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How much "Ruin" do the parks have left?

tagoofy

Active Member
Original Poster
Adam Smith once wrote that there’s a “great deal of ruin in a nation,” by which he meant that it takes an awful lot of bungling by leaders to bring down a powerful and prosperous state.

Applying this to Disney parks, and particularly WDW that I am quite familiar with, it seems that over many years those that run the parks are testing Adam's theory.

For me personally, there are things like the bus system, quality of food, the "woke"ning of the parks, and the many many $$ obvious cost cutting corners. They have just about run thru all of the "ruin" left in them for me.

So for you, how much "ruin" do the parks have in them?
 

Nickels5

Well-Known Member
Adam Smith once wrote that there’s a “great deal of ruin in a nation,” by which he meant that it takes an awful lot of bungling by leaders to bring down a powerful and prosperous state.

Applying this to Disney parks, and particularly WDW that I am quite familiar with, it seems that over many years those that run the parks are testing Adam's theory.

For me personally, there are things like the bus system, quality of food, the "woke"ning of the parks, and the many many $$ obvious cost cutting corners. They have just about run thru all of the "ruin" left in them for me.

So for you, how much "ruin" do the parks have in them?
Goodbye
 

comics101

Well-Known Member
I'll preface this by saying that I am not a fan of many of the changes Disney has made in the last 10 to 15 years.

With that said, one person's "ruin" is another person's new favorite vacation destination, right? I suppose what I mean by that is, Disney will continue to "ruin" the parks and WDW property so long as guests continue to pay them to do so.


EDIT: I'll just add to this by saying that despite not being a fan of the changes Disney has made over the last decade or so, I still go to the parks regularly. I still spend big $$$ on Disney. Perhaps someday the "ruin" will convince me to stop, but it certainly hasn't reached that point yet, and I don't see it reaching that point anytime soon. I imagine most guests (especially repeat guests) are just like me.
 
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tagoofy

Active Member
Original Poster
I was interested in this conversation until you used the woke word.
Geez, that did not take long to de-evolve.
I was only listing what was important to me. Not trying to start a discussion or debate on any specific type of issue as for each of us it might be a different issue. Maybe for someone else they think there is not enough "social justice" in the parks and that adds "ruin" for them. I'm only wondering where people are at, not trying to judge them for where they are at (that you seem to be doing to me). IMO actual tolerance starts with accepting people (but not necessarily companies) where they are at. Does not mean you agree with them.
 

castlecake2.0

Well-Known Member
Geez, that did not take long to de-evolve.
I was only listing what was important to me. Not trying to start a discussion or debate on any specific type of issue as for each of us it might be a different issue. Maybe for someone else they think there is not enough "social justice" in the parks and that adds "ruin" for them. I'm only wondering where people are at, not trying to judge them for where they are at (that you seem to be doing to me). IMO actual tolerance starts with accepting people (but not necessarily companies) where they are at. Does not mean you agree with them.
I’ll pass
 

The_Jobu

Well-Known Member
Adam Smith once wrote that there’s a “great deal of ruin in a nation,” by which he meant that it takes an awful lot of bungling by leaders to bring down a powerful and prosperous state.

Applying this to Disney parks, and particularly WDW that I am quite familiar with, it seems that over many years those that run the parks are testing Adam's theory.

For me personally, there are things like the bus system, quality of food, the "woke"ning of the parks, and the many many $$ obvious cost cutting corners. They have just about run thru all of the "ruin" left in them for me.

So for you, how much "ruin" do the parks have in them?

The thing is, Disney is it's own little phenomenon at this point. There seems to be no level of service cutbacks, understaffing, cut corners, political pandering (wokening, as you put), excessive price hikes that actually detours people from visiting. In fact, many here think they are actively trying to reduce the number of guests and balance it out with higher prices. We like to joke, but if tomorrow they announce a $250 all-you-can-eat (but limit of 3) cupcake after hours party, people would buy it, no questions asked.

As they say on the otherside of the tracks, junkies always return for the product, even if it's stepped on.

The only way I see them possibly course-correcting is if their pencil pushing suits continue on this path and Epic Universe is an exceptional product. Maybe then, but only slightly.
 

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
Did you know that, aside from the plane ticket, a stay at the vastly-superior Tokyo Disneyland/TokyoSea is cheaper than a stay at WDW or Disneyland? Or so online vloggers have led me to believe.

That should tell you something. Talk about value for your dollar. The Robert Iger Company will continue to cut services, raise prices, do poor maintenance, and leave things broken as long as suckers still line up to pay for it. As long as that greedy pig is in charge of Walt's company, things are not going to improve for stateside parkgoers.

But hey, enjoy those celebratory cupcakes.
 

The_Jobu

Well-Known Member
Did you know that, aside from the plane ticket, a stay at the vastly-superior Tokyo Disneyland/TokyoSea is cheaper than a stay at WDW or Disneyland? Or so online vloggers have led me to believe.

That should tell you something. Talk about value for your dollar. The Robert Iger Company will continue to cut services, raise prices, do poor maintenance, and leave things broken as long as suckers still line up to pay for it. As long as that greedy pig is in charge of Walt's company, things are not going to improve for stateside parkgoers.

But hey, enjoy those celebratory cupcakes.

Really? I did not know that.

I may have to price out a Tokyo trip....
 

danv3

Well-Known Member
sigh......
look at the crowds right now.... with many things not operating and after a major pandemic.... Disney is in no danger. If its at that point for you.. dont go.. clearly theres a 1000 new guests for every 1 that decides to leave.
While there is some limit to this, I don't think we're that close yet. I think Disney could double prices and cut offerings by at least 25% and still have no difficulty at all in filling the parks.
 

James Alucobond

Well-Known Member
Does what they're doing even equate to "ruin" for the average guest? Sure, there's a homogenization happening across some of their properties that disappoints old fans who go regularly, but what they're adding satisfies just as many, if not more. My favorite ride in EPCOT was always the Maelstrom, but there's no denying Frozen Ever After is infinitely more popular regardless of whether or not EPCOT traditionalists feel like it fits well. They'll continue to modify the parks in ways that some will appreciate and others will hate. No stopping it. Their IP is so powerful that I think only becoming truly cost-prohibitive could sink them at some point, but even then, the solution is to backtrack a bit on pricing or hold fast until inflation compensates.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Geez, that did not take long to de-evolve.
I was only listing what was important to me. Not trying to start a discussion or debate on any specific type of issue as for each of us it might be a different issue. Maybe for someone else they think there is not enough "social justice" in the parks and that adds "ruin" for them. I'm only wondering where people are at, not trying to judge them for where they are at (that you seem to be doing to me). IMO actual tolerance starts with accepting people (but not necessarily companies) where they are at. Does not mean you agree with them.
I don't see them judging you to be fair, he or she seems to be saying they just don't want to join in another conversation involving 'wokeness'. I'd try not to take it too personally.
 
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Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
The difference between a government surviving and a theme park is basically that a government can force people to pay taxes to support it whereas a theme park cannot. A lot of factors enter into if there is ever a point where a theme park can no longer draw in the numbers needed to support itself that is when it becomes history. It has fewer powers other then engrained mental addiction. No one, as far as I know, is predicting the immediate demise of Disney because of pricing, but just reading the comments of many loyal customers (or guests if that sounds better) it seems to me that it is being chipped away a little at a time. Eventually, the walls come a tumbling down. I don't think it will be within my lifetime, but who knows I thought that Sears and Kodak could stand the test of time. They didn't.
 

Dan Deesnee

Well-Known Member
Geez, that did not take long to de-evolve.
I was only listing what was important to me. Not trying to start a discussion or debate on any specific type of issue as for each of us it might be a different issue. Maybe for someone else they think there is not enough "social justice" in the parks and that adds "ruin" for them. I'm only wondering where people are at, not trying to judge them for where they are at (that you seem to be doing to me). IMO actual tolerance starts with accepting people (but not necessarily companies) where they are at. Does not mean you agree with them.

Some people don't want to hear anyone's opinion that doesn't line up with theirs. Don't sweat it.

I actually think the pandemic helped Disney. It gave them an excuse to slash budget and services that were costing them money under the guise of doing it because of the pandemic. It also created a massive pent-up demand. However I feel all this is very short-lived. I'm eager to see what happens in 2023 and beyond.
 

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