Discussion in 'Politics and Social Issues' started by truecoat, Mar 14, 2017.
I'll go first. Can we have a do over with November's election?
While I did not like either candidate the constitution prevents a redo election. Blame the primary voters who gave these 2 crazy candidates.
Oh god, this is the release we all needed. Thank you
Only if we could redo the one from 2008
What outside influencers compromised that election? The college system is one discussion, but there's a lot of evidence to show the 2016 election was unlike any other.
What does that mean?
I will stake out my territory,
I have a real skepticism for what any pol says. They just want to be sucking on the public tit for their livelihood and will do almost anything to keep or attain their job including for the prez. Trump scares the crap out of me and I don't think he will last the full four years (maybe wishful thinking) but it could be worse. Time will tell and the system allows for pain and growth, lets see what happens.
I'll wade in, but don't plan on spending much time down here. ... But the problem in November wasn't who won. That was Killary! (You know her, "THAT WOMAN!!! EMAILS!!! BENGHAZI!!!")
No, it is our system that says votes on the populated coasts are worth less than in the middle of nowhere. So backwards states full of people who are less worldly, less educated and less open-minded wind up pushing the country to the right when the reality is the opposite.
And you will never change this Electoral College crapfest. Twice in 15 years now, the winner of the popular vote was not elected President. I get why the EC exists, but it isn't 1894. This isn't working.
Oh, and I hate Trump in case anyone had any doubts at all. Hate him and hate people who voted for him and sent our country and literally the entire planet on a very dangerous path. (And I was no fan of W or Obama, but would give all of my money to have either of them back for four more years!) Very scary times.
The recent hits to gerrymandering could make a dent in those results.
In regards to the Electoral College, California and New York (very blue states) combined for 84 electoral votes in the last election.
That's one more than the 83 combined electoral votes of AL, MS, LA, AR, OK, KS, NE, SD, ND, WY, MT, ID, UT, AZ, AK. Going with the popular vote means that essentially the majors cities and the coasts determine elections. That isn't right either.
The electoral college isn't perfect, but Dems need to stop playing the blame game rants on social media and running to their safe zones for coloring books because they lost the election (and this is coming from someone who supported Obama for 8 years)
They're looking for excuses (popular vote, the Russians did it, etc) when the main reason why they lost is because not only did they put up a sub-par, establishment candidate against an outsider, but a candidate who didn't even bother to campaign in states like Wisconsin and Michigan, which lost her the election.
I wish Trump the best (rooting for a President to fail is ridiculous, imo) because if he fails, the country fails. Instead of complaining and blaming everyone else, the Dems need to blame themselves, take responsibility, and focus on 2020. This time let's actually choose someone who doesn't have a cargo load of baggage attached to him or her that gives Trump endless ammunition for counter attacks.
It still amazes me that people truly believe that Trump won because of the "uneducated." There's plenty of people on the "right", who weren't on the Trump Train, but showed up to vote for him. Those who took a chance, and who truly walked out of their voting location with a scared and uneasy feeling...knowing that they didn't vote for a candidate that they love, but that they voted for the lessor of 2 evils. It wasn't the Trump Train crowd who got him elected..they just got him the primary.
Anyway, OP- the election is over. We have a president. Sometimes one side wins, sometimes they lose. Such is life in America.
Let's all concentrate on Tomorrow, not Yesterday. Wishing for different results of the election won't change anything. But, if everyone would place the hostility and general attacks to the side, it will stop perpetuating the hate and ugliness that has been around for too long now.
We are all Americans. This divide needs to end. It has wrecked so much. I've never seen such hate like I did over the past 2 years.
At the end of the day, Left, Right, Middle- We all love this country, and we all want to see it remain great. (No pun intended)
Take the advice of Rafiki
That is perfect!!!
I don't think Trump will last four years.
Not because of impeachment, assassination or or slip and fall incident that will fuel conspiracy theories for years to come...
It'll be because of money. At some point, he'll realize he could be making more of it, with greater ease, by simply doing something else. The Nordstrom incident will be only one example. If he sees a decline in occupancy rates at his hotels or in any other business venture, he'll want out. Heck, his kids may push him in that direction if they sense their long term livelihood is not what it could be.
Then again..making ANY predictions over what will happen over the next 4-8 years seems foolish after what happened in 2016.
Trump won the election in large part because he was able to drive up voter turnout in rural counties (esp in Florida, The Midwest) significantly more than Romney did in 2012. Many of these people were first time voters, or ones who don't typically do so. That's why all the polls never saw them coming, because they typically poll "likely voters", which these people were not.
Many who voted for Trump were just that, Trump supporters NOT Republicans. Getting these people to both show up and vote for the other side will be an enormous challange for Democrats in 2020, one which I don't think they can pull off. If anything, Trump could lose 2020 because these folks feel the man didn't live up to their expectations and simply sit the next one out as they normally would.
A Californian's vote shouldn't count less than someone in the Heartland. A vote is a vote. If the system doesn't allow that, then so what exactly? Why is it OK to hand the Presidency to someone who got three millions fewer votes? Is that just? Leave the coloring book comments out of it. I supported Obama as well because he was the President, an obviously decent man and had a lot of racist bullcrap thrown on him that he never complained about or even pointed out. He was not a great leader, unfortunately. But history will write the book on him.
There were many reasons why 'they' lost. And the Russians playing games certainly didn't help and is way too serious an issue to simply brush off as an excuse (can you imagine if Killary won with help from the Russians? How about the half-black man before her?) Let's be serious. ... She was a lousy candidate in that she was unlikeable for whatever reasons (I think she was a warm puppy compared to the pussy-grabber). People liked Bernie, but let's again be real. An old Jewish socialist from Vermont has zero chance of being elected President of this country without 70% of the electorate dropping dead.
But the media also has some serious blame. The 'fake news' never treated Trump like a candidate. They treated him like a celebrity from Day 1 and it never stopped. Had they pointed out his many issues, I doubt he would have made it to Super Tuesday, but he was great for ratings. He still is. Just imagine what kind of ratings he could get if he started a major war ...
I don't want him to fail. I want him out of office ASAP. He is unhinged and dangerous. And he and his band of deplorables, led by true President Steve "Burn It Down" Bannon are literally taking our government apart day by day, hour by hour. That may sound like a good thing for all the 'government is the problem' people ... well, until they don't have clean drinking water or until their schools can't even teach the basics to allow us to compete or until 24 million more people don't have healthcare and they're one.
You can't govern the USA by Tweeter. You can't go out daily and bully and lie as the leader of the USA and have it not have consequences.
I am dating a German and when talking about the election in 2015 and '16 I said that Trump had no chance. That the USA would never elect a reality TV reject who had gone bankrupt 4-5 times and was known more for womanizing and having no class than anything else. Family and friends over there kept giving me a concerned look and reminding me that Hitler didn't steal power, he was given it. And media also played him up as largely crazy but harmless. We see how that ended. So, no, I do not want to wait and see and I will never support a man of his moral fiber as President. I hope he is out of office fast and without something horrible happening first.
I don't get how anyone thought Hillary's alleged transgressions were in the same universe as his. There are just a lot of angry, ignorant and hateful people out there.
It speaks volumes of ignorance lack of education that people would think he was ever the lesser of two evils. No, not everyone who voted for him fall into that. The rich, naturally, voted for him. The one issue voters (think things like abortion) voted for him. Even some idiot Sanders supporters threw their votes his way.
Whenever I hear people talk about Clinton what I hear is the same three things over and over:
"I couldn't vote for THAT WOMAN!" and "But her emails put our nation at risk!" and "Benghazi was all her fault."
And all I can think of is that there is nothing there of substance. Yet about 25% of registered American voters opted to go to the polls and place a gun to our collective head and pull the trigger. And right now, we are in a coma on life support. Maybe we'll be fine. Maybe we'll die. Maybe we'll be damaged from lightly to something you never recover from. But I wasn't suicidal. I didn't think America needed to be made great again.
Oh please, where exactly were you the last eight years when the GOP kept doing nothing but saying NO all the time and was so concerned with showing Obama "his place"? I see all the hatred Trump and his supporters have stirred up. I see the fear so many Americans have. We are reliving the Civil War, it just is taking a different form. Suddenly, the black man is gone and this clown is running things (or actually Bannon is) and we're supposed to simply all come together and sing "America The Beautiful"? Um ... no. Sorry. Not happening. But good luck with that.
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