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General political chat

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Actually, that happens a lot. Many conservatives are frequently labelled as Nazis or Hitler.

Nazism and Communism are two sides of the same evil coin. Neither should be used to smear people who do not fit into either category.
Yes, just as those of us on the left are branded communists or likened to Stalin. It’s a reductive and insulting comparison to make either way. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t accept that Nazism is a far-right ideology and that Soviet-style Communism is a far-left one.
 

Gitson Shiggles

There was me, that is Mickey, and my three droogs
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Jeb Bush made a rare comment on Twitter yesterday.. I think he used the term ‘“disappointing” words from our president ‘

He was promptly attacked for saying “disappointing” and not something stronger.
We’re such a hot mess.. The internet really does bring out the scum people.
Cause if your a pre-Trump, traditional Republican who criticizes the President, the leeches of #theresistance will be waiting to latch on to every word.
 

Gomer

Well-Known Member
Have you all not seen the “protests” and “counter protests” and “antifa” the past few years?

Is anyone seriously questioning that being “right” these days isn’t labeled as “Nazi” from a vocal portion of the “Left”? Really?
Not to muddy the waters. but there are ACTUAL nazi's who are identifying as "the right". Some of those Antifa counterprotests were actually against Nazis. It's dangerous to forget that these people exist and have chosen to latch on to Trump's populism and nationalism as a way to further their agenda.

And before you flip out on me, I am not saying Trump (or republicans for that matter) is a Nazi. But perhaps if he did more to distance them and not make them fell welcome under his "big tent" there would be less of those accusations. The same holds true for the left and any of the numerous examples you'll likely try to throw at me about violent or hateful people not being disowned by the Democrats. It seems these days we like to treat the opposition as the sum of their worst possible components as opposed to assuming those people to be an outlier. And our leaders are complicit in that by not distancing themselves from these people for fear of losing their support.
 

Gomer

Well-Known Member
Yes, just as those of us on the left are branded communists or likened to Stalin. It’s a reductive and insulting comparison to make either way. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t accept that Nazism is a far-right ideology and that Soviet-style Communism is a far-left one.
True, but just like communism isn't a de facto end of unbridled socialism, Fascism is the same in regards to right leaning philosphy. There's a component of control and manipulation for personal gain and oppressive power added into both that is not left or right.

Pure leftism or rightism (I don't think that's actually a word) in their purest form are not naturally oppressive. But are impractical and easily corruptible to become so. But their corrupted forms are not true right or left. They are unique and disgusting in very similar ways.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Because Naziism bears as much resemblance to modern American right politics as Communism does to the left. Nazis had components of today's far-right philosophy but it was a bastardization of those things into an oppressive system of government.

I think its overly reductive to compare the two. Where I have trouble with Mr. Buscuit is in the hypocrisy of taking the worst case scenario of left leaning politics as his examples of why it is dangerous and un-American, while only looking at the purest form of right wing philosophy as some bastion of personal liberty. We need to be consistent. If we look at leftism and modern American socialism as benign in comparison to oppressive Communism, I think its only fair to do the same when it comes to modern nationalism in comparison to fascism.
Please see my reply to Andrew C. Accepting where these ideologies fall on the political spectrum does not mean conflating them with more mainstream left- and right-wing approaches. Religion provides a good analogy. Average Christians and Muslims should not be tarred with the same brush as their (thankfully far less numerous) fundamentalist counterparts.
 

Andrew C

You know what's funny?
Premium Member
Accepting where these ideologies fall on the political spectrum does not mean conflating them with more mainstream left- and right-wing approaches.
People conflate them all the time. Whether a protester or politician, it is used for personal attack.
 

OneofThree

Well-Known Member
Pure leftism or rightism (I don't think that's actually a word) in their purest form are not naturally oppressive.
I disagree, primarily because radical left- or right-wing ideologies move toward totalitarianism of one form or another whether corruption is present or not. There is no greater form of oppression.
 

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
True, but just like communism isn't a de facto end of unbridled socialism, Fascism is the same in regards to right leaning philosphy. There's a component of control and manipulation for personal gain and oppressive power added into both that is not left or right.

Pure leftism or rightism (I don't think that's actually a word) in their purest form are not naturally oppressive. But are impractical and easily corruptible to become so. But their corrupted forms are not true right or left. They are unique and disgusting in very similar ways.
I largely agree with this. I’m sorry if my earlier posts were unclear: I did not mean to imply that either extreme is a teleological outcome of normal left- or right-leaning thought. Both are deplorable perversions.
 
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LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Have you all not seen the “protests” and “counter protests” and “antifa” the past few years?

Is anyone seriously questioning that being “right” these days isn’t labeled as “Nazi” from a vocal portion of the “Left”? Really?
That is not remotely what I said.
 

Gitson Shiggles

There was me, that is Mickey, and my three droogs
True, but just like communism isn't a de facto end of unbridled socialism, Fascism is the same in regards to right leaning philosphy. There's a component of control and manipulation for personal gain and oppressive power added into both that is not left or right.

Pure leftism or rightism (I don't think that's actually a word) in their purest form are not naturally oppressive. But are impractical and easily corruptible to become so. But their corrupted forms are not true right or left. They are unique and disgusting in very similar ways.
Arguing strictly on a right-left political paradigm can be confusing when discussing fascism and Marxism. It would be more appropriate to discuss on an anarchist-totalitarian paradigm. I can’t imagine more than an insignificant number of Americans vouching for a dictator.
 

Quinnmac000

Well-Known Member
Nazism is considered right wing because it's fascist. Per Merriam Webster, fascism a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorical leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition.

Nazis used the Aryan race and identity to push and state they were better and above others while being headed by an all powerful leader.

RIghtwing and leftwing can have authoritarian governments. The biggest difference however between communism and fascism is in perfect theory and not how its actually applied in a true communist society every one no matter what is considered equal whereas fascism thrives on class.
 

Gomer

Well-Known Member
I disagree, primarily because radical left- or right-wing ideologies move toward totalitarianism of one form or another whether corruption is present or not. There is no greater form of oppression.
But the philosophies in their ideal or pure state is not what is oppressive. It is the way they are implemented that become oppressive. That's why I find them impractical. At a large scale, there is no way to institute either without becoming oppressive. But at a smaller scale, (let say a small remote community or island where all citizens buy into the philosophy) they are possible.
 

Andrew C

You know what's funny?
Premium Member
It seems the lying orange doesn't fall from the lying orange tree.

Eric Trump goes head to head with a tv host about Eric's boast that, “We’ve got the fastest-growing economy in the history of our country,”. And guess what...he was wrong.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/eric-trump-fox-news-economy-lies-fact-checked_us_5b9b5868e4b013b0977954f5
Big deal. Kamala Harris, Cory Booker, and Hillary Clinton all lied this past week in relation to a SC hearing. And Trump ran his mouth about PR. And you're worried about Eric Trump boasting about the economy? People lie, boast, use hyperbole.

Be thankful we are in a strong economy rather than a recession. Goodness...
 
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