WSJ: Even Disney Is Worried About The High Cost Of A Disney Vacation (gift link)

[Creathir]

So, the on-site resorts are running at 85% capacity, per Disney's own quarterly statements, and some people are claiming the sky would fall (aka. parks would be overrun with guests) if they were full?

Remember when there were things to do outside the parks, and they were also affordable? Golf. Parasailing. Watercraft rentals. Arcades. Pleasure Island. Downtown Disney with multiple things to do and experience, not just be a collection of shopping and restaurants. Dinner shows. Luaus. Those who designed the place designed it to be a "resort", not just a collection of theme parks with hotels. The previous guy running the company knew that and worked towards providing things everyone could enjoy, and expanded offerings. The current guy thought that idea was stupid and has worked to rid the place of those sorts of things ever since 2005. They both ran the company for roughly the same amount of time, which one is going to be remembered 20 years from now in a more positive light? I'm betting on the former, not the lesser. I mean, latter.

Eisner understood that the customer mattered, that the experience, from all levels mattered. He understood a vision was needed to illicit the magic. Iger is just an empty suit, a salesman with no vision.
His direction is guided purely by selling more stock.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I’ve wondered about this as well, and even wondered if Disney parks are slowly moving to cater to adults vs. kids. Not entirely, but relatively speaking.

I feel like kids today whip out the dreaded B word (for… babies!!) at younger and younger ages. To be fair I haven’t seen it personally but I hear people talking about how (some) 5 year olds declare Thomas, Mickey, princesses, Bluey, etc. as being “for babies”.

Bluey has a big following among the HS/college/YA age group.

 

[Agent H]

Bluey has a big following among the HS/college/YA age group.

It does? That’s surprising.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

yeah, the single day tickets to Universal are expensive - as that is likely what most people want to do ... just do a day as part of their Orlando vacation or add a day to a Disney trip ..

At one point, yes, but that's not really the case now. Maybe for you, but not for others.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

It does? That’s surprising.

Yes.

The show has a fair bit of adult humor, and the episodes are only 15minutes.

 

[DisneyHead123]

Bluey has a big following among the HS/college/YA age group.

Yeah I've commented on that before as well - to my mind, another trend pushing Disney towards an older market is that kids today want to be more grown up, and then when they reach adulthood they're more likely (than in the past) to embrace hobbies and activities that used to be reserved for kids. Based on nothing but my anecdotal observation, but that's how it seems to me.

 

[MisterPenguin]

It does? That’s surprising.

Bluey's parents are teaching them adulting.

 

[DisneyHead123]

This TikTok has gone massively viral.



She is spot on.

The biggest key point here which should terrify Disney is her point regarding the premium price but a lack of a premium product.

A party who pays significantly (think luxury) for an item or service is going to expect luxury quality.

The security checks in the rooms, the lack of room service, heck 30 minutes to buy a drink at the pool bar, all are key indicators of how poorly managed and run the product is, yet they charge an above premium price.

She’s not going to recommend WDW to her friends, likely wont be back, and even was irritated enough to post on social media about it. And she can afford the premium experience and was staying at Poly.

WDW is pricing out the average joe, and is not delivering a product their target market finds attractive.

This is a huge problem.

Ok, probably this is my {{"Pixie Dusting Intensifies"}} moment, lol, but - I don't know that going to Disney and finding it loud, crowded, and expensive is a particularly hot take. I feel like that's like taking your kid to the circus or The Wiggles live and then complaining that it was noisy and wild and the food and merch were insanely overpriced and some kid next to you peed on the floor.

I feel like this ties into what I was saying before - more and more, the parks are expected to be an adult oriented playground and resort. Not "family" oriented, but focused on adults specifically. She said her kid had an amazing time, right? But that wasn't enough, because she as a mom wanted to feel like she was strolling through a relaxing oasis as well. I think that represents a change in expectations from the previous generation.

Don't get me wrong, I've been critical of Disney many times. But on this particular topic, I feel like there's a new level of expectation on Disney that wasn't there before. And maybe that's not a bad thing, maybe it's good, who knows? But I think it's new. I don't think 1980s parents were expected a spa-like environment or a Ritz Carlton even though they were shelling out a ton of money for Disney - I think they were expecting something that would make their child's face light up and be kinda (kinda) fun for the adults in the group as well.

 

[Agent H]

Ok, probably this is my {{"Pixie Dusting Intensifies"}} moment, lol, but - I don't know that going to Disney and finding it loud, crowded, and expensive is a particularly hot take. I feel like that's like taking your kid to the circus or The Wiggles live and then complaining that it was noisy and wild and the food and merch were insanely overpriced and some kid next to you peed on the floor.

I feel like this ties into what I was saying before - more and more, the parks are expected to be an adult oriented playground and resort. Not "family" oriented, but focused on adults specifically. She said her kid had an amazing time, right? But that wasn't enough, because she as a mom wanted to feel like she was strolling through a relaxing oasis as well. I think that represents a change in expectations from the previous generation.

Don't get me wrong, I've been critical of Disney many times. But on this particular topic, I feel like there's a new level of expectation on Disney that wasn't there before. And maybe that's not a bad thing, maybe it's good, who knows? But I think it's new. I don't think 1980s parents were expected a spa-like environment or a Ritz Carlton even though they were shelling out a ton of money for Disney - I think they were expecting something that would make their child's face light up and be kinda (kinda) fun for the adults in the group as well.

I second this. Some of it kinda sounds Karaney like there was a long line at the pool bar on Presidents’ Day weekend you don’t say!

 

[Basil of Baker Street]

I think people who can afford to go on luxury vacations tend to go on luxury vacations. Disney is an expensive vacation, not a luxury vacation. We must not confuse the 2.

 

[James Alucobond]

I feel like this ties into what I was saying before - more and more, the parks are expected to be an adult oriented playground and resort. Not "family" oriented, but focused on adults specifically. She said her kid had an amazing time, right? But that wasn't enough, because she as a mom wanted to feel like she was strolling through a relaxing oasis as well. I think that represents a change in expectations from the previous generation.

Part of the problem is that, even for older children, there is more “required” adult participation. When my siblings and I were old enough to do so, my parents just turned us loose in the parks and told us to circle back at meal times. Now, with arrival windows for restaurants and attractions, the purse strings attached to pre-bookings you might have, etc., it’s a lot more difficult to let go. Paper FastPass was really the last time the parks facilitated an approachable experience for families that wanted to split up and do different things.

 

[flynnibus]

Don't get me wrong, I've been critical of Disney many times. But on this particular topic, I feel like there's a new level of expectation on Disney that wasn't there before. And maybe that's not a bad thing, maybe it's good, who knows? But I think it's new. I don't think 1980s parents were expected a spa-like environment or a Ritz Carlton even though they were shelling out a ton of money for Disney - I think they were expecting something that would make their child's face light up and be kinda (kinda) fun for the adults in the group as well.

No - in the 70s and 80s Disney was UNIQUE. It wasn't over the top luxury, but it was unlike anything else around. The idea of immersing you in an entirely different environment... the idea that the service level didn't stop at the park gates, but followed you home back to the hotel. The amenities were quality and generous. I remember being young and seeing TOUCHLESS water faucets for the first time in a Disney bathroom. It was just stuff you didn't see or get elsewhere. You were paying a premium price, but getting a premium, unique, and incredibly enjoyable product.

The problem is not a 'new level of expectation', the problem is Disney lost that edge. By the 90s, everyone was doing themed entertainment. You even had people out Disney'ing-Disney with even more elaborate and immersive experiences. People had copied Disney's strategies and the gap between what Disney was vs other spots decreased.

That trend continued, and as Disney got more and more complacent to be 'like everyone else' in terms of policies, strategies, product focus, etc... your hotels became more about 'location, location, location' and not EXPERIENCE.

So now when Disney tries to charge $700/night for a hotel... that is a moderate hotel experience at best.. and no longer wows you... people start to wonder "Why I am paying $700/night for this???"

This isn't new or unreasonable expectations - It's that Disney no longer delivered on the value they used to be able to charge anything they wanted for.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

I think people who can afford to go on luxury vacations tend to go on luxury vacations. Disney is an expensive vacation, not a luxury vacation. We must not confuse the 2.

Yes, exactly. And I think this is where they may run into issues in the coming years, should they continue down this path. If you’re courting guests who can afford luxury vacations and who have deep pockets, it follows that they want the luxury vacation experience.

This is exactly what that woman from the TikTok video was disappointed in. Of course the kiddos had a blast, it’s Disney. Mom however knew exactly how much their stay at the Polynesian was costing them just to be met with very crowded pools, no room service, and overwhelmed pool bars (remedying these issues is not a lot to ask from a resort that at times of year is asking near $1k for a regular room). Mom knew that she was being hit up with add on after add on in the parks, to still have to be laser focused on their plans all day, which doesn’t feel great.

They went during a very busy time, yes, but not even throwing money at LLPP is going to save you from the issues at the resorts and all the crowding outside of queues. I think something is going to have to give in terms of being expensive but still with glaring issues. I think those of us who frequent Disney often, even those who are critical, can be blind to some of the issues that fresh eyes notice.

 

[Agent H]

Yes, exactly. And I think this is where they may run into issues in the coming years, should they continue down this path. If you’re courting guests who can afford luxury vacations and who have deep pockets, it follows that they want the luxury vacation experience.

This is exactly what that woman from the TikTok video was disappointed in. Of course the kiddos had a blast, it’s Disney. Mom however knew exactly how much their stay at the Polynesian was costing them just to be met with very crowded pools, no room service, and overwhelmed pool bars (remedying these issues is not a lot to ask from a resort that at times of year is asking near $1k for a regular room). Mom knew that she was being hit up with add on after add on in the parks, to still have to be laser focused on their plans all day, which doesn’t feel great.

They went during a very busy time, yes, but not even throwing money at LLPP is going to save you from the issues at the resorts and all the crowding outside of queues. I think something is going to have to give in terms of being expensive but still with glaring issues. I think those of us who frequent Disney often, even those who are critical, can be blind to some of the issues that fresh eyes notice.

And what happens when the kids want to go back?

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

And what happens when the kids want to go back?

I sure as heck would not let my kids simply tell me we’re going to Disney and staying at the Polynesian if I was not on board too.

In most cases I’d think if the kids want to go back but the parents don’t they probably don’t go, or go much less often than if the parent had a blast too.

 

[John park hopper]

And what happens when the kids want to go back?

My grandkids given the choice of going back to WDW or skiing in CO picked CO. Not all kids want to go back fan loyalty of years past is not there like it used to be and Disney should be concerned

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

I think people who can afford to go on luxury vacations tend to go on luxury vacations. Disney is an expensive vacation, not a luxury vacation. We must not confuse the 2.

Were far from rich and have experienced this ourselves as we travel more, now that we’ve eaten at a couple Michelin rated restaurants, stayed at a couple 4 star hotels, etc we now realize that Disney isn’t a luxury vacation.

The “rich” people Disney is after are very likely used to much more luxurious vacations than the few very nice hotels and restaurants we’ve been fortunate enough to experience, after staying in a true luxury resort you realize the Disney resorts pale in comparison, after eating in a true fine dining experience you realize the vast majority of the Disney restaurants (excepting Victoria and Albert’s, etc) pale in comparison.

We love Disney but unique and special are far better descriptors than luxury.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

And what happens when the kids want to go back?

They likely go back but I bet they don’t stay at Poly next time, no reason to pay premium prices for a less than premium experience.

They either save thousands by staying at a moderate or they move over to the 4 Seasons and get a true luxury resort.

 

[Agent H]

They likely go back but I bet they don’t stay at Poly next time, no reason to pay premium prices for a less than premium experience.

They either save thousands by staying at a moderate or they move over to the 4 Seasons and get a true luxury resort.

I could honestly see some kids preferring the art of animation to the poly.

 

[flynnibus]

Disney markets to suburbia...
Disney offers a holiday-inn level experience...
but Disney is charging like a drunken sailor

The "Disney Difference" died.. and was replaced with itemized billing