The Spirited 8th Wonder (WDW's Future & You!)

[Brian Noble]

On a related note: we've spent a lot of time talking about resorts, but did anyone ever follow up on this from the original post? If so, I might have missed it.

Oh, and one little thing about Disney and UNI and how there are no secrets in the business ... we'll talk about that too.

 

[The Mom]

What is the topic? I thought it was discussing the plans to convert regular hotel rooms into DVC, and the reasons, benefits and consequences behind it. Almost every post I've seen is about that, or related to it, yet every other page you warn people about committing the terrifying crime of drifting off-topic so I assume the real topic is something else - but there are no clues about that in the current thread title.

So for those who don't have time to read 60 pages, if it's so important for this thread to stay about one thing, why not rename the thread title to make it clear what that one thing is instead of everyone having to guess, then being threatened when they get it wrong.

I don't really understand the difference between on topic and off topic in this thread. The Spirit has brought up how deluxe resort and DVC guests shop at Walmart and lack class, and that this is related to the "Walmarting" of Disney's resorts. I responded to that notion and my post was deleted.

Maybe a mod (or the Spirit himself) could set a boundary of what's "on topic"? I'm not trying to cause trouble, but the line doesn't seem clear to me.

It is OK to just say "I agree" or I don't agree" with a very short, simple statement. But people insist upon writing things that are insulting (which is why I dislike the term Wal-Marting) or take the term very personally. So a side discussion starts. OR, people are not content to just say that WDW deluxe hotels would not be deluxe elsewhere, but write about specific hotels, so that others either start talking about their experiences in that hotel or city, or start naming even more hotels that are not even in the vicinity of WDW. And so on.

I gave you the best indication I could - if the topic is straying (even a little, WDW resorts versus LBV/other nearby resoprts, for example) does your response post bring it back to center, or is it likely to get things further away or spawn another sub-topic?

 

[cw1982]

On a related note: we've spent a lot of time talking about resorts, but did anyone ever follow up on this from the original post? If so, I might have missed it.

We did touch on this in the form of someone questioning why people aren't discussing it more. My general reply to that was that this topic has already come up so much in other threads that people were jumping on the DVC thing instead since it had been discussed less thoroughly in recent posts.

 

[CDavid]

On a related note: we've spent a lot of time talking about resorts, but did anyone ever follow up on this from the original post? If so, I might have missed it.

Page 7, post# 133.


One point (I'll just throw out) about Disney deluxe resorts and comparable off-site competition is that the Hotel Plaza establishments tend to be almost ignored, despite being technically on Disney property and having very similar complimentary bus transportation to the parks. Of course, they are a fraction of the price of Disney's deluxe properties - and in fact less than Disney's own value resorts.

What these hotels primarily lack - and critically - is that it doesn't say Disney in the name. That's a far more powerful incentive than it should be by any reasonable standard. As the least expensive on-property rooms, yet with typically greater amenities than Disney offers, Hotel Plaza ought to be booked solid - but it usually isn't. People are instead opting for Disney value, moderate, and deluxe rooms at several times the price.

If Disney really want to know why it currently (and will continue to) have trouble filling its deluxe resorts, the executives need only look in the mirror. It is a problem of Disney's own making, and as usual of late, the powers that be fundamentally do not understand the business of theme parks (or, in particular, the Walt Disney World Resort), so they don't understand how to fix the problem.

 

[Nemo14]

I don't really understand the difference between on topic and off topic in this thread. The Spirit has brought up how deluxe resort and DVC guests shop at Walmart and lack class, and that this is related to the "Walmarting" of Disney's resorts. I responded to that notion and my post was deleted.

Maybe a mod (or the Spirit himself) could set a boundary of what's "on topic"? I'm not trying to cause trouble, but the line doesn't seem clear to me.

perhaps you should discuss this as a PM to @The Mom ?

 

[PhotoDave219]

So commenting on Deluxe resorts is suddenly "off topic"?!?

What the hell?

How is this off topic?

From earlier...... I don't believe that the vast majority of people who visit Disney's deluxe hotels really know what a deluxe is let alone what the general rules of society that apply to them.

Fancy and Disney seems to go together like oil and water. The guests who seem to stay at deluxes appear - from outward observation - Ill mannered people who are trying to impress with how much money they have. Many of these observations come first and second hand based on the servers, bartenders, staff and housekeeping staff that simply does not like the way the guests treat them as well as my own observations that see how quickly these folks come unglued when they have to jump through hoops.

Maybe the über rich will be doing the Four Seasons. The average Disney crowd? Way too fancy & out of their tax bracket.

 

[The Mom]

So commenting on Deluxe resorts is suddenly "off topic"?!?

What the hell?

How is this off topic?

From earlier...... I don't believe that the vast majority of people who visit Disney's deluxe hotels really know what a deluxe is let alone what the general rules of society that apply to them.

Fancy and Disney seems to go together like oil and water. The guests who seem to stay at deluxes appear - from outward observation - Ill mannered people who are trying to impress with how much money they have. Many of these observations come first and second hand based on the servers, bartenders, staff and housekeeping staff that simply does not like the way the guests treat them as well as my own observations that see how quickly these folks come unglued when they have to jump through hoops.

Maybe the über rich will be doing the Four Seasons. The average Disney crowd? Way too fancy & out of their tax bracket.

Not if you can discuss it without being insulting , and as long as they are deluxe hotels near WDW that would be an alternative to WDW guests.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Not if you can discuss it without being insulting , and as long as they are deluxe hotels near WDW that would be an alternative to WDW guests.

If people are insulted, maybe they should behave better. We'd all like to think that every guest at WDW is just like all the Herb Ryman concept art but thats far from the truth. People at Deluxe resorts don't behave very well and these are exactly who Disney markets & caters to, resulting in a domino effect of problems. I'm talking about the Grand Floridian. I'm talking about Walt Disney World. Hell, even the New York Rangers behaved better than most guests at the Grand Floridian. (@71jason was there, he can back me up on that)

If suddenly being critical of the behavior of guests who attend Deluxe hotels is suddenly a verboten topic, then what is the point of a conversation about Disney Deluxe hotels in the first place?

Every observation I've made is based in truth and if the truth offends people, they came to the wrong forums.

 

[PrincessNelly_NJ]

So commenting on Deluxe resorts is suddenly "off topic"?!?

What the hell?

How is this off topic?

From earlier...... I don't believe that the vast majority of people who visit Disney's deluxe hotels really know what a deluxe is let alone what the general rules of society that apply to them.

Fancy and Disney seems to go together like oil and water. The guests who seem to stay at deluxes appear - from outward observation - Ill mannered people who are trying to impress with how much money they have. Many of these observations come first and second hand based on the servers, bartenders, staff and housekeeping staff that simply does not like the way the guests treat them as well as my own observations that see how quickly these folks come unglued when they have to jump through hoops.

Maybe the über rich will be doing the Four Seasons. The average Disney crowd? Way too fancy & out of their tax bracket.

We can talk about the hotels, just not the guest in them. I guess that is what The Mom is trying to say.

 

[PhotoDave219]

We can talk about the hotels, just not the guest in them. I guess that is what The Mom is trying to say.

Then what is the point in the first place?

 

[devoy1701]

I've been very anti-CBR for a while because of their cheap looking guest rooms and double beds. These new rooms look great. A total turnaround. I might actually have to start considering to stay here again. I hope the sliding doors get implemented in all the mods. The curtains in PO rooms just don't look as good.

Im with you. I'd stay value before staying at CBR but now I'm pretty set on CBR for my next trip in 2015 lol.
The curtains dont bother me but I'm sure my feelings on that will change when I start going with my children.
I could see POR getting some nice all white or plantation shutters style sliding doors... would look really nice.
Plus it is great that CBR will accommodate families of 5.

I just got an AP last week because I upgraded a ticket that my work paid for (so essentially I received a $100 discount). My first shock was that Seasonal APs now cost $329 per person (I remember when they were $229 a person) but I figure hey...we haven't had passes since early 2012, so there is at least a few things to see in Magic Kingdom. We'll have passes for a year, we have a kid now so we can come a couple times with him even though he won't remember it yet.

Anyway, we've stayed at CBR numerous times...it was our go-to resort for long weekend trips. So I looked up the rates and was SHOCKED that the passholder rates are $60 more per night than they were even just 2 years ago. I guess I can't get a room at a Mod for $89 anymore! I know this was a long way to get to a point...but you can get rooms at the Swan and Dolphin for the same price (and cheaper) than what Disney is charging for Moderate Resorts now....you're still in the middle of the action, you still have access to all of the same perks as the other Disney hotels, and you're in better accommodations. I'd rather pay $139 a night for a room at the Dolphin than a passholder discounted rate of $159 for a King Bed motel room at CBR overlooking a parking lot. Food for thought.

 

[cw1982]

We can talk about the hotels, just not the guest in them. I guess that is what The Mom is trying to say.

edit: I mentioned a story of how the housekeeping staff at The Yacht Club seemed shocked that I said thank you to them, almost as if a guest had never been nice to them and it was deemed off topic. So don't get upset.

The thing is, though, the hotels are built to house people, right? It seems like the two topics are very closely related.

 

[PrincessNelly_NJ]

Then what is the point in the first place?

Idk, I mean, I mentioned a story of how the housekeeping staff at The Yacht Club seemed shocked that I said thank you to them, almost as if a guest had never been nice to them. That the atmosphere of the Yacht Club seemed pretentious to me and it was deemed off topic.
So don't get upset.

 

[PrincessNelly_NJ]

I just got an AP last week because I upgraded a ticket that my work paid for (so essentially I received a $100 discount). My first shock was that Seasonal APs now cost $329 per person (I remember when they were $229 a person) but I figure hey...we haven't had passes since early 2012, so there is at least a few things to see in Magic Kingdom. We'll have passes for a year, we have a kid now so we can come a couple times with him even though he won't remember it yet.

Anyway, we've stayed at CBR numerous times...it was our go-to resort for long weekend trips. So I looked up the rates and was SHOCKED that the passholder rates are $60 more per night than they were even just 2 years ago. I guess I can't get a room at a Mod for $89 anymore! I know this was a long way to get to a point...but you can get rooms at the Swan and Dolphin for the same price (and cheaper) than what Disney is charging for Moderate Resorts now....you're still in the middle of the action, you still have access to all of the same perks as the other Disney hotels, and you're in better accommodations. I'd rather pay $139 a night for a room at the Dolphin than a passholder discounted rate of $159 for a King Bed motel room at CBR overlooking a parking lot. Food for thought.

I hear you. But lets be fair, that $139 doesn't include the extra fees does it?
I can tell you prices at CBR are going to be rising now that they have begun to renovate the rooms.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Idk, I mean, I mentioned a story of how the housekeeping staff at The Yacht Club seemed shocked that I said thank you to them, almost as if a guest had never been nice to them. That the atmosphere of the Yacht Club seemed pretentious to me and it was deemed off topic.
So don't get upset.

I get upset because I make a valid, on-topic point and it gets deleted because some special and unique snowflake gets offended, then we've got a problem.

The behavior of the guests at WDW Deluxe resorts simply will not fly at The Four Seasons. It won't. Disney's guest service has led to a guest culture of entitled behavior where those that stay at the expensive resorts feel they can behave any damn way they want. I've seen it first hand, my friends have seen it first hand and If people have a problem with that being pointed out, then maybe its their own behavior that needs to be more closely examined.

 

[flynnibus]

I gave you the best indication I could - if the topic is straying (even a little, WDW resorts versus LBV/other nearby resoprts, for example) does your response post bring it back to center, or is it likely to get things further away or spawn another sub-topic?

Yes


(I don't want to be over the limit...)

 

[flynnibus]

If suddenly being critical of the behavior of guests who attend Deluxe hotels is suddenly a verboten topic, then what is the point of a conversation about Disney Deluxe hotels in the first place?

You went beyond that... but it might have been hard to see from the air up there...

 

[PrincessNelly_NJ]

I get upset because I make a valid, on-topic point and it gets deleted because some special and unique snowflake gets offended, then we've got a problem.

The behavior of the guests at WDW Deluxe resorts simply will not fly at The Four Seasons. It won't. Disney's guest service has led to a guest culture of entitled behavior where those that stay at the expensive resorts feel they can behave any damn way they want. I've seen it first hand, my friends have seen it first hand and If people have a problem with that being pointed out, then maybe its their own behavior that needs to be more closely examined.

I'm sure we have all seen it, I know I have. The number of threads talking about bad guest behavior, shows that you are not alone in that feeling at all.

You will probably want to edit out that "special snowflake" comment, because I'm sure that will offend some and your post will get deleted for it as well.

 

[devoy1701]

I hear you. But lets be fair, that $139 doesn't include the extra fees does it?
I can tell you prices at CBR are going to be rising now that they have begun to renovate the rooms.

you're still comparing the 4-Diamond upscale resort to a motel-style room for roughly the same price.

 

[PrincessNelly_NJ]

you're still comparing the 4-Diamond upscale resort to a motel-style room for roughly the same price.

True.