News Tiana's Bayou Adventure - latest details and construction progress

flynnibus

Premium Member
What I am saying is that the main story itself—with or without that extra context—lacks tension and tonal variety. Experiencing the queue doesn’t change or mitigate that.
That's not what what you challenged in _celab's post, nor what you asked of me... so I don't think we're talking cross purpose, I think you are moving the goal posts. You didn't critique the story's depth, you challenged why he mentioned the queue in a challenge to opinions formed about the first video.

You challenged why he mentioned the significance of not including the queue in the first video released, and you asked me to "specify which key ideas the queue sets up for the ride?" after calling the queue "entirely divorced from and irrelevant to the story of the ride"

The queue's setup helps introduce the ride's story. The story is still horrible, but the queue is part of the supporting cast for it.
 

TheCoasterNerd

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
I L❤️VE it! Knew Disney would nail it right. Tiana is my favorite Disney Princess. I can't wait to experience TBA for myself!
"Bot!" "You're just wrong!" "No." "How dare you!" "But... but Splash Mountain!!" "No, but, but, but there's screens!" "But..."
^this site, probably.

All jokes aside, really glad you like it. I love it as well. Welcome to the boards!!
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
That's not what what you challenged in _celab's post, nor what you asked of me... so I don't think we're talking cross purpose, I think you are moving the goal posts. You didn't critique the story's depth, you challenged why he mentioned the queue in a challenge to opinions formed about the first video.

You challenged why he mentioned the significance of not including the queue in the first video released, and you asked me to "specify which key ideas the queue sets up for the ride?" after calling the queue "entirely divorced from and irrelevant to the story of the ride"

The queue's setup helps introduce the ride's story. The story is still horrible, but the queue is part of the supporting cast for it.
I challenged the claim that knowledge of the queue backstory does anything to address the criticisms of the ride’s narrative deficiencies. I have been quite clear and consistent in that point, even if you somehow missed it.

I’ve already conceded that I overstated the queue’s irrelevance to the main ride in my initial reply, so in that particular regard, you are right to call me out.
 

Drew the Disney Dude

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
Regarding my "quote" in the NYT article, the article, unfortunately, directly quotes me when I never said those exact words.

I had a 5 minute long conversation with Brooks in person outside of the ride on June 3, and he took notes on our conversation, yet never had an exact transcript of what I said.

I emailed him on June 5 offering a transcript if he wanted a quote, because I was afraid this was going to happen.

I expected him to talk about my experience documenting the attraction, which was the main reason for our conversation after he heard me talking to Ted Robledo, yet that is not what's in the article.

Here's a screenshot of the email I sent to him on June 5:
Screenshot_20240613_143659_Gmail.jpg
 

Brer Oswald

Well-Known Member
I find this quite a confusing point to make... because the VAST VAST majority of riders had no clue about the characters in Splash... Most people under 40 probably never heard of brer rabbit before getting on the ride.. and certainly didn't know the tales the ride takes an abbreviated version of.

The story isn't setup.. or even laid out.. it's just more the story relies on constructs and notions that people can pickup on without explicit exposition.

They could just digest the very simple construct of a rabbit.. being a smaller less aggressive animal... being pursued by a fox and a bear... animals known to be predators.. and there are caricatures of those prenotions that play out... the rabbit is setup to be witty and outsmart the dumb clumsy bear and stubborn fox.

The characters presented traits and prototypes people are familiar with.. so it's not difficult for them to pick up and follow them with a few rides.. even if they don't know the actual source material and don't need a real setup.

The ride never sets up why the fox wants to catch brer rabbit... or that the rabbit keeps outwitting the fox and bear.. you just see the outcomes usually of these adventures.. except when it comes to the final outtwitting of the briar patch.

I mean.. the very notion the story ISN'T very explicit is the mask the ride was able to use to it's advantage to avoid scrutiny for so long. The fact the basic constructs of the critters and their conflict can be illustrated and be cute... without getting into their larger batch of stories.

The challenge with Tiana's story is... it's so trivial it's what you tell a baby to excite a smile... "lets goto the party!" over and over while smiling and clapping your hands.
The ride absolutely set up the characters. First lift hill, Brer Frog is telling stories about Brer Rabbit, saying he’s looking for adventure, but Brer Frog thinks he’s heading for trouble.

Second lift hill, you’re introduce to the world of the critters. Brer Rabbit and Brer Bear’s houses are labeled. Brer Rabbit is singing the song energetically. Brer Bear is snoozing. Paints the type of characters they are before you even see it.

The first scene with the Brers, you have Fox scheming about trying to catch the rabbit. He has a book labelled “How to catch a Rabbit” right next to him. Why is he trying to catch a rabbit? He’s a fox. You aren’t going to ask why a cat would chase a mouse.

Yeah it’s simple and relies on preconceived constructs, but there still is setup. It’s told through dialogue, visual cues, musical lyrics, scene composition, etc. I had no pre-existing knowledge of the characters and stories, yet I still got the gist of it and fell in love with the attraction because of its theming on my first ride. And here’s the kicker… I COULDN’T EVEN SEE PROPERLY 😂. I rode without my glasses. Most things were blurry.
 

IanDLBZF

Well-Known Member
Tried for the VQ at 1:00 and nothing. It was closed as soon as it opened.
It was only open for like a couple of seconds. I’ve had good luck with the Tron virtual queue for extended evening hours once in July of last year. Heard it lasted for 6 seconds that night.
 

SilentWindODoom

Well-Known Member
I challenged the claim that knowledge of the queue backstory does anything to address the criticisms of the ride’s narrative deficiencies. I have been quite clear and consistent in that point, even if you somehow missed it.

As I alluded to (although my main focus was on that people did make the comment you thought I was suggesting you were making), the queue does not build tension more than the conflict of finding a band. You are correct there.

But the language of story and "narrative deficiencies" sounds more like the story itself is missing or lacking, as opposed to the tone of the story. It's all just a misunderstanding.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
As I alluded to (although my main focus was on that people did make the comment you thought I was suggesting you were making), the queue does not build tension more than the conflict of finding a band. You are correct there.

But the language of story and "narrative deficiencies" sounds more like the story itself is missing or lacking, as opposed to the tone of the story. It's all just a misunderstanding.
I have tried to be as clear and specific in my criticisms as possible, though I apologise if I left any room for misunderstanding.
 

tiger04

Member
Just throwing my two cents in as I was able to ride several times yesterday. It seems I got lucky because even though TBA was down in the morning when my preview was supposed to start, it reopened before 11:30 am and I had no glitches on my rides.

Overall, I thought it was pretty but pointless. The random spaces between character scenes in the bayou were strange as it was just dead space and there was a bit of an uncanny valley element when you saw the Tiana and Louie figures just standing in the distance waiting to animate as you got closer. And each time the lift caught me off guard that we were already there so for some reason it feels shorter than Splash.

I rode with someone who has not paid any attention to the online discourse, nor any of the blog posts about animal musicians or weather vanes, and at the end of the first ride she said “I like it but it’s not Splash”. It just felt like a downgrade and oddly lifeless in comparison. Which is unfortunate.

That said I enjoyed the animatronics when they finally talked to you, and the last party scene was pretty, and I think people will enjoy it. Weirdly I got completely soaked in the front row so that was fun if you want to cool down!

But I just wish TBA had something to make it pop as opposed to just being okay, as I think the bones of Splash Mountain and a new Tiana-themed attraction deserved better.
 

lightningtap347

Well-Known Member
Just throwing my two cents in as I was able to ride several times yesterday. It seems I got lucky because even though TBA was down in the morning when my preview was supposed to start, it reopened before 11:30 am and I had no glitches on my rides.

Overall, I thought it was pretty but pointless. The random spaces between character scenes in the bayou were strange as it was just dead space and there was a bit of an uncanny valley element when you saw the Tiana and Louie figures just standing in the distance waiting to animate as you got closer. And each time the lift caught me off guard that we were already there so for some reason it feels shorter than Splash.

I rode with someone who has not paid any attention to the online discourse, nor any of the blog posts about animal musicians or weather vanes, and at the end of the first ride she said “I like it but it’s not Splash”. It just felt like a downgrade and oddly lifeless in comparison. Which is unfortunate.

That said I enjoyed the animatronics when they finally talked to you, and the last party scene was pretty, and I think people will enjoy it. Weirdly I got completely soaked in the front row so that was fun if you want to cool down!

But I just wish TBA had something to make it pop as opposed to just being okay, as I think the bones of Splash Mountain and a new Tiana-themed attraction deserved better.
How did you ride multiple times?
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
The ride absolutely set up the characters. First lift hill, Brer Frog is telling stories about Brer Rabbit, saying he’s looking for adventure, but Brer Frog thinks he’s heading for trouble.

Second lift hill, you’re introduce to the world of the critters. Brer Rabbit and Brer Bear’s houses are labeled. Brer Rabbit is singing the song energetically. Brer Bear is snoozing. Paints the type of characters they are before you even see it.
Putting names on buildings is not explaining the story - it is introducing labels.

The first scene with the Brers, you have Fox scheming about trying to catch the rabbit. He has a book labelled “How to catch a Rabbit” right next to him. Why is he trying to catch a rabbit? He’s a fox. You aren’t going to ask why a cat would chase a mouse.
Except the real story is more than 'fox hunting for food' - it's about revenge for being outwitted. It's just not told in this exposition in the ride... because the ride is more a brief vignette of several of the brer rabbit stories.

Yeah it’s simple and relies on preconceived constructs, but there still is setup. It’s told through dialogue, visual cues, musical lyrics, scene composition, etc. I had no pre-existing knowledge of the characters and stories, yet I still got the gist of it and fell in love with the attraction because of its theming on my first ride.
I'm sure you enjoyed it - but that's different from understanding the story or even catching the significance of things.. especially on a first or limited # ride throughs. The ride relies heavily on single key audio lines connecting the scenes.. lines many don't even hear, let alone key off of. The story details are there, but hard to pick out in the ride for the casual observer - not just 'those who chose to ignore it'.

The key was riders didn't need the story line to enjoy the attraction given it's cute scenes, recognizable prototypes, family-oriented thrill aspects, and overall breadth of presentation. Basically the ride can sustain itself without the audience even fully connecting with the context or continuity. Relying on simple constructs like humor and established prototypes helps that. It's why most people get off saying they love Splash Mountain, but had a hard time communicating anything about it except for referencing the visual scenes and drops. They get the basics of the rabbit being chased, and escaping.. notable characters.. and that's about it.

Regardless... it's gone now. But let's not take fandom and spin new recollections of what was prior. The story continuity in Splash prior was subtle... and generally not understood by most... but it's excellence was in it's ability to entertain, even without the audience getting a full buy-in to the reasoning or tale being told. HM is another version of that.. where there isn't a heavy need for a 'plot' because its more of a lead through than a traditional story arc. Splash has a defined line of the stories, it's just not 'mandatory learning'... nor is missing the story creating conflict for the audience.

Tiana's has a story.. but unlike Splash.. it creates conflict in the audience because the story itself is kinda aloof.

IMO they would have been better off to lean more heavily into the Mardi Gras lead up and purpose to setup the party.. and introduce the conflict about party being at risk... the audience is kinda left hanging about significance or how there is a gap that needs filling and is thrown right into 'we need to fix this'... but the why and even 'fixes' themselves are kinda conflicting. When you need to key off a single audio line.. you really set yourself up problems where so many won't get that line.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
All which was corrected with OTHER videos released within days. So why do we keep harping back to the first Disney video as why everyone hates everything and pointing out it's flaws? It's not the data point everyone is limited too.. so it's limitations have been passed.
The reason I keep bringing it up is because that POV video is what led to a flurry of comments here. People were forming opinions based on it BEFORE other/better videos were available, and there was something of a snowball effect. For many, it seemed that the initial negative impression, combined with previous biases (based on marketing, ideology, expectations, nostalgia, etc.) colored their impressions even of later POVs. This isn't true of everyone, but enough people that I noticed and thought it worth discussing.
Sorry this is just making excuses - give your audience more credit - they are capable of forming new opinions with new information.
I'm not sure what I'd be excusing... I try to give people credit. I'm just commenting on what I saw in the thread.
Your argument could be 'first impressions...' but instead you take it to the level to believe no one could get past those and everything is flawed because they can't get past that. That's you trying to spin... instead of giving people credit for taking in all the other information.. not just the day 0 video.
I'm not trying to spin anything. I'm interested in the response of the fandom, so I'm just describing what I'm seeing.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
The reason I keep bringing it up is because that POV video is what led to a flurry of comments here. People were forming opinions based on it BEFORE other/better videos were available, and there was something of a snowball effect. For many, it seemed that the initial negative impression, combined with previous biases (based on marketing, ideology, expectations, nostalgia, etc.) colored their impressions even of later POVs. This isn't true of everyone, but enough people that I noticed and thought it worth discussing.
Yet you claim to be giving people 'credit' - yet here you outline how you ASSUME their actions SINCE must be 'previous biases' and keep pointing at old data while you don't even know what information they have or have not consumed.

You're going backwards where everyone else has moved on... you should try it to. The Disney POV video is ancient history at this point - it's not binding anyone.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
Yet you claim to be giving people 'credit' - yet here you outline how you ASSUME their actions SINCE must be 'previous biases' and keep pointing at old data while you don't even know what information they have or have not consumed.

You're going backwards where everyone else has moved on... you should try it to. The Disney POV video is ancient history at this point - it's not binding anyone.
You just posted a really great post showing how the details in the queue set up the story of the ride. Why did you feel the need to make that post? Why didn't you give people credit that they knew what was in the queue and just disagreed that it had any connection to the ride?

(To answer my own question:) I assume it's because you thought, as I did, that some folks had formed their opinions without being informed by that information.

I think the POV was a major blunder on Disney's part, as it presented the ride poorly by amplifying some of its weaknesses and hiding some of its strengths. You're free to disagree that the POV was that significant.

It may be true that everyone has moved on, but I'm still getting texts from non-Disney parks nerds who are sharing that POV and saying, "Have you seen this yet?" So I think it's still influencing people's first impressions.
 

The Mom

Moderator
Premium Member
3. Be courteous and respect your fellow members. To be clear, personal attacks, aggressive messages, and passive-aggressive behavior is unacceptable. If you take particular issue with another user and are unable to reply in a civilised and constructive way to their posts, you should ignore the user.

Just a reminder.
 

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