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Rumor Swan and Dolphin Tower Expansion - Height Balloon Testing by Fantasia Gardens

MisterPenguin

Rumormonger
Premium Member
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So, this new resort will actually be taller than the Dolphin & Swan, both of which are 12 story structures.
It will only be slightly taller than the main bodies of the Swan and Dolphin. The Swan statues will be higher than the top of the new building. And the triangle part of the Dolphin will tower another 100 feet over the new building.
 

MisterPenguin

Rumormonger
Premium Member
What we know…

Owner: Tishman Real Estate and MetLife Investment
  • They already own the Swan and Dolphin
  • Their lease of the property (which Disney still owns) is up in 2041 and can be renewed two times for 25 years each for a total of 101 years (other sources say it’s a 99 year lease)
  • They are seeking financing of a 7-year, $627 million loan
    • $180 million of the loan is for the new hotel, the rest to refinance existing debt.
The Swan and Dolphin
  • The Swolphin generated $25 million profit in 2016 and $35.5 million in 2017
  • 2,270 existing rooms: 1510 in Dolphin, 760 in Swan
  • 329,000 square feet meeting space
  • Dolphin just had a renovation of it’s lobby, Swan will undergo a $3 million one, too, by the end of 2018
  • Occupancy rate in 2017 was 91%
  • both had recent room renovations in the past few years
  • both run by Marriott (which bought out SPG which bought out Westin and Sheraton, the previous managers of the Swolphin… brand distinction at that level is now nearly extinct, in practice)
The new Hotel
  • It is being built in agreement with Disney
  • 14 stories (about 50 meters)
  • 349 room hotel
    • 198 traditional rooms
    • 151 suites with private executive high-tech meeting spaces
  • Restaurant: 75 seats / 50 seats lounge / additional space (guessing for banquets)
  • a different source: A rooftop restaurant will seat 375 guests as well as an additional 40 at the bar (the difference may be because of the banqueting availability)
  • Fitness center: full service health club, private changing rooms
  • Outdoor space: on the side facing away from the Swolphin
    • 16,800 square foot elevated deck
    • lushly landscaped
    • fire pit
    • 90-foot long pool, 2,500 square feet
  • Conference rooms
    • over 21,000 square feet on three floors
    • including top floor with nightly fireworks viewing of DHS and Epcot
  • Opens in 2020
  • aiming for a “best in class” experience. (🤷‍♂️?)
  • The parking lot will have 321 spaces with 50 reserved for miniature golfing.
Unknowns:
  • Name of the new hotel
  • confirmation that Marriott will run it and under which of their brands
Tidbits:
  • The size of their outdoor space and length of pool matches the leaked layout:
1536627288254.png

  • The Swan has half the rooms the Dolphin. The new tower has half the rooms of the Swan. If Tishman keeps the pattern going, building another hotel with half the rooms of the new tower, and another with half the rooms of that and so on, you get the infinite series {1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8...} which is equal to twice the number of rooms of the Dolphin. We're on to your sneaky plans, Tishman!
 
Last edited:

MisterPenguin

Rumormonger
Premium Member
Interesting discussion...

It isn't related to mini golf.
It isn't a parking garage either.
What if I said there are plans for a third guest room tower for the Swolphin complex?
Jim Hill says this will be a CM parking garage...
Jim is incorrect
Am told this is a parking garage and will start ... soonish.
No, and it still seems like very valuable property for a garage. I am suspicious.
Sorry about the thread bump, but just got some info on this. It will be a new hotel tower. It is NOT an extension of the Swan & Dolphin. That is basically all I know.
 

Robbiem

Well-Known Member
What we know…
  • The Swan has half the rooms the Dolphin. The new tower has half the rooms of the Swan. If Tishman keeps the pattern going, building another hotel with half the rooms of the new tower, and another with half the rooms of that and so on, you get the infinite series {1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8...} which is equal to twice the number of rooms of the Dolphin. We're on to your sneaky plans, Tishman!
Maybe they should retheme the resorts to Russian dolls 😀
 

Ripken10

Well-Known Member
What we know…

Owner: Tishman Real Estate and MetLife Investment
  • They already own the Swan and Dolphin
  • Their lease of the property (which Disney still owns) is up in 2041 and can be renewed two times for 25 years each for a total of 101 years (other sources say it’s a 99 year lease)
  • They are seeking financing of a 7-year, $627 million loan
    • $180 million of the loan is for the new hotel, the rest to refinance existing debt.
The Swan and Dolphin
  • The Swolphin generated $25 million profit in 2016 and $35.5 million in 2017
  • 2,270 existing rooms: 1510 in Dolphin, 760 in Swan
  • 329,000 square feet meeting space
  • Dolphin just had a renovation of it’s lobby, Swan will undergo a $3 million one, too, by the end of 2018
  • Occupancy rate in 2017 was 91%
  • both had recent room renovations in the past few years
  • both run by Marriott (which bought out SPG which bought out Westin and Sheraton, the previous managers of the Swolphin… brand distinction at that level is now nearly extinct, in practice)
The new Hotel
  • It is being built in agreement with Disney
  • 14 stories (about 50 meters)
  • 349 room hotel
    • 198 traditional rooms
    • 151 suites with private executive high-tech meeting spaces
  • Restaurant: 75 seats / 50 seats lounge / additional space (guessing for banquets)
  • Fitness center: full service health club, private changing rooms
  • Outdoor space: on the side facing away from the Swolphin
    • 16,800 square foot elevated deck
    • lushly landscaped
    • fire pit
    • 90-foot long pool
  • Conference rooms
    • over 21,000 square feet on three floors
    • including top floor with nightly fireworks viewing of DHS and Epcot
  • Opens in 2020
  • aiming for a “best in class” experience. (🤷‍♂️?)
Unknowns:
  • Name of the new hotel
  • confirmation that Marriott will run it and under which of their brands
Tidbits:
  • The size of their outdoor space and length of pool matches the leaked layout:
View attachment 312114

  • The Swan has half the rooms the Dolphin. The new tower has half the rooms of the Swan. If Tishman keeps the pattern going, building another hotel with half the rooms of the new tower, and another with half the rooms of that and so on, you get the infinite series {1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8...} which is equal to twice the number of rooms of the Dolphin. We're on to your sneaky plans, Tishman!
I guess it amounts to being insignificant in the grand scheme of things but this hotel will have rooftop fireworks viewing area, the Riviera will have rooftop fireworks area, you already have a few hotels that have firework viewing areas (Top of the world lounge for instance)...even if it's small, it still is that many less people fighting for places to watch nighttime shows in the parks...
 

eddie104

Well-Known Member
In my opinion the Swan and Dolphin is the most out of place resort on Disney property however it provides an alternative to the more traditionally themed hotels.
 
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