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General political chat

Jim S

Well-Known Member
To be honest though, I'm not sure how anyone could expect anything different from the Democratic party in its current form. I know this is exactly what I anticipated since shorty after he took office.

And the big worry and now irony was Trump would not accept the results of the election. How funny.
 

SorcererMC

Well-Known Member
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McCabe's out there dropping names like Tokhtakhunov.

A couple more for those late to the party.
Not to mention those running criminal activities out of Trump Tower: Alimzhan Tokhtakhounov. Anatoly Golubchik. Vyacheslav 'Yaponchik' Ivankov.
 

Angel Ariel

Well-Known Member
Actually aw14's Shapiro interview of Elder covered some of the need for vouchers. It was convincing and until someone can present a better argument then the problems will continue and I will support vouchers.

Why don't minority kids parents have the opportunity to get their kids out of failing schools? If you can refute Elder"s argument you could sell me on some other option.
You’re welcome to search back through my posts on the subject. There was quite the discussion about this here some time ago, and as I said I’m not getting into it again. My position is out there already.

And as a teacher I’ve worked in inner city schools that were failing, so my thoughts are not just ivory tower based - but come from experience.
 

seascape

Well-Known Member

This came across my feed today, and I’m sure it may surprise some here, but I do not agree with this approach at all.

I am not against some revisions to the electoral college implementation - namely it would be nice, IMO, to see all states move away from “winner takes all” and move to a proportionate allocation of the electoral votes based on the popular vote within the state (not the national popular vote). So losing a state doesn’t necessarily mean no electoral votes from that state - the winner would get x amount, and those who didn’t win would get x amount - all based on how much of the popular vote each candidate won. IMO, this would help decrease the whole “why should I bother to vote, I live in [insert state] and it’s going to go [jnsert D or R] anyway” train of thought. It could also make the feasibility of 3rd party candidates actually having a chance at winning a general election a bit stronger.

I do not think states should be tossing aside what their constituents have voted for to go along with the results of the national popular vote. If there’s a true desire to get rid of the electoral college (which I would disagree with), then it should be addressed in the ways in which the Constitution allows (ie amendment) - not circumventing it like this.
I think Maine and Nebraska do the electoral college the correct way. Every Congressional District gets one vote and the winner of the overall state vote gets 2. That is why Trump got one vote from Maine. Obama got one from Nebraska. If a plan like this were implemented it would also encourage more competitive house races.
 

DoubleJ21

Premium Member
It isn’t just “liberals” who are against school vouchers. I’m not going into it in this thread again, but you can use the search function to see previous discussions on that topic here.
A conservative, or really anybody, who is against school vouchers is misguided.
 
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LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
You would prefer a guiding mechanism that makes that determination?

I’ll stick with my opinion of Angel, which is higher than most here on the left, outside of @Gomer
I wasn’t talking about those of us here in this forum, but the left at large (which is what I took you to be referring to). My sense is that more American “leftists” are like Angel than they are like me (and I freely admit that she’s more pleasant and measured than I am).
 

SorcererMC

Well-Known Member
I don’t know who he referring to as the left, but I would agree with him - that’s never been an argument I’ve used re: the second amendment.
The point of Kirk's tweet is to suggest that the 4th amendment hasn't been properly applied to surveillance of Trump campaign team members like Carter Page. It's Deep State conspiracy theory nonsense.
McCabe fired from FBI and under indictment doing soft ball interviews making accusations for the uninformed to believe and post as if they are true.

He is a leaker and liar and his words should be taken with some degree of suspicion.
He's not under indictment. And he's not making accusations. He's raising questions about Trump's links to organized crime.
Take his words with suspicion if you like. I'll continue to follow the evidence that has been public for over a decade.
 

Angel Ariel

Well-Known Member
A conservative, or really anybody, who is against school vouchers is misguided.
Or has a different perspective. No one I personally know who is actually in education as a career field is on board with vouchers as they are implemented now. Conservatives and liberals alike. (Yes, there are in fact conservative public school teachers).

Again, I refer you back to existing posts that are easily searchable in this thread. I’m not rehashing them, especially given the sweeping “misguided” generalization above.
 

raven24

Well-Known Member
I have no doubt you don't want to hear what I have to say. And that is your loss.
I’m not losing out on anything you have to say.

And you’re right, I don’t want to read all of your posts, so I don’t. I’m not encouraging you to refrain from discussion and posting simply because I don’t care.
 

andysol

Well-Known Member
I wasn’t talking about those of us here in this forum, but the left at large (which is what I took you to be referring to). My sense is that more American “leftists” are like Angel than they are like me (and I freely admit that she’s more pleasant and measured than I am).
The best you’d get is studies with specific topics.

@aw14 shouldnt blanket statement a sentence like that. It should be “on this issue than most liberals” if that were, in fact, the case.

Example, as I recently sourced it from Pew:
If a liberal were to believe that racial discrimination was not “the main reason why black people can’t get ahead these days”, then they would not be like most liberals on that topic.

I think it important we classify specific topics vs blanket statements. Otherwise, we end up with “If you vote for Trump, you’re a bad person” rhetoric.
 

DoubleJ21

Premium Member
Or has a different perspective. No one I personally know who is actually in education as a career field is on board with vouchers as they are implemented now. Conservatives and liberals alike. (Yes, there are in fact conservative public school teachers).

Again, I refer you back to existing posts that are easily searchable in this thread. I’m not rehashing them, especially given the sweeping “misguided” generalization above.
I am looking back and you seem to be misguided as to how a voucher system would work, and the positive consequences. Based on your anecdotal evidence, you've come to the conclusion that the fault lies not with teachers, but 100% at the feet of the students and parents. As a recent graduate of a public school, I can tell you this assumption is misguided. Is the culture a problem in some areas? Yes. But, there are countless, worthless teachers as well, and the public schools have zero accountability as they rest on their laurels knowing no harm will come to them. Free choice among the parents forces competition into the school system, which today is a monopoly. There are also parents who would like to send their child to a school that lacks the anti-education culture, but they have no choice.

I have several family members who are public school teachers that would like to see a voucher system. They are tired of the corruption and the downright asinine behavior of their co-workers who would be fired on the spot in a private school. At least in a voucher system the public schools would actually have to compete on a level playing field for students, therefore increasing accountability.
 
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aw14

Well-Known Member
The best you’d get is studies with specific topics.

@aw14 shouldnt blanket statement a sentence like that. It should be “on this issue than most liberals” if that were, in fact, the case.

Example, as I recently sourced it from Pew:
If a liberal were to believe that racial discrimination was not “the main reason why black people can’t get ahead these days”, then they would not be like most liberals on that topic.

I think it important we classify specific topics vs blanket statements. Otherwise, we end up with “If you vote for Trump, you’re a bad person” rhetoric.
Please let me know which statement was blanketed...I would be interested in seeing

If you are referring to “typical left” I felt it self explanatory to this thread, since we are discussing this with each other and not random people outside. If anyone has been paying attention, there are certain posters here that are cartoon versions of the stereotypical left. I’ll allow people the opportunity to decide who that is for themself. @Angel Ariel is not one of them, which was my point.
 
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