Tron might finally beat Narnia

[JEANYLASER]

I love Tron! Tron will be Narnia!

 

[T-1MILLION]

Tron is now sitting at 373 million worldwide, while Narnia 3 is at 375 million. Now Tron cannot touch Narnia 1 with 750 million or Narnia 2 with 465 million. I bring these numbers up to relate the attraction rumors for Tron. If Disney dropped Narnia with such greater numbers in audience and money than Tron - I cannot see how Disney would throw more money at Tron for another film let alone an attraction. The merchandise theory could help Tron - but Narnia action figures have out sold Trons so far, but Narnia does not have a strong clothing line or other Tron gadgets. The other arguement is Disney has to split the bill with Walden Media for Narnia while Tron is all in house. I feel WDW is in much more need of Narnia type themes to compete with Potter and compliment AK than Tron's futuristic feel.

No its not. You have to count inflation, Imax Screens and 3D screen charges. The value of the dollar is different and the attendance is much lower for Tron.

As for another Tron film, anything is possible but it would be some very hopeful thinking at this point.

 

[NMBC1993]

The problem is that they spent way too much movie. If they had cut the budget down 40 or 50 million (whether this is feasible or not I don't know, purely hypothetical), then I think there would be no question that it would get the sequel at least.

Well the thing with Tron is that the budget for the film is including all the other attempts/new scripts/effect testing they did over the last 27 years to try to get a Tron sequel off the ground. It's the same with Superman Returns, the budget for that was 200 million which included the money they paided Tim Burton for his draft, Kevin Smith's draft, actor changes, everything that lead up to the final product.

 

[Thrill]

And where are you getting this info? :shrug: You realize that is the whole point of the series right? You have no movie without the computer world. Now, I think what is lost on people is that Tron actually did really well considering the genre and considering it is a sequel to a 28 year old movie. The problem is that they spent way too much movie. If they had cut the budget down 40 or 50 million (whether this is feasible or not I don't know, purely hypothetical), then I think there would be no question that it would get the sequel at least.

As far as I've heard, the next movie will likely have a larger real-world portion than the first two movies, if it happens, based on a supposed teaser trailer, which is entirely in the real world. I still can't see a sequel not having any segments taking place in the computer.

Anyway, a sequel (if made soon) would probably have a lower budget than the original. Aside from the possibility of needing less CGI, the design costs for the computer world will be far lower as it was already designed for the first movie.

 

[slappy magoo]

There are Trekkers embroiled in a decades long "Kirk vs. Picard" flame war, stopping just long enough to call us nerds.

But I will add this: While Disney may have hoped for longer legs from Tron: Legacy, and while they may be waiting to see what happens with hoe video/VoD before making a decision on a new sequel, there would at least be a good chance the sequel could be made cheaper. The look of the Tron world is now established (though it's now always assumed the next chapter in a movie franchise will look bigger), so they won't be spending all those millions on R&D.

 

[T-1MILLION]

There are Trekkers embroiled in a decades long "Kirk vs. Picard" flame war, stopping just long enough to call us nerds.

But I will add this: While Disney may have hoped for longer legs from Tron: Legacy, and while they may be waiting to see what happens with hoe video/VoD before making a decision on a new sequel, there would at least be a good chance the sequel could be made cheaper. The look of the Tron world is now established (though it's now always assumed the next chapter in a movie franchise will look bigger), so they won't be spending all those millions on R&D.

I see what you are saying but the thing is with how poorly the film did in their comparisons to hopes for it, a sequel would not get anywhere near to the 169 figure it has right now.

This is something Disney over estimated. You can't set out to make a cult classic film/meet one that was based on cult classic success.

 

[jDoor]

the teaser for tron 3 is rumored to be on the tron:legacy blu ray disc.....

 

[lebeau]

the teaser for tron 3 is rumored to be on the tron:legacy blu ray disc.....

It was rumored. That rumor has been debunked.

There is some footage that was shot specifically for the DVD which some people took to be a trailer.

Just to clarify, as of this moment, Tron 3 has not been given the green light. At least not officially.

Most of these rumors stem from hopeful fans who don't understand the development process (and all the ways in which it can go wrong).

 

[jt04]

The home sales of prince was 78 mil, compared to 352 mil for the lion, witch and Wardrobe. With the box office being less with dawn treader, it is doubtful more people are going to buy more dvds and blu rays.

I never claimed it would out sell the first film. What I am saying is the sales will be good. Likely better than prince. Bottom line is that the movie has long since recouped production costs and every sale from now on is profit. There is still an opportunity to bring the franchise back strong. And if they do that and complete all seven films it will continue to succeed for decades.

Although in all truth the estate is not producing the films for profits sake and I think that is why Disney bailed on it ultimately.

My ultimate point is that movies like Narnia are viable. It has been claimed that people won't go see films with a Christian message or sensibility so they don't make them. But with each year that passes it becomes more obvious that this is not true. And more and more people who want this type of entertainment will take the initiative and produce it.

 

[CJR]

It has grossed 376 mil but the amount sony has actually made is much less after the production, post production, and marketing costs along with walden and the theaters getting their cut. The series has been earning less and less, that is why it is dying.

First, Fox co-produced Voyage of the Dawn Treader, not Sony. Second, Voyage of the Dawn Treader is already more profitable than Prince Caspian was.

Voyage of the Dawn Treader has made roughly 376 million and counting (it opens in Japan later this month) and had a budget of $155 million. Prince Caspian had a budget of $225 million and made $420 million.

Let me break it down for you. Taking the amount of money the movies have made minus the budget:
Prince Caspian: $195 million
Voyage of the Dawn Treader: $221 million and still counting

That's not dying. Sure less people saw it, but in terms of success, Dawn Treader is more successful.

Tron's not finished yet either, but unlike Narnia it doesn't have a set story to tell and is dependent on writing. The truth of the matter is that Disney kind of struck out on three releases this past year being Tron, The Sorcerer's Apprentice, and Prince of Persia. At least Narnia can say it reached that blockbuster status at least once. At its current gross levels, it's a guarantee that another Narnia film will be made. It's a tough call with Tron, although I think it will get a sequel after DVD/Blu-ray sales come in.

 

[Crazy Harry]

As far as I've heard, the next movie will likely have a larger real-world portion than the first two movies, if it happens, based on a supposed teaser trailer, which is entirely in the real world. I still can't see a sequel not having any segments taking place in the computer.

Anyway, a sequel (if made soon) would probably have a lower budget than the original. Aside from the possibility of needing less CGI, the design costs for the computer world will be far lower as it was already designed for the first movie.

You are making a lot of assumptions with your statements which is disappointing for someone who critisized another for not "looking at the facts". Your idea that the next movie would have more real world action than Tron world action is based on the rumor of an unconfirmed teaser trailer ?! :shrug: And considering a sequel is not yet greenlit, there would likely be no Tron world footage not already created because who would spend money on that? And how long is a teaser trailer, 2 minutes max? Even if it did take place entirely in the real world, do you really think 2 minutes is representative of the entire film? Do you really think half the film or more would take place in the real world? I doubt this highly. I would buy 40% real world 60% tron world at the most, otherwise I don't think you could justify a 3-d version which is where the film makes its money. Again, the computer world is the justification for the film series. It would be like Star Wars taking place on one planet.

Also, do you think the same computer system would be used for the new film? What if it was a different system much like the first film has a different system from the sequel, not to mention the new system was destroyed at the end of the film. This would nulify the notion that existing tron world sets could be utilized. I still think the next one could and should cost much less regardless.

 

[TinkIce]

Those of you wondering if Disney is going to do anything else with the Tron series, a new Disney XD show has already been greenlit and is in production: http://www.comingsoon.net/news/tvnews.php?id=71470

There's a "first look" for this show included on the Legacy DVD. There's a slew of famous people working on this show too, including the executive producers of LOST and the director of Powerpuff Girls and Samurai Jack. Elijah Wood, Mandy Moore, Paul Reubens, and Bruce Boxleitner are part of the voice cast.

I think this should put some doubts to rest for a while

 

[flavious27]

First, Fox co-produced Voyage of the Dawn Treader, not Sony. Second, Voyage of the Dawn Treader is already more profitable than Prince Caspian was.

Voyage of the Dawn Treader has made roughly 376 million and counting (it opens in Japan later this month) and had a budget of $155 million. Prince Caspian had a budget of $225 million and made $420 million.

Let me break it down for you. Taking the amount of money the movies have made minus the budget:
Prince Caspian: $195 million
Voyage of the Dawn Treader: $221 million and still counting

That's not dying. Sure less people saw it, but in terms of success, Dawn Treader is more successful.

Tron's not finished yet either, but unlike Narnia it doesn't have a set story to tell and is dependent on writing. The truth of the matter is that Disney kind of struck out on three releases this past year being Tron, The Sorcerer's Apprentice, and Prince of Persia. At least Narnia can say it reached that blockbuster status at least once. At its current gross levels, it's a guarantee that another Narnia film will be made. It's a tough call with Tron, although I think it will get a sequel after DVD/Blu-ray sales come in.

Sorry, Fox not sony.

The amounts are the gross revenues, it does not include the marketing costs or the post-production costs. Also, it does not include the amount of revenue that goes to the theaters. Commonly it gets broken down to 60% studios and 40% theaters. So fox/walden would get 225, minus the 155 for production would be 70 million. Fox and walden have spent 100 million to advertise the film, so they are in the hole $30 million.

As for comparing which of the two narnia sequels is more successful, it would be like comparing if the pirates or royals had a better decade.

Yes disney put out some stinkers but they aren't going to continue to make sequels to them. walden is going to continue to release narnia movies no matter how badly they perform.

 

[flavious27]

I never claimed it would out sell the first film. What I am saying is the sales will be good. Likely better than prince. Bottom line is that the movie has long since recouped production costs and every sale from now on is profit. There is still an opportunity to bring the franchise back strong. And if they do that and complete all seven films it will continue to succeed for decades.

Although in all truth the estate is not producing the films for profits sake and I think that is why Disney bailed on it ultimately.

My ultimate point is that movies like Narnia are viable. It has been claimed that people won't go see films with a Christian message or sensibility so they don't make them. But with each year that passes it becomes more obvious that this is not true. And more and more people who want this type of entertainment will take the initiative and produce it.

/\/\

The costs have not been recouped.

The domestic for narn3 was only 102 compared to 141 for narn2, the international draw was about the same. disney bailed because there aren't profits in a franchise that doesn't make money, there agenda is to make money not push agendas.

 

[xdan0920]

Those of you wondering if Disney is going to do anything else with the Tron series, a new Disney XD show has already been greenlit and is in production: http://www.comingsoon.net/news/tvnews.php?id=71470

There's a "first look" for this show included on the Legacy DVD. There's a slew of famous people working on this show too, including the executive producers of LOST and the director of Powerpuff Girls and Samurai Jack. Elijah Wood, Mandy Moore, Paul Reubens, and Bruce Boxleitner are part of the voice cast.

I think this should put some doubts to rest for a while

We were all pretty aware of this. It has nothing to do with making a new feature length movie though.

Sequels are almost always more expensive to produce, everyone involved gets a raise. Will Disney be willing to spend 200 million on production alone for a 3rd Tron film? I don't know.

 

[lebeau]

Those of you wondering if Disney is going to do anything else with the Tron series, a new Disney XD show has already been greenlit and is in production: http://www.comingsoon.net/news/tvnews.php?id=71470

There's a "first look" for this show included on the Legacy DVD. There's a slew of famous people working on this show too, including the executive producers of LOST and the director of Powerpuff Girls and Samurai Jack. Elijah Wood, Mandy Moore, Paul Reubens, and Bruce Boxleitner are part of the voice cast.

I think this should put some doubts to rest for a while

Yeah, this is old news. No one was debating the cartoon.

I expect that it will be the lifeblood of the Tron franchise in the years to come much as Clone Wars is what currently keeps the Star Wars franchise vital. Of course, when the cartoon eventually runs out of gas, I'm not sure there will be anything to follow.

The cartoon would have to be ridiculously successful to have much of an impact on the development of a feature film sequel.

Tron fans really need to quit trying to spin everything Tron into verfication that Tron 3 is happening. Tron 3 may happen. But it is anything but a sure thing. And most of the things fans are holding up as proof are completely unrelated to getting Tron 3 made.

If you want to see Tron 3, buy lots of BluRays of Tron 2 and give them out as gifts.

 

[jt04]

/\/\

The costs have not been recouped.

The domestic for narn3 was only 102 compared to 141 for narn2, the international draw was about the same. disney bailed because there aren't profits in a franchise that doesn't make money, there agenda is to make money not push agendas.

Way to back up your claim with actual numbers that make sense.:brick:

Master Yoda and I had this discussion (in the appropriate forum I might add). We used actual numbers and math and everything. Perhaps you might want to read it.

 

[flavious27]

Way to back up your claim with actual numbers that make sense.:brick:

Master Yoda and I had this discussion (in the appropriate forum I might add). We used actual numbers and math and everything. Perhaps you might want to read it.

I read it, you mention rules of thumb but not the actual numbers. As I stated the production was rumored to be 155, the advertising budget was 100; these add up to 255. This cost does not factor in the printing of the movies which averages 2k for each print; factoring in 2 prints per the 3,555 theaters at its widest release, that cost is 14.2 million. This puts the expenses of the movie at 269.2.

Now you mentioned the studio gets 50 - 55 % back, so fox/walden received anywhere between 188 and 206; this puts the loss at between 81 and 63. Walden and Fox might break even if the home media sales are the same that prince had at 78 million, though I doubt it will with less business in the theaters.

 

[jt04]

I read it, you mention rules of thumb but not the actual numbers. As I stated the production was rumored to be 155, the advertising budget was 100; these add up to 255. This cost does not factor in the printing of the movies which averages 2k for each print; factoring in 2 prints per the 3,555 theaters at its widest release, that cost is 14.2 million. This puts the expenses of the movie at 269.2.

Now you mentioned the studio gets 50 - 55 % back, so fox/walden received anywhere between 188 and 206; this puts the loss at between 81 and 63. Walden and Fox might break even if the home media sales are the same that prince had at 78 million, though I doubt it will with less business in the theaters.

Often marketing and distribution costs are included in the announced budget. Do you have actual sources for you budgetary numbers?

 

[lebeau]

Often marketing and distribution costs are included in the announced budget. Do you have actual sources for you budgetary numbers?

Good luck sorting out studio accounting even if you had the numbers in front of you! It's more art than science.