Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts Tres

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pheneix

Well-Known Member
P&R's numbers are irrelevant to the discussion of whether DHS is profitable or floundering. If people click through to DHS on their 5th and free day of a parkhopper, stay two hours, and spend no money, then DHS is having real problems. Problems that will never show up in the public statements because Disney only reports P&R as a whole and P&R is setting records largely because of DLR and the fact that the masses will always be drawn to MK (not to mention the cruise ships, which are also included in this).

That is EXACTLY what is happening. Also EMH plays a major role in shifting guest visitation around property. DHS sees a lot of gate clicks because resort guests see that as the "early park" or the "late park" based on the EMH schedule. It's because they think they are getting something special because they are seeing the park before or after "everyone else does."

It should come as no surprise that every WDW park's highest attended day of the week is almost without fail the day they hosted EMH.
 

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
That is EXACTLY what is happening. Also EMH plays a major role in shifting guest visitation around property. DHS sees a lot of gate clicks because resort guests see that as the "early park" or the "late park" based on the EMH schedule. It's because they think they are getting something special because they are seeing the park before or after "everyone else does."

It should come as no surprise that every WDW park's highest attended day of the week is almost without fail the day they hosted EMH.
Fun Fact: I've only ridden TSM during EMH.
 

Pixiedustmaker

Well-Known Member
Depends on what you call in trouble. TDO have acknowledged intenally that the park needs help for at least 4 years now.

And lets not talk about unsuitable hotel ground or tunnels under World Drive.

Generally when you talk about a private business "acknowledging" something, it means admitting to outsiders, like reporters, that there is a problem. DHS's attendance went up, WDW is doing record business . . . there is nothing for the company to coverup with DHS. Currently, it is benefitting from the improvements in the economy, and other factors.

I guess I'll file this under the "DHS is failing like DCA" rumors . . .
 

Cosmic Commando

Well-Known Member
You don't really need Next-Gen to accomplish that, though, since your KTTW card that you used to enter AK at 9:17 is the same one you used to open your room door four hours later. Whether they did or didn't, they easily could have tracked this for many years.

Or... just track bus/monorail/boat usage.
 

Yensid1974

Well-Known Member
I doubt they'd re-do Osbourne with new LED tech in 2011 if they going to be removed/moved this year, or even three years from now.

It really doesn't seem like you know Disney (and more specifically TDO) very well at all. I find it interesting that as you rail against the rumors from our more reliable sources that your own point of view isn't based on anything close to actual information or at least not as much information as those you argue against have.
 

Skip

Well-Known Member
Generally when you talk about a private business "acknowledging" something, it means admitting to outsiders, like reporters, that there is a problem. DHS's attendance went up, WDW is doing record business . . . there is nothing for the company to coverup with DHS. Currently, it is benefitting from the improvements in the economy, and other factors.

I guess I'll file this under the "DHS is failing like DCA" rumors . . .


You know, I must say, you are one of the most obtuse posters I've ever had the annoyance of reading around here. You drink up the company Kool-Aid and preach it as gospel while dispelling the news you don't want to hear from established, reputable insiders who have built credibility over years of correct insider information. And really, you should be happy - DHS will be (hopefully!) getting the attention it needs.

Iger isn't going to say DHS is failing if he doesn't have to. He can use the wonders of aggregate data to paint a prettier picture for investors. The park attendance statistics you keep screaming about have been mere estimates for years now...and they (given some pretty simple examination) really don't make a lot of sense. In DHS's case, as many have already pointed out ad nauseum (and you've yet to address this point, by the way), in order to reach the number of the reported attendance, the park would have to be at or near capacity pretty much every day of the year. That isn't anywhere near realistic or true.

And consider this - if WDW had nothing to hide about its theme park attendance data, in that DHS WAS actually growing to the degree the reports claim (and that you keep shouting), why don't they just publish the official numbers? Disney has taken steps to hide that information rather than make it more transparent. One has to wonder, why?

Of course, none of this matters when you consider that attendance doesn't mean crap if no one is buying anything. I can personally attest that the "3 hour stay" argument is pretty valid, as I've done it quite often - and I know several families who went recently that either only spent an hour or two there to ride ToT & RnRC, or skipped it entirely. That means no meal sales and almost no merchandise sales from that customer, but hey, DHS gets the turnstile click so it must be doing fabulously, right?

You keep acting like we're saying DHS and DCA have the same problem and are thus getting a "reboot" of sorts - this isn't accurate and you keep grossly misrepresenting what a lot of people are saying to suit your (seriously) slanted argument. DCA's problem was it was a crap park compared to Disneyland without enough quality attractions to draw sufficient attendance. It needed attendance, badly. DHS has attendance, as you've pointed out again and again and again. The issue is the lack of spending once there and duration of stay. If you bolster the presence of two of Disney's master properties, Star Wars and Cars, you've got enough new, extremely-appealing attractions to keep people there for at least one meal and probably enough interest to buy a Cars or Star Wars toy (or anything else, really). Let's not kid ourselves - Lights Motors Action and the Backlot Tour aren't selling toys right now. Cars and Star Wars will. Thus, DHS and DCA both need (and will hopefully get) its reboot - but for entirely different reasons and with entirely different end goals.

Finally, to address your "this is armchair imagineering!" claim, I counter by saying you're being a bit of a hypocrite. You seem to know what's better for the park by offering your own ideas on where expansion pads and where things should go (parking lots, etc.). If someone told me five years ago that Universal would tear out the JAWS ride and adjacent Amity area, put more Potter in, and link the parks with a train, I would've told them they were nuts and that was probably just some stupid armchair imagineering. (In fact, if I looked back far enough, I probably did say something like that.) It's not that far-fetched that Disney would be interested in tearing down the useless Streets of America, Backlot Tour, and LMA (the latter two of which are very resource-consuming and expensive to run) in favor of more relevant, popular attractions. Seriously, I really find it hard to believe you can't understand this argument. I think you're calling it "armchair imagineering" because you don't like the plan and it doesn't make the most efficient use of space to you. (And I might even agree. But that's not the point.)

Now, I know you'll ignore every logical point I (and everyone else) just made and continue in your little dreamland where Disney does things per your wishes, @Lee and the @WDW1974 don't know what they're talking about, and the removal of the Osborne lights would be a national catastrophe (seriously?). But I just could not handle your seemingly forced ignorance any longer and felt compelled to say something.
 

Pixiedustmaker

Well-Known Member
DCA's problem was it was a crap park compared to Disneyland without enough quality attractions to draw sufficient attendance. It needed attendance, badly. DHS has attendance, as you've pointed out again and again and again. The issue is the lack of spending once there and duration of stay.

Yes, DHS has attendance and WDW has record attendance. As noted, spending in the parks on food/merchandise is up in Disney's domestic parks. I find it farfetched that DHS's spending has not ticked up a bit as the economy has improved, this is an exogenous reason for DHS's spending numbers to improve. So even though DHS doesn't have anything new, spending would be expected to go up. DHS has always had issues being a half-day park, they have added shows and attractions over the years.

Not saying that DHS shouldn't get a new attraction in five years, like in Pixar Place, but that putting in Carsland seems very unlikely, in addition to Carsland plus a StarWarsland that is even more amazing that Carsland, plus Pixar stuff. Really? Fans want Disney to "answer" Uni's upgrades and rumors are not surprisingly, things that fans have been speculating about.

There is no evidence to support the idea that spending at DHS, and length of stay, has gone down from baseline. With higher attendance numbers you have more guests, and that is more absolute spending all else remaining equal. If the economy is improving you'd naturally expect more spending . . . as Disney has reported . . .

These rumors are all bogus.

Look what one of the "insiders" said:

Yes at this point I was hoping a controversial thread like this would "smoke out" some of the fact from fiction surrounding what is going on at DHS. Sadly this doesn't seem to be the case.

So, were these rumors started just to generate fan interest, to persuade Disney, or to "smoke out" the truth of rumors from months ago?
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Yes, DHS has attendance and WDW has record attendance. As noted, spending in the parks on food/merchandise is up in Disney's domestic parks. I find it farfetched that DHS's spending has not ticked up a bit as the economy has improved, this is an exogenous reason for DHS's spending numbers to improve. So even though DHS doesn't have anything new, spending would be expected to go up. DHS has always had issues being a half-day park, they have added shows and attractions over the years.

Not saying that DHS shouldn't get a new attraction in five years, like in Pixar Place, but that putting in Carsland seems very unlikely, in addition to Carsland plus a StarWarsland that is even more amazing that Carsland, plus Pixar stuff. Really? Fans want Disney to "answer" Uni's upgrades and rumors are not surprisingly, things that fans have been speculating about.

There is no evidence to support the idea that spending at DHS, and length of stay, has gone down from baseline. With higher attendance numbers you have more guests, and that is more absolute spending all else remaining equal. If the economy is improving you'd naturally expect more spending . . . as Disney has reported . . .

These rumors are all bogus.

Look what one of the "insiders" said:



So, were these rumors started just to generate fan interest, to persuade Disney, or to "smoke out" the truth of rumors from months ago?


Do rumors need a reason to be rumors?
 

Figments Friend

Well-Known Member
( regarding thoughts on a possible signature beverage for the proposed Cantina...)
Better be blue milk. Blueberry flavored milk with some food coloring. It is possible to flavor milk this way already, there's some specialty stores that sell it.

mJk81HW.jpg


I will only drink it if it comes in a souvenir white Tupperware tumbler.

I want authenticity !

:D
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
In theory, outlandish fan generated rumors with no basis in reality apparently exist to "smoke out" what Burbank's decision making process is with regards to a certain theme park, or try to force Disney's hand.

You can choose to believe whatever you want.

The truth is that there is internal plans & proposals that aren't even funded yet, letalone ready to be announced.

Anything beyond that is a product or your own imagination, hopes, desires or delusions.
 
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