You've never seen a hotel?
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News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -
- Thread starter danlb_2000
- Start date
You've never seen a hotel?
DVCOwner
A Long Time DVC Member
Not from "Main Street USA" in the midwest.
Kram Sacul
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- Yes
You can in Disneyland.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Main Street, USA is not specifically Marceline or just the Midwest.
The Empress Lilly
Well-Known Member
The Swolphin is aging beautifully.
I will always regret their placement, but they are spectacular examples of a distinct architectural style, and as such on their way to become classics. I resent his planological development of WDW, including the Swolphin, but I appreciate the ambition Eisner showed in wanting an architectural showpiece.
Certainly, the hideous towers that are destroying every single WDW resort right now puts Graves' work in a positive light by comparison.
And the mountain in DL is not just 'a mountain' but *the* Matterhorn. There's no main street anywhere in the U.S. which has the Matterhorn in the background.
Denver comes close...
180º
Well-Known Member
I have never understood this complaint. In the context of MSUSA, the Matterhorn is an acceptable backdrop because it basically just looks like a mountain and the scale is right. Disneyland is full of appealing visual shorthand like this. Potentially, these new Epcot sightlines don’t read as natural or even visually appealing in a surreal way, and the scale is way off.
I suspect that most of these new intrusions will go unnoticed by most, so I’m not too worried. But I’m growing weary of seeing the tired old Matterhorn argument dragged into this.
HauntedMansionFLA
Well-Known Member
6/7/2018 - DHS
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
My personal favorite is the claims that there is something outlandish about an Alp next to an Alpine Castle.
You mean like how the Swan and Dolphin go unnoticed? I'm weary of how often that gets dredged up.
That's the only time we bring up the Matterhorn and the castles and all the other sight line intrusions from Uncle Walt himself, in response to those who complain about post-Walt intrusions.
If you're going to be bitter over the Swolphin, there's a whole lot of bitterness to be thrown at St. Walter.
Bender123
Well-Known Member
Nothing says "Deep South" more than a crystal clear view of the castle from the top of Chickipin Hill...There isn't even an attempt to cover that one and its one of the most photographed sections of the ride.
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
It depends on whether you like postmodern architecture. For me, the style has not aged well.
See Disney's Hotel New York at DLP for another example of Michael Graves postmodern architecture that has aged even worse.
Bender123
Well-Known Member
I always valued Graves for having a look that almost seems like a cartoon rammed into the real world. Its a great style for Disney, but his color schemes always seem distinctly rooted in the late 80s or early 90s...Swolphin looks like a building that belongs in the intro to Miami Vice. They are weird, but strangely gorgeous. they are modern looking, but oddly outdated.
His work is just a pile of contradictions that make me simultaneously love and hate them.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
but Graves' play of pattern and form...Color and monumental icons is fascinating. The interiors were largely scrapped and destroyed at this point, but if you could see the original interiors, the exteriors would make more sense...and this is architecture as art... It asks us questions, it makes us think...and dream... It was never intended to be something anyone had ever seen before but something wholly new....so dismiss it as dated, but there are some that thought Frank Lloyd Wright's work was dated 30 years later...but with the clarity of time we realize it to be a classic piece of art....
WDW's Tomorrowland was also dismissed as dated in the 90s...but now oh how I would love to see those towering Gull-wing waterfalls again and that clean crisp white modernist architecture...which is still futuristic and fresh 40 plus years later.
WDW's Tomorrowland was also dismissed as dated in the 90s...but now oh how I would love to see those towering Gull-wing waterfalls again and that clean crisp white modernist architecture...which is still futuristic and fresh 40 plus years later.
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
At times and at its best, postmodern architecture can be interesting at least intellectually even if I don't find it particularly aesthetically pleasing. I do understand what Graves was going for in his architecture and it did make sense for Disney as postmodern architecture riffed off the idea of themed architecture that Disney had been instrumental in popularising. At least the Swolfin conjures up images of Miami Vice. Graves' Hotel New York at DLP looks like a grim suburban office park trying to appear whimsical which is how I find a lot of postmodern architecture appears today.
It is a matter of taste, though. I would even say that the Dolphin looks ok in spite of the dated colour scheme as the use of giant fountains and external decorations gives it enough frills to make it still seem kind of whimsical. For me, Swan looks like a big warehouse with two giant swans on the top.
nickys
Premium Member
Lensman
Well-Known Member
I agree. We will continue to evaluate postmodern architecture over the coming decades, but I don't think it could be argued that it wasn't an important phase in the architecture finally taking us beyond the modernism of the first half of the 20th century.
I also agree that it is kind of interesting how the modernism of Tomorrowland seems more appealing now than in the 80's and 90's when it just seemed dated. And how the retro-futurist "New Tomorrowland" look from around 1998 seems worse to some now than the modernist view that came before.
But this might make sense given how I just walked by a furniture store dedicated to Mid-Century Modern furniture.
I do agree that one's tastes should always be taken into account when deciding whether you like something or not, but I have to say that I never think of Miami Vice when seeing the Swan or Dolphin. I have to admit to being a little unclear what the stereotypical "Miami Vice" architecture is? I'm not sure if it is the Miami Modern from the 60's, the Art Deco of South Beach, the glass-walled condos and hotels of the period, or just the two iconic colors, #0bd3d3 and #f890e7.
Michael Graves was no stranger to controversy and his work was often controversial with many people simply not liking it. Even his most iconic work was controversial and hated by some, like the Portland Municipal Services Building.
Disclosure: I'm something of a Michael Graves fan. I have some of his bathroom fixtures and an irreplaceable toilet bowl brush.
But how did we get onto the subject of passing judgement on postmodernism in architecture?
OBGondola: Any update on the gondola station architecture? I sure hope they put some extra money into making them architecturally interesting. The design proposals toward the beginning of the thread seemed to imply that they would be barely adequate.
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