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News Splash Mountain retheme to Princess and the Frog - attraction discussion only

_caleb

Well-Known Member
You don't think this helped? Do you think all people get information from Disney blogs and twitter? I am sorry, but the ones that follow Disney news, already knew. This reaches a much wider audience.
How do you think Disney made the announcement?
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
Disney makes a lot of announcements, but this one made the national news. You think only Disney followers heard about it?
Of course not. I’m just saying that Disney’s announcement was as much in response to the information about the link between Splash and SotS that was already spreading far and wide through social media. And that there isn’t much difference between “social media” and “national news.”

I don’t think it was mostly uber Disley fans who knew about the connection until Disney’s big announcement. I think there was a growing number of people who already knew about it, and Disney’s announcement (by design) pretty much only registered with those who already knew.
 

EagleScout610

Well-Known Member
Of course not. I’m just saying that Disney’s announcement was as much in response to the information about the link between Splash and SotS that was already spreading far and wide through social media. And that there isn’t much difference between “social media” and “national news.”

I don’t think it was mostly uber Disley fans who knew about the connection until Disney’s big announcement. I think there was a growing number of people who already knew about it, and Disney’s announcement (by design) pretty much only registered with those who already knew.
I'm pretty sure it was always acknowledged but kept on the downlow at the same time the connection between Splash and SoTs. Heck, the Long Lost Friends event had the characters branded under Song of the South instead of Splash Mountain
 

NelsonRD

Well-Known Member
Of course not. I’m just saying that Disney’s announcement was as much in response to the information about the link between Splash and SotS that was already spreading far and wide through social media. And that there isn’t much difference between “social media” and “national news.”

I don’t think it was mostly uber Disley fans who knew about the connection until Disney’s big announcement. I think there was a growing number of people who already knew about it, and Disney’s announcement (by design) pretty much only registered with those who already knew.
I am sorry, but there is a huge difference between social media and national news.

And no, Disney made the announcement to comply with the current buzz word of the year.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
I am sorry, but there is a huge difference between social media and national news.
Obviously this conversation is just going in circles. Where do you think people get their “national news?”

Think about the sheer amount of content on the internet )prior to Disney’s June 23rd announcement) that made the connection between the ride and the film. YouTube videos, ”exposé“ blog posts, news articles, Facebook rants, Tweets, TickTok, Instagram posts, etc. Nevermind Disney’s own acknowledgment of the connections.

Then consider the reach of that content (how many people became aware of that the ride was based on the film) as a result of that content. Then consider how the film’s exclusion from Disney+ drew even more attention to the topic.

Now, compare that to how many people learned about the connection via Disney’s Press Release (on it’s own website) about the change— or even “national media” coverage of that announcement.

Then be sure to subtract anyone who has not and will never visited WDW.
And no, Disney made the announcement to comply with the current buzz word of the year.
Unless you are a Disney exec or a member of the marketing team, this is a conspiracy theory. It also tells me all I need to know about your worldview to know that responding to you probably isn’t a good idea.
 

Homemade Imagineering

Well-Known Member
I think people are really losing sight of the fact that SM is based on problematic source material, and therefore the easiest way to remove that source material is a re-theme.

Over the course of the past few months, I've witnessed the immense amount of sensationalism surrounding this situation, and any plans to re-theme any other attractions most likely don't exist, and will never exist. Of course both Pan and Dumbo have problematic elements in their films, but those are two short scenes that can easily be ignored. Unfortunately, with SotS, the entire film is considered to be problematic in the general public's eyes. Heck, according to Jim Hill, members of WDI back in the late 80s when Splash was being developed were against the SotS theme, but it went ahead anyways. Assuming this was the case and Jim Hill is telling the truth, then the SotS theme has always been a slippery slope. It's just now, that people are realizing it. Sure, the attraction works on it's own ignoring SotS, but this re-theme was, imo, still bound to happen at some point. It just so happened to be this past summer.

Any talk of moving on from any original Walt era attractions in favor for another re-theme is ridiculous, because any problematic stereotypes within certain original attractions can simply be altered through the
re-recording of dialogue, removal of vignettes, etc... I'm sure the only other attraction we'll see heavily altered may be HoP, because nowadays it's basically a melting pot for political controversy. Anyways, I want to end this by making it clear that I'm not taking any side when it comes to the SM re-theme, and I'm very much mutual with it. I understand both perspectives, and completely respect both sides for their reasons.
 
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Magicart87

〝𝘙𝘪𝘨𝘩𝘵𝘺-𝘖!〞
Premium Member
Problem and solution #1:
I think people are really losing sight of the fact that SM is based on problematic source material, and therefore the easiest way to remove that source material is a re-theme.
Problem and solution #2:
Any talk of moving on from any original Walt era attractions in favor for another re-theme is ridiculous, because any problematic stereotypes within certain original attractions can simply be altered through the re-recording of dialogue, removal of vignettes, etc...

The distinction between the two and the choice Disney made seems to be the issue for many, myself included. My biggest issue with all of this is that Disney is destroying a classic when the better option (opinion) would be to tweak the original attraction and net gain add a new attraction for Tiana.
 

NelsonRD

Well-Known Member
Obviously this conversation is just going in circles. Where do you think people get their “national news?”

Think about the sheer amount of content on the internet )prior to Disney’s June 23rd announcement) that made the connection between the ride and the film. YouTube videos, ”exposé“ blog posts, news articles, Facebook rants, Tweets, TickTok, Instagram posts, etc. Nevermind Disney’s own acknowledgment of the connections.

Then consider the reach of that content (how many people became aware of that the ride was based on the film) as a result of that content. Then consider how the film’s exclusion from Disney+ drew even more attention to the topic.

Now, compare that to how many people learned about the connection via Disney’s Press Release (on it’s own website) about the change— or even “national media” coverage of that announcement.

Then be sure to subtract anyone who has not and will never visited WDW.

Unless you are a Disney exec or a member of the marketing team, this is a conspiracy theory. It also tells me all I need to know about your worldview to know that responding to you probably isn’t a good idea.

I am just saying that large corporations react to public persuasion. Take any social condition over they years and you will see this. I am not suggesting right or wrong, I am just saying had this not been the current topic, it would not be addressed. No conspiracy theory there.

I also see your World view. Primarily, your reliance on social media. I do not Facebook, tweet, TiKToc (known spy app) or Instagram. I also view those platforms as a voice for ambition more than truth. Nobody is posting how fat they think they look in a dress. I am not alone. I think you struggle to understand a view from people who do not live through social media.
 

Homemade Imagineering

Well-Known Member
My biggest issue with all of this is that Disney is destroying a classic when the better option (opinion) would be to tweak the original attraction and net gain add a new attraction for Tiana.
Yes, and I wish this were the case. But you see, this isn’t just to include PatF within the parks, but to replace something problematic with something that’s more appropriate for today’s standards. If they wanted to add a PatF attraction to the parks, they’d add one without chopping a classic. They can’t really tweak SM without getting rid of the music, and the Brer characters all together, because without those elements the attraction wouldn’t work. It would be America Sings mountain, which would still be a complete departure from the SotS theme.
 

matt9112

Well-Known Member
If you take Disney's words at face value, these changes are steps in their ongoing efforts to get rid of anything that would exclude guests. They determined that Splash Mountain deserved to go on the list of attractions that needed to be changed as they work towards this goal. Weathering the backlash and making the changes seem like progress in that direction to me.

From my perspective, doing what you think is right even in the face of strong opposition is leadership.
But what if your just wrong? I mean that argument is very weak....think of all the evil people who thought they were right.
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
There are folks who think The Princess and the Frog is racist too. Just sayin'.
Right. And this is further evidence that Disney isn't just pandering to complainers, but that Disney has actually concluded that the Brer theme is too closely connected to the film (which they no longer endorse) to be as welcoming as possible to all guests.
 

matt9112

Well-Known Member
But you yourself have acknowledged that the ride reads to most people as an assortment of cartoon characters in a Southern setting. Without further context (i.e., knowledge of the film or original stories), someone riding Splash Mountain is never going to make the connection to African American folklore. The ride is doing nothing to keep that tradition in the public consciousness.
The counter point would be that the ride also does nothing racist or inappropriate in the eye of the public consciousness. Since its not the film in any remote way. So as you said just a ride through southern America..a vast geographical region of the nation.
 

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