Very interesting video

[DisneyHead123]

Now before you say just buy 2liter bottles or cans when they’re on sale (which is a legitimate argument), cans & bottles are made with Nutra-Sweet & fountain sodas are made with saccharine which tastes completely different.

Apologies for being off topic, but that is really good to know! I just thought fountain sodas were fizzier or something, they do taste much better.

 

[Goofyernmost]

If what you are describing is true of the modern economic trend, (and for the purposes of this thread i am going to just assume it is) than WDW is absolutely doing the right thing, and maybe the only thing it should be doing in targeting higher earning families. Because the issue with the second group you have and that you say is getting bigger, is that it doesn't matter what WDW offers, and for what cost/price. Those people who don't have a pot to in aren't buying WDW vacations period. There is no cutting prices or increasing offering at any level which make them a viable market. As such from a business standpoint, they don't figure into any planning whatsoever.

And if you are correct in that the first group is shrinking, as people move into the second group, it means WDW shouldn't be targeting/marketing to that group either. What that leaves is targeting customers with higher wealth, and getting them to spend more per visit, even if the repeat visits aren't there because....that is the only market to tap.

No, it simply means that, in my opinion, Disney needs to stop bleeding everyone dry. It takes away those that have given all the blood they can. Instead they come up with billions if not trillions of dollars profit and do nothing to try an make sure that down the road they still have the ability to draw in the crowds, attitudes and love for the place that preceded. That is what made a Disney Park something that people planned for all year. Instead now they are changing that habit and are finding other fun and considerably cheaper things to do. And as long as they continue to price the hardcore fans out they will never get them back. Just because they make the wait shorter by buying a skip the line pass, it will not bring back those that cannot afford that privilage.

It's a long range outlook as opposed to the suck all the money out right now when we can with no consideration to the idea that someday, in the future, might not be quite so easy to do. My thought is that you can't get a nickel from someone that isn't there. Do I know if that is what will happen, no I don't. What I do know, just from watching so many giants falter and either die or get on life support, I do know that what I have seen as untouchables are gone. And I would hate to see that.

Almost four decades of my life I was a crazy advocate and spent thousands of dollars, back when that was real money, spent hours daydreaming of my next trip, preparing to go and many, many time driving 1500 miles (one way) just to spend a few days at my favorite place in the world. My kids and friends got tired of my constant references to WDW that I would manage to wedge into almost any conversation I ever had. I lived, ate and breathed WDW. Then my alleged friend blocked me out because I cannot afford that and pay my bills all at the same time. My friend slammed the door in my face and found a new, more financially able to withstand massive increases in cost. But you know what, I don't think they will ever be as loyal and motivated to go there as I and people like me did in the past. I may be wrong, but I also may be right. Only time will tell! That said, however, yes it does matter because if they weren't charging so much for everything they wouldn't have lost all of us to begin with. I didn't give up on Disney, they gave up on me.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

No, it simply means that, in my opinion, Disney needs to stop bleeding everyone dry. It takes away those that have given all the blood they can. Instead they come up with billions if not trillions of dollars profit and do nothing to try an make sure that down the road they still have the ability to draw in the crowds, attitudes and love for the place that preceded. That is what made a Disney Park something that people planned for all year. Instead now they are changing that habit and are finding other fun and considerably cheaper things to do. And as long as they continue to price the hardcore fans out they will never get them back. Just because they make the wait shorter by buying a skip the line pass, it will not bring back those that cannot afford that privilage.

It's a long range outlook as opposed to the suck all the money out right now when we can with no consideration to the idea that someday, in the future, might not be quite so easy to do. My thought is that you can't get a nickel from someone that isn't there. Do I know if that is what will happen, no I don't. What I do know, just from watching so many giants falter and either die or get on life support, I do know that what I have seen as untouchables are gone. And I would hate to see that.

Almost four decades of my life I was a crazy advocate and spent thousands of dollars, back when that was real money, spent hours daydreaming of my next trip, preparing to go and many, many time driving 1500 miles (one way) just to spend a few days at my favorite place in the world. My kids and friends got tired of my constant references to WDW that I would manage to wedge into almost any conversation I ever had. I lived, ate and breathed WDW. Then my alleged friend blocked me out because I cannot afford that and pay my bills all at the same time. My friend slammed the door in my face and found a new, more financially able to withstand massive increases in cost. But you know what, I don't think they will ever be as loyal and motivated to go there as I and people like me did in the past. I may be wrong, but I also maybe right. Only time will tell!

ITs a business. Its purpose is to make money, now, and potentially in the future. They are supposed to make billions and trillions in profit. Its the entire purpose the company exists.

You were the one who brought up the economic model of the two groups. And YOU were the one who said the hypothesis that the second group the one with no a pot to in, is increasing. That group of people is of no use to WDW, or any company that sells luxury (meaning non required) services. It doesn't matter how much you, or other people like Disney, talk about Disney, daydream about Disney. IF you can't afford to go, you are not going. The company isn't set up to cater to people who can't afford to go.

And if the market of people who you said were in the first group is dwindling, and the second group can't afford it, and that group is getting bigger. They only market left is people with high income. In which case, you are focusing on less trips per customer over their lifetime, (because as you say they have more options) but higher spend per trip. I mean that is just basic math.

Listen i don't happen to subscribe to the idea that WDW is currently outpricing people. You generally aren't both overpriced for a market, and the most highly attended part of your market at the same time. There just aren't that many wealthy people to make up the millions and millions of people vising WDW parks every year. If there were, it means either 1) the definition of wealthy is alot broader than most would use or 2) you are wrong and wealthy people are revisiting the parks to get the attendance numbers were there they are now. But if we accept what you are saying, that the middle class is decreasing in size/buying power, its WDW to recognize and deal with that economic fact, not to change it.

 

[Smiley/OCD]

Apologies for being off topic, but that is really good to know! I just thought fountain sodas were fizzier or something, they do taste much better.

Aspartame, the active ingredient in Nutra-Sweet, degrades when exposed to the air, including fountain systems…that’s why it’s not used in them, only in the cans & bottles because they’re sealed until the consumer uses it…
I give it up for lent every year…it’s the worst 40+ days of my life! lol EXTREME caffeine withdrawal the first several days…I just drink seltzer…

 

[DisneyHead123]

Aspartame, the active ingredient in Nutra-Sweet, degrades when exposed to the air, including fountain systems…that’s why it’s not used in them, only in the cans & bottles because they’re sealed until the consumer uses it…
I give it up for lent every year…it’s the worst 40+ days of my life! lol EXTREME caffeine withdrawal the first several days…I just drink seltzer…

That would be a painful 40 days for sure!

 

[Goofyernmost]

ITs a business. Its purpose is to make money, now, and potentially in the future. They are supposed to make billions and trillions in profit. Its the entire purpose the company exists.

You were the one who brought up the economic model of the two groups. And YOU were the one who said the hypothesis that the second group the one with no a pot to in, is increasing. That group of people is of no use to WDW, or any company that sells luxury (meaning non required) services. It doesn't matter how much you, or other people like Disney, talk about Disney, daydream about Disney. IF you can't afford to go, you are not going. The company isn't set up to cater to people who can't afford to go.

And if the market of people who you said were in the first group is dwindling, and the second group can't afford it, and that group is getting bigger. They only market left is people with high income. In which case, you are focusing on less trips per customer over their lifetime, (because as you say they have more options) but higher spend per trip. I mean that is just basic math.

Listen i don't happen to subscribe to the idea that WDW is currently outpricing people. You generally aren't both overpriced for a market, and the most highly attended part of your market at the same time. There just aren't that many wealthy people to make up the millions and millions of people vising WDW parks every year. If there were, it means either 1) the definition of wealthy is alot broader than most would use or 2) you are wrong and wealthy people are revisiting the parks to get the attendance numbers were there they are now. But if we accept what you are saying, that the middle class is decreasing in size/buying power, its WDW to recognize and deal with that economic fact, not to change it.

Yup, and I am looking at is as a business that isn't thinking ahead beyond two or three years. As a business its primary goal is the make profit, but the billions and trillion per year is not required. When you live and die on the massive profit hill, there is a good chance that somewhere along the line "jack will fall down and break his crown" and that money might not be there to be spent.

The secondary goal is to not only be successful at this very moment but more importantly that they remain healthy for an extended period of time. Disney Parks have always done that in the past, but not by sucking every available dime from every customer to do it. The things they charge for now as well as all kinds of other things that no longer exist never required a charge. Right now they charge what is getting close to $200. per person just to walk through the gate. The whole thing was what you paid for in that admittance fee. Now we are just paying to get in and after that if you want to actually see the inside of those beautifully themed buildings you will end up paying double or triple that admission cost.

Disney Parks did exist when the target was longevity and it built all the parks into the ginormous company it is now during that time. Problem is that maintaining that degree of profit is a lot harder to do than maintaining a long term lesser profit requirement with a realistic eye toward the future..