Time to stop all this "Eisner is cheap" crap!

imagineer99

New Member
Originally posted by barnum42
Eisner smells of wee.



There.....glad I could fix that omission :animwink:

Uh...oh...it's beginning to start...

This thread isn't gonna exist much longer, so you better read it fast.:lol:
 

garyhoov

Trophy Husband
On the subject of Disney stock: That seems to be the single best quantifiable argument for Eisner’s removal.

Disney Stock performance has been, over the past five years, frankly terrible.

Look at this chart:

Disney Stock Vs. S & P 500

The chart is based on percentage gain, so stock splits are removed from the equation. If you invested $10,000 dollars in Disney stock 10 years ago, you would have approximately $15,000 today. If you invested the same amount in a basic, S & P 500 index fund, you’d have approximately $24,000.

If you had invested $10,000 in Disney 5 or 6 years ago, you’d be sharply into negative numbers and calling for Eisner's head.
 

no2apprentice

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by PeterAlt
In other words, you dislike Eisner not because of his business acumen but because you feel that his morals are different than yours.
Don't make the mistake of putting words into my post.

It's not a matter of morals. It's a matter of a company that has always set a standard for quality family entertainment. To me (and others), sacrificing that standard to help the bottom line (and because he wanted to be a media-mogul) by those aforementioned acquisitions, is a bad business decision.

Originally posted by PeterAlt
So the reason why people, such as yourself, dislike Eisner has gone from the way he runs the company, which you're admitting he's doing a good job at,
Nope, wrong. I said that Eisner did a great deal of good in the beginning of his leadership, and some years after, but is now going in the wrong direction.

And I don't dislike Eisner. How can I dislike someone I've never met (other than terroists, serial killers, rapists, and child molesters)? I just dislike some of his business decisions.

And for those who keep focusing on what Eisner has done for the parks, consider this: what more could have been done at the parks without money being diverted from their profits to help out the ABC mess?
 

Since1976

Well-Known Member
I agree that this board has become a place for bashing.

However, I don't think we are just bashing Eisner, but the current state of Disney itself.

I think that Roy Disney should be applauded for having the guts to speak out about what many of us Disney fans were privately thinking.

For example, even though I enjoyed my August 2002 trip to WDW, I felt that something was noticeably lacking. I couldn't quite out my finger on it. It was only after sitting back and taking it all in that I realized that the park had dropped down a couple of notches on the creativity, maintenance and hospitality scale. True, the quality of Disney is still above that of most vacation spots, but any slides in quality now can only lead to bigger and more obvious ones later.
 

KevinPage

Well-Known Member
Since1976,

I agree, one of the main reasons I moved to the WDW area was so I am able to visit the parks anytime I want.

I have a season pass and go all the time, but it has taken a hit over the years in regards to the issues you mentioned. Granted, Disney is still way ahead of it's competition, but is that good enough? Are we supposed to just "settle" for being better?

Disney has made a living (and a fortune) at being SUPERIOR in more ways than one over anyone else. That is the standard they set, and one I am thankful for.

But current management philosophy is trying to make past profits with a huge decline in service. Why is that? Well they won't invest the money the parks make into the park themselves. Eisner is too busy trying to fix ABC and any other misstep he made over the years.

I'm even willing to excuse this if it was done PROPERLY and/or for short term. But the drain on Disneys core business has been eroding for years.
 

brisem

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by lebernadin
saying "but they lost pixar!" over...and over...just lets everyone know you've developed the opinion, verbatim, of someone else on a messageboard and you didn't even bother to read up on the subject before making the post.


Thank you for pointing that out.
 

cherrynegra

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Since1976
I agree that this board has become a place for bashing.

However, I don't think we are just bashing Eisner, but the current state of Disney itself.

I think that Roy Disney should be applauded for having the guts to speak out about what many of us Disney fans were privately thinking.

For example, even though I enjoyed my August 2002 trip to WDW, I felt that something was noticeably lacking. I couldn't quite out my finger on it. It was only after sitting back and taking it all in that I realized that the park had dropped down a couple of notches on the creativity, maintenance and hospitality scale. True, the quality of Disney is still above that of most vacation spots, but any slides in quality now can only lead to bigger and more obvious ones later.


Here Here!! I could not have said it more succintly. Listen, the man has been in control for twenty years. Twenty years!! Yes, he did some great things for the company in his early years, but it's these past years which have really shown that he has lost the vision and IMAGINATION needed to run the Disney empire. And this whole shizoid mentality of running Disney, (Get rid of 2d animation....on second thought maybe we shouldn't have) is just driving away all of the imaginative people that have helped to make Disney what it is. They may have quantity in terms of having multiple parks, and tv stations, and recording studios, and sports teams, and cruise lines, etc. But quantity is not QUALITY. It's time to pull back, return to the roots, spirit, and heritage of Disney, with a new leader at the helm of the empire.
 

brisem

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by garyhoov
On the subject of Disney stock: That seems to be the single best quantifiable argument for Eisner’s removal.

Disney Stock performance has been, over the past five years, frankly terrible.

Look at this chart:

Disney Stock Vs. S & P 500

The chart is based on percentage gain, so stock splits are removed from the equation. If you invested $10,000 dollars in Disney stock 10 years ago, you would have approximately $15,000 today. If you invested the same amount in a basic, S & P 500 index fund, you’d have approximately $24,000.

If you had invested $10,000 in Disney 5 or 6 years ago, you’d be sharply into negative numbers and calling for Eisner's head.



The fairest way to compare it to is how's it did in its sector--travel/entertainment. Once you do your research then come back.

Remember the S&P is a compose of all stocks in every sector. The last few years, travel has been the worst sector.

Yet if the performance of Disney stock is as bad as you state then
1) Disney still makes a profit.
2) Why is Disney dividends consistance we over blue chips
3) Why is Disney still a top institution buy
4) If this stock isn't performing why have the institution that invest in the company ask for Eisner resignation? Instead they're supporting him.

From all the press that Roy and Stan has received, it's funny that no major stockholder or institution is supporting them.
 

brisem

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by cherrynegra
But quantity is not QUALITY. It's time to pull back, return to the roots, spirit, and heritage of Disney, with a new leader at the helm of the empire.

If you watched the last 6 months--Eisner been selling off non-core products. The Angels were sold. Celebration sold. Disney Stores and Mighty Ducks--on the market.
 

cherrynegra

Well-Known Member
Well of course no stockholder institution will support them. Let's support the status quo, squeeze the last penny out of them, and then dump 'em when something better comes along. Leaving those who love Disney with all the pieces to put back together. I agree that in the end Disney is a corporation and a business and you have to run it that way. However, neglecting the needs and wants of your longtime core group of customers just to earn some quick dollars is just irresponsible in my book. You can't just think short term. You have to think long term. And trust me. I've worked for some people who ran their companies and couldn't see past their noses. What happened?? Music playing on the decks of Titanic.

I'm curious as to how much decline in the quality of the Disney empire people are willing to put up with as long as their stock performs reasonably well and they still get profit from it. "My stock just slipped!! Cut more jobs in the parks!! Who cares if it isn't maintained. Release more third rate direct to videos!! Bring back Regis to ABC!!" You get the picture.
 

imagineer boy

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Meyers
I'm not so sure Jay Rasulo deserves a hand. He was in charge of EuroDisney and Walt Disney Studios trying to unsuccessfully resolve all their problems.

His recent statements tend to downplay major attractions and focus more show entertainment and marketing have me question his thinking.

I don't think he even was part of the walk around team with Iger and Ouimet that resulted in that 50% increase in attractions budgets for DL. I give Ouiment 100% credit for this.

I think Rasulo is just a small time clone of Eisner. I hope Ouimet eventually replaces him, if not Eisner himself. Roy and Stanley back on the Board along with the Saudi prince who saved DLP resort.

Well the studios isn't in as a bad of shape as DCA. Keep in mind that Paul Pressler was in charge of the theme parks when the studios opened and the budget wasn't good enough, so I think Rasulo did his best on the studios under the wrath of Pressler. Besides, once Rasulo came on, more better quality attractions were put in WDW like, E: E, Soarin ( only to be sliced up by Eisner ), and the Stitch escape. Pressler would have never approved of these "too expensive things" ( in Pressler's mind ). Rasulo tried to help the failing DL resort, but Cynthia Harriss wouldn't have it. Rasulo demanded more kids attractions in DCA, Harriss responded with a cheap kids area ( bug's land ). Now she's gone, and and Rasulo and Ouimet are doing the best!:sohappy:
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
Originally posted by brisem


From all the press that Roy and Stan has received, it's funny that no major stockholder or institution is supporting them.

Assuming that the US institutions are similar to the UK thats hardly surprising. Some funds here have admitted now that they’ll only invest for a max of 8 months. So long term visions like Roys are of no interest to the corporate gamblers who’ll be looking for a quick return (and a nice bonus).
I take it youve heard the phrase "never bite the hand that feeds you".
 

garyhoov

Trophy Husband
Originally posted by brisem
The fairest way to compare it to is how's it did in its sector--travel/entertainment. Once you do your research then come back.


I'd certainly be interested in seeing charts for travel and entertainment sectors vs. Disney. Do you have any? Not sure why it's my responsibility since you're the one raising the question.

Oh, and you can feel free to come back with or without that information. This is an open forum that thrives on opinions and I value your opinion with or without detailed research.


:wave:
 

brisem

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by Pumbas Nakasak
So long term visions like Roys are of no interest to the corporate gamblers who’ll be looking for a quick return (and a nice bonus).
I take it youve heard the phrase "never bite the hand that feeds you".

Roy has yet to give a vision. In fact he hasn't given any solutions. The only thing he's said is get rid of Eisner. I would love to see him offering solutions.
 

SpongeScott

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by mkt
beer anyone?

don't make me drift this thread
Well, if I drank (which I don't) I would be afraid to ask for a beer because it might be the kind that Roy favors or the kind that Michael drinks and then we'll start a new fight.....er, discussion.

Gotta any A & W?
 

jodez21

New Member
Originally posted by Dizknee_Phreek
bottom line, Eisner has needlessly cost the company millions, maybe even billions of dollars. and yeah, all CEO's make mistakes, but do they keep the mistakes around for years? for example, the Angels, the Mighty Ducks, ABC...Eisner should have learned from these and corrected them a LONG time ago, but they're still around.

i just have a question on this.. didnt the angels win the penant a few years back, and didnt the ducks just go all the way to the stanely cup finals last year? im not sure (dont get me wrong im not tryin to put u down or nething) but wouldnt this boost sales of tickets, products, ect, therefore making money, therefore being a success? this is just a thought, im not sure on it by ne means, mayb the companys have lost in the long run or something, but i dunno, just a thought. But.. imho i believe that buying sports teams was a mistake for the disney company. disney is a movie/tv/ect company, buying the teams where just an attempt to expand way more. i think that the company has expanded wayyy too much already, and should just make good with wat it has.

on other note, great post.. at first wen i found the news about roy i was really angered at eistner and thought he was evil. but then thanks to disscusions like these i relized that he wasnt evil, and i thought he was really great. but now im just sittin on the middle of the fence.. all thanks to disscusions like these for informing me and giving me more knowledge on the situation. eistner, roy, whoever, i could careless as long as the company isnt falling apart or nething, and as long as the magic kingdom doesnt close! :p !
 

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