announced Volcano Bay, but suddenly, a new theme park came into Orlando, and now it’s a problem. Disney’s bread and butter down here is Magic Kingdom, which will very likely expand with the Beyond Frontierland concept because the park has an issue with insufficient capacity. Animal Kingdom is also still a half-day park, and Pandora didn’t alleviate that concern, nor does it have nightly entertainment. So, they plan to fix these two before moving to a fifth gate.

Moving forward to Universal Orlando, by 2027, Universal Studios Florida should look like the middle of Epcot with the amount of walls. The attractions on the short list of being removed soon are Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It, Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, The Simpsons Ride (and all of Springfield), and Men in Black: Alien Attack. Simpson’s contract is rapidly approaching its close by 2027, and the Ride system is original to the park as it hasn’t changed in 30+ years. It’s expected that when The Simpsons closes, Springfield/Fast Food Blvd to the arena that they now use for Nightmare Fuel at Halloween Horror Nights will be finally redone, including Men in Black. Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It is expected to close as early as Q1 of 2025 due to many factors, including the sheer cost of money they've sunk into the ride. El Toro Ryan discusses about the issues with the ride here.


Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, its closure I don’t immediately have a timetable for, but it anticipated that Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It would be replaced with a new rollercoaster that would possibly be Fast in the Furious themed. There have been talks of replacing the current Fast in the Furious building with a Rollercoaster à la Penguin Trek at SeaWorld Orlando. Universal still has the Lost Continent in Islands of Adventure, which badly needs to be redone and has been abandoned. They also made a poor attempt at removing Poseidon’s Fury signage; they only covered up Poseidon’s Fury but never covered up the tagline “Escape from the Lost City.” This does not go into other general improvements they need to make, which will be happening down the line.

View attachment 785769

Overall, in the short term, Disney will feel an effect that will be guaranteed, and they have lost some Cast for Universal already, but that is to be expected as it looks good on a resume that you helped open a new theme park. Disney is well underway with its plans to provide a rebuttal for Epic Universe beyond what has been teased. If anything, the true unexpected thing from all of this is SeaWorld trying to throw their hat into the ring with both forthcoming hotels, one of which is taking out parking for their employees. That said, if we go back to 2023 comments about Walt Disney World adding 13,000 new jobs for Walt Disney World, as I have previously stated, Universal’s workforce is about 28,000 people. So he’ll need to do a lot of expansion to hit that 13,000-person goal.

Lastly, It also doesn’t help that Universal Creative & Walt Disney Imagineering are very much the same in terms of who they employ for a project. The best way I can describe it is with this joke: These two are so inbred they make a family tree in Alabama blush.

Some of things you said regarding Universal are not true regarding closures.

MIB and Supercharged are not going anywhere anytime soon.

Poseidon's Fury already has a replacement in development but it’s not ready yet due to them trying to choose a ride system.

All this info can be found on the IU forums from notable insiders.
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
Disney has gone from being proactive to reactive to Universal. of course they will respond to Epic... eventually. But we've already seen what a delayed response can do coupled with greed - IOA outdrew 3 of Disney parks last year and even USF outdrew 2 of them... something unthinkable a few years ago
 

Gringrinngghost

Well-Known Member
Some of things you said regarding Universal are not true regarding closures.

MIB and Supercharged are not going anywhere anytime soon.

Poseidon's Fury already has a replacement in development but it’s not ready yet due to them trying to choose a ride system.

All this info can be found on the IU forums from notable insiders.
Funny thing is, I’ve been hearing the opposite and have had private discussions on both MIB and Supercharged. Both with current TMs and with some of those insiders that are on IU.

Secondly, in the case of Posideon’s Fury, if you notice I’ve never said anything outside of them for now abandoning the area, which is factually true. They initially were to close both Sinbad and Poseidon for Zelda. Well, Sinbad’s theater is also abandoned for all intents and purposes when they don’t need an extended queue for Hagrids.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
Disney has gone from being proactive to reactive to Universal. of course they will respond to Epic... eventually. But we've already seen what a delayed response can do coupled with greed - IOA outdrew 3 of Disney parks last year and even USF outdrew 2 of them... something unthinkable a few years ago

👆🏻👆🏻

They will be in the mid 30’s - Minimum - in market share by next year

That’s unthinkable and no way to spin that as a “good” number by any part of the Disney fan’s imagination
 

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