Princesses may not rule fantasy land after all! Frontierland expansion rumor reality?

[floridabill]

Very interesting article from jim hill media! it talks about revising fantasy land! And pay attention to the name guy Jay Rasulo who is no longer in charge of park operations and for good reason! He is the one responsible for all this! Good thing Tom staggs is the new guy in charge, he states that the princess theme is to heavy for even his taste and they need a broader appeal for all age groups!!

Heres the link!http://jimhillmedia.com/Editor_In_C...ans-for-fantasyland-forest-being-revised.aspx

 

[NiarrNDisney]

After reading this article it has me wondering if the Mouse is considering overhauling Tom Sawyer Island like they did at DLR with the pirates theme or something else to reach the preteen boys who are not interested in Princesses and Fairy's. I know I should take any rumour with a grain of salt but it does make you think.

 

[FigmentJedi]

Pirates overhaul wouldn't work in Florida's TSI. Too far from the Pirates ride. Woody's Roundup would probably be more likely.
Also, I'm hoping they use Alice in alternate Fantasyland plans.

 

[misterID]

*joins Tom Staggs fanclub*

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

If it is really true WHY FRONTIERLAND? I just don't get it. It's perhaps the land that works best at the moment. It has only one section, TSI, where some could argue it needs a refurb or plussing but there is a near desastrous TL: Monsters? What connection do monsters have to the future? And SGE? Anyone who doesn't hate it? And the most outdated of all rides, TL Speedway, a waste of space and resources for a ride that has no future connection whatsoever! Or what exactly is futuristic about outdated cars driving on a completely boring track at a speed topped easily by any kickboard? Even as a kid I judged TL Speedway a major bore and never did it again.
And what's about Adventureland? Yes it's working but the JC is desperately in need of a major refurb, 40 year old AAs are not exactly what I expect from a Disney classic ride (oh and please get some new skippers, I can't stand the shouting that seems to have become a standard procedure) And I wont even start talking about the "new management" that ruined the classic Tiki Room, (Walt's favorite) after all what I heard from CMs one of the least popular attractions of the entire MK. And the only addition to AL since the days of Nixon! were these stupid flying carpets that spoiled AL plaza because they took away to much space and brought stylistic overkill with 3 completely different architectural styles around only one square that are seperated on the globe by nothing less than 5-8000 miles. This tiny arabian section between South Seas and kind of colonial Africa looks TERRIBLE. Its the only part in MK I would call kitsch.
AL, TL, even LS where nothing new happened since the opening of the MK (except the major HM refurb) all are begging for some plussing or major additions but FL? I repeat. Why?

 

[_Scar]

I hear there's a lot of expansion room in Animal Kingdom!


...


Just sayin...

 

[headhoncho34]

If it is really true WHY FRONTIERLAND? I just don't get it. It's perhaps the land that works best at the moment. It has only one section, TSI, where some could argue it needs a refurb or plussing but there is a near desastrous TL: Monsters? What connection do monsters have to the future? And SGE? Anyone who doesn't hate it? And the most outdated of all rides, TL Speedway, a waste of space and resources for a ride that has no future connection whatsoever! Or what exactly is futuristic about outdated cars driving on a completely boring track at a speed topped easily by any kickboard? Even as a kid I judged TL Speedway a major bore and never did it again.
And what's about Adventureland? Yes it's working but the JC is desperately in need of a major refurb, 40 year old AAs are not exactly what I expect from a Disney classic ride (oh and please get some new skippers, I can't stand the shouting that seems to have become a standard procedure) And I wont even start talking about the "new management" that ruined the classic Tiki Room, (Walt's favorite) after all what I heard from CMs one of the least popular attractions of the entire MK. And the only addition to AL since the days of Nixon! were these stupid flying carpets that spoiled AL plaza because they took away to much space and brought stylistic overkill with 3 completely different architectural styles around only one square that are seperated on the globe by nothing less than 5-8000 miles. This tiny arabian section between South Seas and kind of colonial Africa looks TERRIBLE. Its the only part in MK I would call kitsch.
AL, TL, even LS where nothing new happened since the opening of the MK (except the major HM refurb) all are begging for some plussing or major additions but FL? I repeat. Why?

They feel Frontierland isnt bringing in enough profits.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

And as another addition:The PotC franchise is going to be continued, the fourth PotC movie will happen to play in Florida. What present western franchise has Disney to offer? The next PotC movie will increase the publics interest in Adventureland, why not expand it? Why not build one of the many possible expansion projects, like Indiana Jones Adventure or Fire Mountain. And btw fire and roast the new management of the Tiki Room and bring back the classic, considering the fact that Tiki Style and Polynesian Pop are going through a revival for several years already.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

They feel Frontierland isnt bringing in enough profits.

Well then read the part of Jim Hills article about merchandising and how visitors in IOA fill the shops in WWoHP and think about it. What offers more merchandising opportunities? Cowboys based on, well decade old movies or Pirates based on a current franchise?
But I already realized that disney is really bad on this topic. During my last visit I would have spent easily 100$ more on attraction merchandise if there would have been any interesting (HM) or any at all (JC etc.)

 

[Krack]

Here's the thing you have to remember about anything "behind the scenes" reported by Jim Hill ...

His sources use him. I have no doubt that he has sources inside WDI, but the only time they give him information is when they want to make sure blame for something coming down the pike doesn't fall on themselves, or to try and convince some other area of the company to revisit an idea - generally, it's when they have some "super incredible, wouldn't this be the best idea ever in the history of entertainment?" concept that the money men already said "no" to. That's why the Jim Hill success rate on reported "attractions in the works" is so terrible.

The moral of the story is, if Jim Hill reports something, it's far likelier to never happen than it is to ever get made this decade. My personal opinion is that someone at WDI has been (rightfully and smartly) trying to explain to the decision makers that Fantasyland Forest is not going to have the intended consequences they think it will (gravitational pull on both girls and boys and gigantic increase in expensive merchandise) and has instead been advocating that they take some of the FF budget (most likely the M&Gs and maybe Dumbo) and use it to build one or two D-Ticket/C-Tickets in Frontierland to market to boys. I further believe, whoever it is, lost the argument and is now using his mouthpiece (Jim Hill) to try and plant the seed to the fanbase that "Hey, when this Fantasyland Forest is a disappointment, don't blame WDI, we wanted to build some stuff that interests boys".

 

[Krack]

And as another addition:The PotC franchise is going to be continued, the fourth PotC movie will happen to play in Florida. What present western franchise has Disney to offer?

They've been talking about a Jerry Bruckheimer "Lone Ranger" film starring George Clooney for over a year now. The shame of it is, cowboy and western films are so inexpensive to make, you'd think they'd just grab one star actor and greenlight a film and give it a shot.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

.
and has instead been advocating that they take some of the FF budget (most likely the M&Gs and maybe Dumbo) and use it to build one or two D-Ticket/C-Tickets in Frontierland to market to boys.

Not building the double dumbos would be stupid. It is the ride with the lowest capacity of all though very popular (I actually cannot understand why but it's a fact) which results in long lines. Doubling the attraction in this circus area would be one of the cheaper aspects of the project as a lot of toontown would be reused and a circus tent was btw a part of Walt's first design studies for a theme park. Although I don't care, I never did Dumbo, even as a child, but it makes a lot of sense.

 

[Random Vids Inc]

I'd like to see something added everywhere. Maybe a Magic Kingdom Expansion rather than just a Fantasyland Expansion?

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

I'd like to see something added everywhere. Maybe a Magic Kingdom Expansion rather than just a Fantasyland Expansion?

I think everyone would like to see this, as there is not such a thing as a perfect and flawless land in the MK at the moment. The only land that is not in need of some major changes is Main Street USA. Even Liberty Square could need some additions, I mean one major refurb (HM) in 40 years, that's all?
But the problem is, no one, not even Walt would expand the entire MK in one big boost because it doesn't make sense. It#s not only too expensive nowadays but it also would create HUGE problems with capacity and inconveniences due to the construction works. You cannot make half the MK a construction site and still expect the guests to be satisfied with the experience.
One major and perhaps two minor additions simultaneously are no problem, but anything more would spell desaster.

 

[Disney05]

Just goes to show you, nothing is ever etched in stone. I still say they monitor and take into account some of the things said here.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Just goes to show you, nothing is ever etched in stone. I still say they monitor and take into account some of the things said here.

You really think discussion among fans has influence on management decisions? I would love it, if it would be true but I don't really believe in it.

 

[Disney05]

^ Well maybe not 100% but can anyone say they don't? With all the surveys Disney sends out to guests, why not just have a group surf fan sites? :shrug:

 

[PirateFrank]

If some of the funds from the massive M&G budget reserved for FLE is quietly being diverted to create a broader appeal elsewhere in the park to compete with WWOHP.....I am 150% for it.

Seriously. The more I read about the guy, the more I'm convinced that Jay Rasulo was a complete and utter idiot of biblical proportions...

While I spent a great deal of time looking forward to FLE....I think it has more to do with the fact that they were doing something, anything to alleviate the capacity issues there...despite the fact that I thought that the FLE wasn't the best way of doing it.


Heck, the whole Dumbo queue thing for FLE has me frustrated. Kids get to play in the queue area while parents sit in benches? Isn't this the VERY reason why Walt created DLR to begin with?

So to put not so fine a point on it....I love the fact that money is being spent to expand capacity in the MK....especially in a down economy (the very time one should spend money on expansion)...however, it was clearly misguided.


I hope Jim Hill isn't being used to settle internal squabbles (as has been suggested in this thread) and theres a great deal of truth to this....but I'm not going to hold my breath.


What I still don't freakin understand is WHY THE HECK ARE THEY LOOKING TO EXPAND FRONTIERLAND WHEN TOMORROWLAND AND ADVENTURELAND ARE IN DIRE STRAIGHTS FOR HELP!?!?!?!?!?!?

 

[lebeau]

They've been talking about a Jerry Bruckheimer "Lone Ranger" film starring George Clooney for over a year now. The shame of it is, cowboy and western films are so inexpensive to make, you'd think they'd just grab one star actor and greenlight a film and give it a shot.

Currently, The Loan Ranger doesn't have a script, a director or a leading man. The only thing it does have is Depp as Tonto. And his dance card is full. Not surprisngly, Disney and Bruckheimer decided to prioritize Pirates 4 over Ranger.

Hopefully, if Loan Ranger ever gets made the delay will result in a better script. There's a new writer working on a draft as we speak. You get a good script and you'll have no problem getting a leading man and a director.

(The problem with the Pirates sequels has always been that they started shooting before the scripts were finished.)

 

[jt04]

If it is really true WHY FRONTIERLAND? I just don't get it. It's perhaps the land that works best at the moment. It has only one section, TSI, where some could argue it needs a refurb or plussing but there is a near desastrous TL: Monsters? What connection do monsters have to the future? And SGE? Anyone who doesn't hate it? And the most outdated of all rides, TL Speedway, a waste of space and resources for a ride that has no future connection whatsoever! Or what exactly is futuristic about outdated cars driving on a completely boring track at a speed topped easily by any kickboard? Even as a kid I judged TL Speedway a major bore and never did it again.
And what's about Adventureland? Yes it's working but the JC is desperately in need of a major refurb, 40 year old AAs are not exactly what I expect from a Disney classic ride (oh and please get some new skippers, I can't stand the shouting that seems to have become a standard procedure) And I wont even start talking about the "new management" that ruined the classic Tiki Room, (Walt's favorite) after all what I heard from CMs one of the least popular attractions of the entire MK. And the only addition to AL since the days of Nixon! were these stupid flying carpets that spoiled AL plaza because they took away to much space and brought stylistic overkill with 3 completely different architectural styles around only one square that are seperated on the globe by nothing less than 5-8000 miles. This tiny arabian section between South Seas and kind of colonial Africa looks TERRIBLE. Its the only part in MK I would call kitsch.
AL, TL, even LS where nothing new happened since the opening of the MK (except the major HM refurb) all are begging for some plussing or major additions but FL? I repeat. Why?

And as another addition:The PotC franchise is going to be continued, the fourth PotC movie will happen to play in Florida. What present western franchise has Disney to offer? The next PotC movie will increase the publics interest in Adventureland, why not expand it? Why not build one of the many possible expansion projects, like Indiana Jones Adventure or Fire Mountain. And btw fire and roast the new management of the Tiki Room and bring back the classic, considering the fact that Tiki Style and Polynesian Pop are going through a revival for several years already.

Well then read the part of Jim Hills article about merchandising and how visitors in IOA fill the shops in WWoHP and think about it. What offers more merchandising opportunities? Cowboys based on, well decade old movies or Pirates based on a current franchise?
But I already realized that disney is really bad on this topic. During my last visit I would have spent easily 100$ more on attraction merchandise if there would have been any interesting (HM) or any at all (JC etc.)

Here's the thing you have to remember about anything "behind the scenes" reported by Jim Hill ...

His sources use him. I have no doubt that he has sources inside WDI, but the only time they give him information is when they want to make sure blame for something coming down the pike doesn't fall on themselves, or to try and convince some other area of the company to revisit an idea - generally, it's when they have some "super incredible, wouldn't this be the best idea ever in the history of entertainment?" concept that the money men already said "no" to. That's why the Jim Hill success rate on reported "attractions in the works" is so terrible.

The moral of the story is, if Jim Hill reports something, it's far likelier to never happen than it is to ever get made this decade. My personal opinion is that someone at WDI has been (rightfully and smartly) trying to explain to the decision makers that Fantasyland Forest is not going to have the intended consequences they think it will (gravitational pull on both girls and boys and gigantic increase in expensive merchandise) and has instead been advocating that they take some of the FF budget (most likely the M&Gs and maybe Dumbo) and use it to build one or two D-Ticket/C-Tickets in Frontierland to market to boys. I further believe, whoever it is, lost the argument and is now using his mouthpiece (Jim Hill) to try and plant the seed to the fanbase that "Hey, when this Fantasyland Forest is a disappointment, don't blame WDI, we wanted to build some stuff that interests boys".

Exactly. I do believe Jim Hill may have just jumped the shark. I believe there is a "battle" between Imagineering at WDW and Glendale. I think Orlando is finding itself less and less a part of big capital projects that Glendale is producing. Lee is reflecting the Orlando view as is JHM. Glendale, however, keeps keeping on. Sprinkle your JHM with more than a pinch of salt this AM.

I think everyone would like to see this, as there is not such a thing as a perfect and flawless land in the MK at the moment. The only land that is not in need of some major changes is Main Street USA. Even Liberty Square could need some additions, I mean one major refurb (HM) in 40 years, that's all?
But the problem is, no one, not even Walt would expand the entire MK in one big boost because it doesn't make sense. It#s not only too expensive nowadays but it also would create HUGE problems with capacity and inconveniences due to the construction works. You cannot make half the MK a construction site and still expect the guests to be satisfied with the experience.
One major and perhaps two minor additions simultaneously are no problem, but anything more would spell desaster.

Spike on a roll! And 100% correct IMO. Love the passion! Well done.



PS--Clooney as the LR????:veryconfu:lookaroun:ROFLOL:That's a good one :lol: