Movie Slump

[Goofster]

Hmm, that article got me thinking.
Well Atlantis isn't doing too well in the box office. I however loved it, and am buying all the toys and stuff. What's been going on lately, Atlantis is slowly sinking, and the Emporer's New Groove didn't do well either. Why doesn't anybody want to go see a good Disney Movie right now?

Well it seems Kratzenberg really was the power behind disney animation early in the decade. Maybe we should get rid of Eisner, and just make Kratzenberg CEO.
did he only leave because he hated mike?

I think the only way to go from here is straight up, should I not be worried? I know Monsters, Inc. will be a powerhouse, and hopefully they'll do Lilo and Stitch right. They'd better, its the Florida Studio's chance to show the company what they can do.
I'm not sure what Treasure Planet is gonna be like, but it sounds quite science fiction, a place where animated movies have not been too successful lately.

Hey what do you think?
And if you haven't seen Atlantis yet, GO SEE IT, GREAT MOVIE!!!

 

[dopey]

both atlantis and the emperor's new groove deserved to bomb at the box office. there was very little magic in atlantis and eng wasn't much of a comedy. david spade isn't even likable as a llama.

the upcoming flicks are a mixed bag. monsters inc. looks good. lilo & stick, a story about a girl and her evil alien dog, appears derivative of men in black. treasure planet, which is just an outer space version of treasure island, could succeed (it combines computer generated imagery with traditional animation). finding nemo (a clownfish, not a submarine captain) is another pixar film.

i don't believe any of these films have much in the way of songs, which, for me, anyway, has always been one of the great things about disney animated features. i say let the sophisticated shrek crowd mock disney's singin' and dancin' animals. i don't care if others think it's corny. i like it. some of my favorite performers are animals.

 

[JAY-ROD]

Originally posted by Goofster
Hmm, that article got me thinking.
Well Atlantis isn't doing too well in the box office. I however loved it, and am buying all the toys and stuff. What's been going on lately, Atlantis is slowly sinking, and the Emporer's New Groove didn't do well either. Why doesn't anybody want to go see a good Disney Movie right now?

Well it seems Kratzenberg really was the power behind disney animation early in the decade. Maybe we should get rid of Eisner, and just make Kratzenberg CEO.
did he only leave because he hated mike?

I tink he got ed at Eisner because he named his freind president of the company instead of him.

 

[Sire_Bobbie]

Maybe all that is missing is a little bit of fairy dust. Failing that why not try to tap into what the public really wants, not what they think they'll like.

 

[MrPromey]

Dopey, I think you are missing the point of Atlantis entirely. The fact that there were no singing animals was intentional. It was an attempt at trying to attract an older audience that wasn't dragged in there by a much younger one. It was the same thing with Remember The Titans which was released under the Disney name. They are trying to remind people that family entertainment doesn't have to mean made for kids. Although Disney has been saying all along that this movie was a bit of an experiment many people seem to have payed on attention and then walked out of the theatre in shock. The Emperors New Grove had so many problems and rewrites in production that it's actually a miracle that they got as much of a movie out of it that they did. Just to give you an idea, the original name for the movie was Empire of the Sun and it was not originally intended to be a comedy. You shouldn't fault them too much for Atlantis though. It's up there with something Walt would have tried. Lets face it, there are 2 basic plots one of which almost every Disney animated feature uses. They are running out of ways to tell the same love and coming of age stories. They are trying to innovate, something that they are often criticized for not doing anymore.

As for Kratzenberg, there is a lot of bad blood on both sides between him and Eisner. He left before Eisner had named anyone for president. The way he left was pretty simple. Shortly (s in weeks) after Frank Wells death he came to Eisner and more or less said "Either you make me president or I walk". Eisner more or less said that he was not ready to make a decision in the matter so Kratzenberg left. Kratzenberg's departure was an emotional break for all concerned fueled mostly by misunderstandings. It was professional grown adults behaving like children. It's a shame too, because he would otherwise have been the most likely pick for the president. It probably would have been a very good fit and Kratzenberg would be doing a lot better today as No. 2 at Disney than where he went.

 

[WDW-Imagineer]

Re: Re: Movie Slump

Originally posted by JAY-ROD
I tink he got ed at Eisner because he named his freind president of the company instead of him.

Your right. When Frank Wells was killed, Jeffrey said to Eisner, "Either I get Frank's job as president or I'm going to leave the company".

Eisner then named Michael Ovitz to take Frank's job. Although Disney's top executives found it hard to work with him and ultimately, Ovitz left. About a year or so ago, Robert Iger became President & Chief Operating Officer.

 

[MrPromey]

I could be all wrong (wouldn't be the first time) but I'm pretty sure Kratzenberg was out before Ovits came in.

 

[WDW-Imagineer]

First of all, his name is Katzenberg. Second, I think your right. I think Eisner didn't make anybody President, then eventually make Ovitz pres.

 

[MrPromey]

Thanks for the correction on the name (lowers his head in embarrassment) I never remember how to spell his name so I just copied and pasted it from somewhere else on the board...

 

[WDW-Imagineer]

Originally posted by MrPromey
Thanks for the correction on the name (lowers his head in embarrassment) I never remember how to spell his name so I just copied and pasted it from somewhere else on the board...

Don't worry... everybody else on this thread spelled it the same (since you copied & pasted, thats why you got it wrong )

 

[mightyduck]

I was reading this thread with some interest. I love Disney. I saw Bambi at the drive-in when I was four. It was magic (although I cried for a while when his mom died) (still hate that part). But I own Pocahontas and haven't watched it all the way through (I used it in class after my students read some accounts of the story and we discussed where disney took dramatic license and why). I didn't see Hercules, Emperor's New Groove, Mulan, Tarzan, Atlantis, Hunchback, or anything else since Aladdin. I saw the first Toy Story but not the second. I didn't see the new Fantasia. And quite honestly, they haven't captured my imagination. I use the soundtracks to Lion King and Aladdin in class. I purchased three of those listed above that I haven't seen and A Bug's Life (also haven't seen), and I'm waiting for them to arrive. But if I'm not thrilled, that's not a good sign.

As for running out of stories, there are certainly schools of literary criticism that say there are really only a handful of stories that get retold in different skins. Change the setting, tone, character and genre and you have a "new" movie. There are lots of classic stories to be retold. There are lots of new ones to create. It's the magic that's missing....Perhaps it is that profits are driving production...thinking "people want to see this" rather than "this is a story that needs to be told" or "I want to see this story."

I don't know. If I did, I'd be making a lot more money...

 

[MrPromey]

A few comments on your post. Hercules, was thought to be too 'smart' for it's audience. Emperor's New Groove got reasonable reviews (I personally didn't care that much for it) but when you consider what happened to that movie during it's nightmarish production, it's a wonder they were able to make it anything at all. Mulan actually did pretty well in the box office though Tarzan did much better. In my personally opinion, Tarzan was probably one of the best done since Lion King. Hunchback and Pocahontas are perfect examples of what happens when Disney tries to retell 'classic stories'. In both cases they are criticized for changing things. Do we really think a family audience would appreciate seeing pretty much everyone die in the end of Hunchback so that it would more closely mirror the original story? This bares the argument that perhaps they should never have chosen that story but the same could be said for any story the attempt to make their own. I don't know that they got this much criticism in the old days when they did Pinocchio or Peter Pan but I doubt it since the media wasn't nearly as critical and lacked the number of outlets that they have today. As for Toy Story 1 & 2, I actually thought that 2 was better. The original was the first feature length movie that Pixar had ever made and it was obvious that they were much more comfortable with their own technology in the second one because they put quite a bit more into the story. It's almost hard to believe that Disney even considered making this one a direct to video release. I saw Fantasia 2000 in the IMAX setting a few times and liked it a lot. It wasn't really Disney ripping off Disney like has happened with other sequel because the original was left open ended. Most people don't realize this but even though Walt had originally intended to update it, after the initial release which was a money loosing failure, he vowed never to make another one. It was referred to in advertisements upon later re-releases as "ahead of its time" which is marketing jargon for nobody understood/liked it then - hopefully somebody will now. Fantasia upset Walt a lot because he had always been proud of knowing exactly what the American Public wanted and this time his Dream turned out to be his alone... Although it did finally make a profit for the company it took many years and a few re-releases to do so. The designs and methods used in 2000 were every bit as, if not more creative than those used in the original. If you listen to the commentaries on the DVD you will find out a lot more about how it was done than is obvious from first viewing. The simple fact that it was released in IMAX is proof that this was not a profit driven production since the IMAX format alone, condemns it to very limited release which would suggest that with at least this movie, profit was not their real motivation (I think the reason for it was to sort of flex their muscle a bit and prove they could still do quality work what with public opinion faltering - it got fantastic reviews from nearly all of the critics after all - and disney was sort of going for that high art edge with it) Even after the one month that they allowed it to be shown in regular theatres many people didn't even know it existed. A new IMAX theatre opened near me not too long ago and a coworker that knows I love Disney stuff told me it was playing there and I commented that I wished we'd had the theatre when it first came out so that I wouldn't have had to make a 180 mile round trip to see it. She was surprised to find out that it was even made as an IMAX movie, she had bought it on DVD for her kids and thought it was a direct to video release.
Atlantis is a mixed bag, some people like it, a lot of people looking forward to classic Disney don't. I think it will do better in video and DVD release than it's done in the theatres though. It's not what people are used to from Disney and the vast majority of people in this world consider anything different bad... That's just the way we work. In any event, there's not a lot to fear because the next couple of movies coming down the DIsney pipe are all done in the classic Disney style. The 70's are considered to be a time when Disney was not doing so well with both the animated and live action movies either (at the time anyway) they seem to sort of go through spells... Guess we'll just have to wait and see though.

 

[mightyduck]

Wow. I'll have to see them and get back to you on my opinion after I watch. I just know that I wasn't compelled to get to a theater for any of these (keeping in mind that I've been averaging a total of one movie a year in the theaters for the past four or five years now...).

 

[MrPromey]

Originally posted by mightyduck
Wow. I'll have to see them and get back to you on my opinion after I watch. I just know that I wasn't compelled to get to a theater for any of these (keeping in mind that I've been averaging a total of one movie a year in the theaters for the past four or five years now...).

I can relate to that last comment. I transferred to days a few months back after having worked nights for the last couple of years and I all of a sudden went hog wild going to movies. Before I went to nights I didn't go much but when I went to nights, the only time I could go was on Saturdays and Sundays and I was usually too busy trying to get everything else done. Now it seems like every Friday I'm at a movie. The week before last it was Jurassic Park (actually, that was on the Wednesday it came out), last week was American Sweethearts and tonight it was Planet of the Apes… Curse, I won't be going to see the Princess Diaries next week when it comes out because I think I'm going to a screening of it tomorrow but if there is anything else coming out next Friday you can bet I'll be there… Course this jump in attendance from me also coincides with the opening of a special stadium theatre near me. I've been to several of these styles including the one at DTD and none of them even come close to the quality that this Florida only chain offers I cold go on and on about the plush seats, floor rumbling sound distinct theme that each theatre carries, matching it to it's location but I won't. Oh, I just did, didn't I? Oh well… If you ever get a Muvico in your area check it out. I find it hard to believe you will be disappointed and if you are it is probably because something went wrong so you should ask for free tickets and then go again at which point you will not be disappointed. It was the Muvico theatre up at Orlando Point that had the IMAX where I saw Fantasia 2000, as a matter of fact. Ok, enough about me and my fascination with a movie theatre… Ah, if only the women in my life were as good to me as Muvico. Not that anyone on here would have any idea what I'm talking about in any way shape or form….

 

[mightyduck]

Actually, I went to the movies two nights ago and saw Jurassic Park, and I promised my mom I'd take her to see America's Sweethearts next week. And a co-worker took me to see Sweet November (which I knew would be bad) to cheer me up, and of course, it has that fab cancer subplot, which left me thinking while the poor guy meant well, he should have left well-enough alone. So that's three movies. But I think the last movie I saw before that was Bowfinger...which was two years ago...

I know I won't see Princess Diaries in the theater, and I wouldn't count on Monsters Inc or Milo and Stitch, either...

We have Loews Sony theaters around here almost exclusively. I think I'd have to go to Manhattan to see IMAX, or at least that area.

As for the women of this board, I'm assuming that's not directed at me....and I think Ariel is asleep now...