Haunted Mansion to Return with New Enhancements and Magic :(

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
Exactly. Walt Disney World has how many timeshare units? You don’t fill up timeshares with people who are only visiting once.
My thoughts exactly. How many WDW guests are actually going just once? Not as many as people believe, I bet. I’ve always thought that was overblown.

Same with the “Disneyland is locals” rhetoric. The parks most likely aren’t full of people from Southern California all the time, the majority of the time. Shrinking that down even more, not every Southern Californian is a local. There’s no way the majority of DLR guests all live within maybe a two hours or less drive away. Overblown.
 

owlsandcoffee

Well-Known Member
Even if WDW was full of one-timers, TDO doesn’t care about making sure they can ride everything available.
I am, as of right now, a one-timer. Not entirely by choice, haha but I went as a kid and haven't been able to get back. They certainly didn't care about that when I was there. Felt like half of Magic Kingdom and MGM's rides were down.
 

Tamandua

Well-Known Member
They really need to stop doing the holiday version before Halloween

I also think, if they're going to keep doing an overlay every year, why not change it up now and then? Does it really need to be nightmare before Christmas every year? Aren't the Muppets doing a haunted mansion special this year? I'd love to see an actual Muppets overlay in place of NBC.
 

waltography

Well-Known Member
While we're on the topic of overlays, I remember there being rumblings of an RSR Halloween overlay when OBB was announced; I do wish they'd pull through with that at some point.
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
It’s most likely TDO being cheap, while using the “once in a lifetime/once a year” thing as an excuse.

Disneyland also has tourists.
yes but DL is probably 76% or more locals - way more than WDW. It was specifically stated by someone in the company that was exactly the reason WDW doesn't receive it. It would anger too many people, coupled with the fact that WDW doesn't need it to drive tourists. (It should be pointed out TDL is also locals heavy).
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
My thoughts exactly. How many WDW guests are actually going just once? Not as many as people believe, I bet. I’ve always thought that was overblown.

Same with the “Disneyland is locals” rhetoric. The parks most likely aren’t full of people from Southern California all the time, the majority of the time. Shrinking that down even more, not every Southern Californian is a local. There’s no way the majority of DLR guests all live within maybe a two hours or less drive away. Overblown.
When I worked there the average WDW guests would return about seven years later. And if "locals" weren't that big a deal, why did DL do away with annuals due to overcrowding?
 

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
yes but DL is probably 76% or more locals - way more than WDW. It was specifically stated by someone in the company that was exactly the reason WDW doesn't receive it. It would anger too many people, coupled with the fact that WDW doesn't need it to drive tourists. (It should be pointed out TDL is also locals heavy).
That rep from the company was most likely lying. Come on now, do you actually think people would be so angry about a ride being down that it would significantly affect their attendance numbers/reputation? If WDW doesn’t need overlays for tourists because they’re going to come anyway, then why offer anything new at all, ever? Also, by this logic, why close rides at the resort? Wouldn’t that anger all the tourists who apparently will either never come back or will come back in seven years?

Disney doesn’t actually care about any of this. TDO doesn’t do overlays because they don’t want to and they're cheap. I heard two TDO executives with my own ears at Disneyland mock and laugh at TDA for spending money and brag about how they don’t include “all these extras” in Florida and are therefore able to conserve money.

Cheap.
When I worked there the average WDW guests would return about seven years later. And if "locals" weren't that big a deal, why did DL do away with annuals due to overcrowding?
I never said “locals weren’t a big deal,” not that they are. I said there’s no way that the majority of DLR guests all live within a 2-hour drive from the parks. That would mean everyone is coming from either Greater Los Angeles or San Diego.

Since you mentioned passholders, not all DLR passholders lived two hours or less from the parks. Passholders consisted of locals, Californians from the rest of the state, and people from various western states, such as Nevada, Oregon, Washington, and Arizona to name a few. I’d met a few Hawaiian passholders as well. There were also passholders who didn’t live in any western states, but further out. Just because APs tended to crowd the parks, it doesn’t necessarily mean that they were all locals. Many of them flew/drove down from Northern California or from other states, sometimes last minute.

The DLR also gets foreign tourists as well, by the way, mostly from Australia and Asian countries like South Korea and Japan. Also, the DLR doesn’t need to keep bringing back these overlays because guests will come either way.
 

el_super

Well-Known Member
Disney doesn’t actually care about any of this. TDO doesn’t do overlays because they don’t want to and they're cheap. I heard two TDO executives with my own ears at Disneyland mock and laugh at TDA for spending money and brag about how they don’t include “all these extras” in Florida and are therefore able to conserve money.

TDO doesn't spend the money because they don't have to. This argument got flipped around somehow: it isn't about WDW not needing an overlay due to tourists, as much as it is DLR needs overlays to increase demand. Both TDL and DLR require seasonal changes to encourage multiple trips per year. That's why you see so much change at those resorts: new parades, new shows, new character offerings, new food promotions etc etc... You have to have 12 months of value in order to sell Annual Passes.

Changing Haunted Mansion over means your audience has to come twice a year to see them both. For the majority of DLR's audience, that's easily achievable without a multi-day stay being planned months in advance.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
TDO doesn't spend the money because they don't have to. This argument got flipped around somehow: it isn't about WDW not needing an overlay due to tourists, as much as it is DLR needs overlays to increase demand. Both TDL and DLR require seasonal changes to encourage multiple trips per year. That's why you see so much change at those resorts: new parades, new shows, new character offerings, new food promotions etc etc... You have to have 12 months of value in order to sell Annual Passes.

Changing Haunted Mansion over means your audience has to come twice a year to see them both. For the majority of DLR's audience, that's easily achievable without a multi-day stay being planned months in advance.
Except that Walt Disney World used to have more seasonal offerings and people didn’t complain about them.
 

Magicart87

Attention, Kmart shoppers!
Premium Member
Why must it be an overlay anyway? Why not just make a standalone walk thru experience. Or better still, a maze! Take all the would-be Holiday Overlay stuffs and plop them into a warehouse maze setting. Start the maze at The Hinterlands a.k.a. the Holiday Doors and end the maze with a Jack and Sally meet n' greet.

Disney can continue pushing the NBC merch. Mansion fans get to keep their mansion for HW. And NBC fans get an Nightmare Maze attraction.
 
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Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
TDO doesn't spend the money because they don't have to. This argument got flipped around somehow: it isn't about WDW not needing an overlay due to tourists, as much as it is DLR needs overlays to increase demand. Both TDL and DLR require seasonal changes to encourage multiple trips per year. That's why you see so much change at those resorts: new parades, new shows, new character offerings, new food promotions etc etc... You have to have 12 months of value in order to sell Annual Passes.

Changing Haunted Mansion over means your audience has to come twice a year to see them both. For the majority of DLR's audience, that's easily achievable without a multi-day stay being planned months in advance.
TDO doesn’t spend the money because they don’t want to and they’re cheap.

The DLR doesn’t have to do it. They don’t have to create new parades, new shows, food promotions, etc. Believe in Holiday Magic has got to be over 20 years-old. It took 10 years for them to replace Soundsational. If this were the case, why did they stop the AP-only events?

It’s been proven over and over again that Disney guests will flock the parks on either coast, no matter what.
 

el_super

Well-Known Member
Except that Walt Disney World used to have more seasonal offerings and people didn’t complain about them.

And to an extent they still do, they just monetize them differently there. The majority of the Halloween offerings are a separate entry fee and having a semi-permanent overlay like Mansion Holiday wouldn't work to promote the value of the after hours event. On the flip side though, EPCOT's festivals are basically driving attendance the same way DLR's events do: making something different enough to encourage multiple visits per year. Different tools for difference problems.


TDO doesn’t spend the money because they don’t want to and they’re cheap.

The DLR doesn’t have to do it. They don’t have to create new parades, new shows, food promotions, etc. Believe in Holiday Magic has got to be over 20 years-old. It took 10 years for them to replace Soundsational. If this were the case, why did they stop the AP-only events?

It’s been proven over and over again that Disney guests will flock the parks on either coast, no matter what.

Which AP only events are you referring to? They were still offering AP exclusives up until closing, and then even after closing when they offered up the Alfresco Lounge as "Legacy AP Exclusive." Maybe if you're referring to the REALLY old school AP only party nights, they stopped doing those the same reason they stopped doing CM party nights: with the projected number of attendees, it was no longer feasible.

I don't think it's entirely safe to assume people will go no matter what. I distinctly remember the non-AP/non-HMH years at Disneyland, and October was especially known as one of the slowest seasons. Disneyland was, typically in those off-seasons, only open from 10AM to 6PM. They did purposefully change their model in the 1990s to encourage more local visitation and AP sales, and HMH was one of the core drivers of that change: seasonal overlays that would draw repeat visits. Disneyland's annual attendance is up someting close to 50% since HMH debuted.

They wouldn't spend the money if they didn't think they HAD to. DLR clearly thinks that the spending for this is important, since they keep taking the mansion down for months to reconfigure the infrastructure required for HMH.
 

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
And to an extent they still do, they just monetize them differently there. The majority of the Halloween offerings are a separate entry fee and having a semi-permanent overlay like Mansion Holiday wouldn't work to promote the value of the after hours event. On the flip side though, EPCOT's festivals are basically driving attendance the same way DLR's events do: making something different enough to encourage multiple visits per year. Different tools for difference problems.




Which AP only events are you referring to? They were still offering AP exclusives up until closing, and then even after closing when they offered up the Alfresco Lounge as "Legacy AP Exclusive." Maybe if you're referring to the REALLY old school AP only party nights, they stopped doing those the same reason they stopped doing CM party nights: with the projected number of attendees, it was no longer feasible.

I don't think it's entirely safe to assume people will go no matter what. I distinctly remember the non-AP/non-HMH years at Disneyland, and October was especially known as one of the slowest seasons. Disneyland was, typically in those off-seasons, only open from 10AM to 6PM. They did purposefully change their model in the 1990s to encourage more local visitation and AP sales, and HMH was one of the core drivers of that change: seasonal overlays that would draw repeat visits. Disneyland's annual attendance is up someting close to 50% since HMH debuted.

They wouldn't spend the money if they didn't think they HAD to. DLR clearly thinks that the spending for this is important, since they keep taking the mansion down for months to reconfigure the infrastructure required for HMH.
They used to have AP-only events that weren’t REALLY old. I’m think 5+ years ago. I remember because I was both a CM working these events and a regular AP getting invitations to these events.

I think it’s very safe to say that, as there’s plenty of evidence to back up that statement. If they announced that they were cancelling HMH right now, it’d still be crowds of people showing up at the gates during the last few months of the year.

Guests aren’t demanding new offerings from the DLR and they surely wouldn’t care if they were. The majority of guests don’t care about new offerings. They just care that the parks are open and care about not having to wait in lines that are too long.
 

el_super

Well-Known Member
They used to have AP-only events that weren’t REALLY old. I’m think 5+ years ago. I remember because I was both a CM working these events and a regular AP getting invitations to these events.

I remember them having AP exclusive previews for attraction openings ... was that it?


Guests aren’t demanding new offerings from the DLR and they surely wouldn’t care if they were. The majority of guests don’t care about new offerings.

They just care that the parks are open and care about not having to wait in lines that are too long.

Some people have built a yearly tradition out of Halloweentime at Disneyland, and it will be interesting to see if Disney can convince them to pay over $100 to have their photos taken with that giant pumpkin in Town Square. I think HMH is going to be the key to convincing people to spend money to make a second or third visit since reopening. If they can continue to convince people to spend money on full-price tickets, they wouldn't need to offer them as a separate ticketed event like WDW (they haven't said anything about a DL based event... yet).
 

Californian Elitist

Well-Known Member
I remember them having AP exclusive previews for attraction openings ... was that it?
They used to close Disneyland early for regular guests and keep it open for annual passholders for about four hours, usually from 8-12am or 9-1am. Only Tomorrowland and Fantasyland would remain open, hence why I was always working those AP events. They also used to do movie screenings at the Opera House on Main Street exclusively for APs (one of them was Dumbo, I remember that vividly) and would plan special events as well. Recalling ones off of the top of my head, there was an AP-only event for Indy’s 20th anniversary in 2015, a Dixieland event where they did a mock night of Disneyland After Dark, and held a Goofy panel with Bill Farmer and screened some classic Goofy shorts. I actually attended that event.
 

Mac Tonight

Well-Known Member
HMH is coming back this year!?!?!?!?!

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