General political chat

[LittleBuford]

Not sure all about Desert Storm but Iraqi decided to invade Kuwait and the US plus 40 other countries ( including Canada) went to defend Kuwait but because we decided to defend Kuwait that is why 9/11 happened and no other country?

The war became known by its military name Operation Desert Storm. The Allies consisted of troops and support from almost 40 countries including from the Middle East, Europe, Britain and Asia Pacific.

You're referring to the Gulf War of 1990-1991, whereas @Disney Analyst is talking about the invasion of Iraq that toppled Saddam Hussein in 2003.

 

[LittleBuford]

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Probably not the best argument to start on Yom Kippur. Additionally, your statement is quite overly generalized and not specific.

A Happy Yom Kippur to you and all other Jewish forumites!

 

[Disney Analyst]

Not sure all about Desert Storm but Iraqi decided to invade Kuwait and the US plus 40 other countries ( including Canada) went to defend Kuwait but because we decided to defend Kuwait that is why 9/11 happened and no other country?

The war became known by its military name Operation Desert Storm. The Allies consisted of troops and support from almost 40 countries including from the Middle East, Europe, Britain and Asia Pacific.

You're referring to the Gulf War of 1990-1991, whereas @Disney Analyst is talking about the invasion of Iraq that toppled Saddam Hussein in 2003.

Thanks! I’m really just inquiring; as I’m not the most knowledgeable about it and I am sure some on here can help elaborate how the middle east got to where it and why ISIS even came to be.

I was under the impression it is greatly related to decisions made by the US during the Bush era.

 

[Willmark]

Thanks! I’m really just inquiring; as I’m not the most knowledgeable about it and I am sure some on here can help elaborate how the middle east got to where it and why ISIS even came to be.

I was under the impression it is greatly related to decisions made by the US during the Bush era.

It’s related to the redrawing of the map at the end of WWI of which the UK and France (largely) got their way with the Middle East.

This is a pretty good high level explanation:

Europe, Middle East map redrawn by World War I - France 24

Europe, Middle East map redrawn by World War I

www.france24.com

The involvement of the US is really just the last actions from outside the regions in a long chain.

 

[willtravel]

You're referring to the Gulf War of 1990-1991, whereas @Disney Analyst is talking about the invasion of Iraq that toppled Saddam Hussein in 2003.

Oh, Ok. Then I stand corrected.

 

[Disney Analyst]

It’s related to the redrawing of the map at the end of WWI of which the UK and France (largely) got their way with the Middle East.

This is a pretty good high level explanation:

Europe, Middle East map redrawn by World War I - France 24

Europe, Middle East map redrawn by World War I

www.france24.com

The involvement of the US is really just the last actions from outside the regions in a long chain.

So that started the unrest, and then 2003 was the catalyst for the forming of modern day ISIS?

 

[LittleBuford]

Thanks! I’m really just inquiring; as I’m not the most knowledgeable about it and I am sure some on here can help elaborate how the middle east got to where it and why ISIS even came to be.

I was under the impression it is greatly related to decisions made by the US during the Bush era.

The toppling of Saddam Hussein (which, again, wasn't just an American act) paved the way for a number of Iraqi insurgent groups to make their bid for power. The precursor to IS was among those groups.

 

[Disney Analyst]

The toppling of Saddam Hussein (which, again, wasn't just an American act) paved the way for a number of Iraqi insurgent groups to make their bid for power. The precursor to IS was among those groups.

and obviously Saddam Hussein was a monster, so I guess one starts to wonder if it was worth it? Should anyone have even gotten involved? It’s such a mess of a situation.

 

[The Mom]

So that started the unrest, and then 2003 was the catalyst for the forming of modern day ISIS?

There was a bit of "stuff" going on in the years in between.

 

[Disney Analyst]

There was a bit of "stuff" going on in the years in between.

Oh of course. I understand that. But ISIS did not form until after events of 2003 and beyond.

 

[aw14]

A Happy Yom Kippur to you and all other Jewish forumites!

Thank you. Sincerely appreciated

 

[LittleBuford]

and obviously Saddam Hussein was a monster, so I guess one starts to wonder if it was worth it? Should anyone have even gotten involved? It’s such a mess of a situation.

The reason given for the invasion was that Hussein was developing weapons of mass destruction, which turned out not to be the case. Some hold that the reason was a spurious pretext from the outset, with oil being the real motive, but I actually think both Blair and Bush sincerely believed in the existence of the claimed weapons. Regardless, I don't think anyone can look back on the decision to invade without a sense of regret or, at the very least, ambivalence.

 

[Prince-1]

A Happy Yom Kippur to you and all other Jewish forumites!

Shalom and thank you.

 

[Prince-1]

Backing Israel, which is dehumanizing Palestinians more and more as the years go on.

Yeah, lets not support Israel and see what happens.

 

[LittleBuford]

Yeah, lets not support Israel and see what happens.

I've said it before, but one can support both Israel and the Palestinians. One doesn't need to pose a dichotomy (and I'm not saying you are).

 

[Willmark]

So that started the unrest, and then 2003 was the catalyst for the forming of modern day ISIS?

No, not just that from WWI to II there was a lot of issues then WWII happened further complicating things.

Then add in the Jews creating the state of Israel after the horrors of the Holocaust, the splitting up of Trans-Jordan, the wars with Israel, the rise of modern terrorism (really taking its current form in the early 70s). Then add in the Egyptian-Israeli Peace Accords in Camp David in the later 70s angering a lot of the Middle East and leading to Sadat’s murder. Iran-Iraq war from 1980-88; Iran Revolution.

In short, before we get to the first Gulf War there was a lot of things that happened to get us to 2003 with Bush ready to go to war.

 

[Disney Analyst]

The reason given for the invasion was that Hussein was developing weapons of mass destruction, which turned out not to be the case. Some hold that the reason was a spurious pretext from the outset, with oil being the real motive, but I actually think both Blair and Bush sincerely believed in the existence of the claimed weapons. Regardless, I don't think anyone can look back on the decision to invade without a sense of regret or, at the very least, ambivalence.

Ahh. It’s all flooding back to me now. I was only 12 in 2003 and was not very concerned with what was happening between then and my adulthood...

 

[Disney Analyst]

No, not just that from WWI to II there was a lot of issues then WWII happened further complicating things.

Then add in the Jews creating the state of Israel after the horrors of the Holocaust, the splitting up of Trans-Jordan, the wars with Israel, the rise of modern terrorism (really taking its current form in the early 70s). Then add in the Egyptian-Israeli Peace Accords in Camp David in the later 70s angering a lot of the Middle East and leading to Sadat’s murder. Iran-Iraq war from 1980-88; Iran Revolution.

In short, before we get to the first Gulf War there was a lot of things that happened to get us to 2003 with Bush ready to go to war.

liking only because I truly appreciate the information and you sharing it. I do not like the actual history that is being shared mind you.

 

[Willmark]

I've said it before, but one can support both Israel and the Palestinians. One doesn't need to pose a dichotomy (and I'm not saying you are).

We had nearly the entire world behind us to go into Afghanistan. We told them to hand him over, the Taliban said no. 100% justifiable.

Iraq? Not so much, I was not a fan of invasion then, now? Even worse in hindsight.

 

[Willmark]

liking only because I truly appreciate the information and you sharing it. I do not like the actual history that is being shared mind you.

I think I understand what you’re saying... had to read it a couple of times.