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Frozen Musical and MATMM gone for good?

Dear Prudence

Well-Known Member
They can't just comply, it would be too complicated, some of Disneyland unions are ousting back against vaccine mandates for cast members. And can you imagine the complications of checking everyone that wanted to go to the show for proof of vaccination? Mask requirements are tricky to deal with too, but more doable.
All of this is completely doable. They just have to do it.
 

Dear Prudence

Well-Known Member
The hard part is the union, the other could be done, but they won't do it, because Orange County, CA has almost the same attitude towards mandates as Florida does, granted not quite as bad as them, but close.
It's actually not that hard at all. The unions are there so that performers do not get hurt. All the regional and touring houses can comply with the unions, and they have way fewer resources than Disney. All of the performing arts unions are (in compliance with Federal labor regulations) establish MINIMUMS of safety procedures. I mean, if Knott's doesn't hire union performers, that's not really a selling point for them. They have demonstrated questionable practices throughout the entire pandemic, did not issue a reassurance statement of support for its Black patrons and employees during the social movement of 2020, and is not known for quality the same way Disneyland is. Knott's is considered D-tier. Knott's not being able to work with unions or not hiring union performers is just a bullet point in their litany of not caring.
 

Mousertainment

Well-Known Member
Disney Junior Dance Party and Philharmagic are running indoor shows. So the issue is neither about live performers nor costumed characters dealing with crowds (DisJr has a very enclosed space in that small theater) nor indoor shows in larger theatrical venues (Phil).

Frozen is just an expensive show and the property has cooled enough (pardon the expression) that it may simply not be cost-effective nor an exciting enough property to bring back. Plus it lacked the spontaneity of Aladdin with Genie that made the show different every time you saw it. I never tired of seeing Aladdin. Ever. Whereas Frozen at the Hype, in spite of my love for the original film's soundtrack and my fondness for some of the performers in the show, always just left me cold (pun intended). If they did a Moana show, bet that would be more popular (either in DCA or DL).

Map's issue (any backstage crowding concerns aside now that everyone who works there is vaxxed) might be some lingering concerns regarding certain staging (i.e. Rapunzel and Flynn cuddling or the dancers pairing up in the big group ending number). But think those staging concerns could also be mitigated. And hopefully will. While Map isn't a top fave of mine at the moment, I'd be happy to see it back again. It brings some life to that corner, plus is an enjoyable mix of song and character appearances. Then again, I have a high tolerance for show repeatability as I would go see the same shows every week (sometimes multiple times per day, depending who was performing) when we could do that in the before-times...

Also, separate subject - Knott's employs plenty of current and former DL entertainment cast, union status notwithstanding. Practically their entire summer musical lineup came from DL the past couple of years.
 

PiratesMansion

Well-Known Member
I like the idea of a Moana show in the Hyperion.

It's time for Magical Map to be replaced. Similar, better shows have sprung at Hong Kong, Paris, and Tokyo, so they could easily do something in the same style if they wanted to. But by the end it definitely felt like they were just waiting for it to close with how infrequently it ran. Time, then, to swap it out with something else.

Come to think of it, I'm kind of shocked that they haven't thought about using Fantasyland Theater for some seasonal holiday shows. I feel like they would certainly get a decent audience for such shows and then they could bring in something that runs the rest of the year. That way no one gets tired of the same old thing playing there throughout the year.
 

waltography

Well-Known Member
I personally think and would not be surprised if both of the venues are demoed and become home to future attractions/ rides (hopefully D or maybe E tickets) as part of their respective lands.
This is likely true for FT, but I doubt the Hyperion will ever be demoed (at least in the near future). Even in the last few years when Frozen moved to an aperiodic schedule, it never had too much trouble reaching 90% capacity for its shows. A Disneyland without a fly system venue to host theatrical shows is one that would suffer a lot entertainment-wise.
 
This is likely true for FT, but I doubt the Hyperion will ever be demoed (at least in the near future). Even in the last few years when Frozen moved to an aperiodic schedule, it never had too much trouble reaching 90% capacity for its shows. A Disneyland without a fly system venue to host theatrical shows is one that would suffer a lot entertainment-wise.
The million dollar question is what would go into the Hyperion at that point. My money would be on a marvel stunt show in the same vein as the Bourne show at Universal. Then they could re-theme the exterior to blend in more with Avengers Campus .
 

Old Mouseketeer

Well-Known Member
They can't just comply, it would be too complicated, some of Disneyland unions are ousting back against vaccine mandates for cast members. And can you imagine the complications of checking everyone that wanted to go to the show for proof of vaccination? Mask requirements are tricky to deal with too, but more doable.
I haven’t heard of any Disneyland unions “ousting back” against vaccination. In fact, most unions have signed agreements with Disney, including the performers unions. The major holdouts are the Master Service’s Council who are working under an expired contract.
 

Sharon&Susan

Well-Known Member
The million dollar question is what would go into the Hyperion at that point. My money would be on a marvel stunt show in the same vein as the Bourne show at Universal. Then they could re-theme the exterior to blend in more with Avengers Campus .
I'd be surprised if Avengers Campus will be extended past it's current boundaries into Hollywood Land until the Avengers E Ticket is built and that's obviously not going to finish construction anytime soon.
 
I'd be surprised if Avengers Campus will be extended past it's current boundaries into Hollywood Land until the Avengers E Ticket is built and that's obviously not going to finish construction anytime soon.
I know that. Though It is likely that the animation building will be used for Marvel (the PYM logo on the building is a hint) I wonder if it will only be extended to the previously mentioned animation building and Hyperion and the Backlot area where the sunset showcase theater and Monsters Inc are will be used for an entirely different land. I would like to see that personally as it would add balance to DCA which is basically 50% Marvel 50% Pixar at this moment.
 

Sharon&Susan

Well-Known Member
I know that. Though It is likely that the animation building will be used for Marvel (the PYM logo on the building is a hint) I wonder if it will only be extended to the previously mentioned animation building and Hyperion and the Backlot area where the sunset showcase theater and Monsters Inc are will be used for an entirely different land. I would like to see that personally as it would add balance to DCA which is basically 50% Marvel 50% Pixar at this moment.
I doubt the Pym logo is particularly meant to be a hint of the future of the building. The Imagineers designed an area where the view of the back of that showbuilding would be unavoidable so they painted something on it to have it be somewhat themed.

I also sincerely doubt by the time, let's say a bit less than a decade from now, they want to expand AC (if they ever do) into HL, that Ant-Man would be the top superhero pick for a new ride.
 

drizgirl

Well-Known Member
The million dollar question is what would go into the Hyperion at that point. My money would be on a marvel stunt show in the same vein as the Bourne show at Universal. Then they could re-theme the exterior to blend in more with Avengers Campus .
And would certainly be consistent with Disney’s propensity to act in response to Universal rather than acting on their own.
 

Mousertainment

Well-Known Member
There is already a Marvel stunt show multiple times daily at Avengers Campus (2 if you also count Spidey and 3 when the Shang-Chi mini-show was running). Plus the Warriors of Wakanda training show and the Doctor Strange magic show. They're not going to use that huge theater for anything other than a big diverse theatrical showpiece (ahem, Moana) that will bring in huge family crowds to fill all the seats. A Marvel stunt show will not do that.
 

truecoat

Well-Known Member
There is already a Marvel stunt show multiple times daily at Avengers Campus (2 if you also count Spidey and 3 when the Shang-Chi mini-show was running). Plus the Warriors of Wakanda training show and the Doctor Strange magic show. They're not going to use that huge theater for anything other than a big diverse theatrical showpiece (ahem, Moana) that will bring in huge family crowds to fill all the seats. A Marvel stunt show will not do that.

There's a theater style stunt show in Paris. They could bring it over to the Hyperion.
 

Mousertainment

Well-Known Member
There's a theater style stunt show in Paris. They could bring it over to the Hyperion.
Thought that only ran during their Summer of Super Heroes event? It looked fun from what I saw but think it only ran a few months? And again, wouldn't bring in the crowds a Moana (or Lion King, etc.) or other family show would, and there are 2-3 stunt shows already right nearby. The last thing that area needs is another one.
 
There is already a Marvel stunt show multiple times daily at Avengers Campus (2 if you also count Spidey and 3 when the Shang-Chi mini-show was running). Plus the Warriors of Wakanda training show and the Doctor Strange magic show. They're not going to use that huge theater for anything other than a big diverse theatrical showpiece (ahem, Moana) that will bring in huge family crowds to fill all the seats. A Marvel stunt show will not do that.
If they keep the Hyperion and fold it into whatever replaces Hollywood Land (if it is non Marvel) A cool show would be a Villains show as many Disney Parks fans have wanted an experience that focuses heavily on the Villains. Or they could demo the Hyperion and make way for a Marvel attraction if the Disneyland Forward plans have the space to build a new and improved Hyperion like theater along the lines of the forest theater at Tokyo Disneyland with more elegant looks and an indoor lobby.
 

cmwade77

Well-Known Member
It's actually not that hard at all. The unions are there so that performers do not get hurt. All the regional and touring houses can comply with the unions, and they have way fewer resources than Disney. All of the performing arts unions are (in compliance with Federal labor regulations) establish MINIMUMS of safety procedures. I mean, if Knott's doesn't hire union performers, that's not really a selling point for them. They have demonstrated questionable practices throughout the entire pandemic, did not issue a reassurance statement of support for its Black patrons and employees during the social movement of 2020, and is not known for quality the same way Disneyland is. Knott's is considered D-tier. Knott's not being able to work with unions or not hiring union performers is just a bullet point in their litany of not caring.
I think you are confusing things, it isn't Knott's that has had questionable practices during the entire pandemic, they have made sure they have taken care of their employees (keeping several employed even when the park was completely closed) and their guests alike. They also followed through with every promise they made during the pandemic, something that Disney did not do. Disney broke almost every promise they made during the pandemic.

Unions do not keep anyone safe, unions are outdated and useless. For example, the unions right now are trying to negotiate with Disney to get the same starting wage that Knott's is already offering. Knott's has shown how to reopen safely throughout this mess, even to the point of going overkill on their safety measures at times.
 

Dear Prudence

Well-Known Member
I think you are confusing things, it isn't Knott's that has had questionable practices during the entire pandemic, they have made sure they have taken care of their employees (keeping several employed even when the park was completely closed) and their guests alike. They also followed through with every promise they made during the pandemic, something that Disney did not do. Disney broke almost every promise they made during the pandemic.

Unions do not keep anyone safe, unions are outdated and useless. For example, the unions right now are trying to negotiate with Disney to get the same starting wage that Knott's is already offering. Knott's has shown how to reopen safely throughout this mess, even to the point of going overkill on their safety measures at times.
I am not confused, I just don't think you and I are going to agree. The only reason I bothered commenting on this thread is because I am a member of a couple of the performing arts unions, and have been for years, so I was offering that perspective. I initially didn't want to say that because it gives away too much about my personal life. I can't speak for all of the ones I listed, but I am very, very familiar with the safety procedures of the two I am part of. Cutting corners gets people hurt. We are obviously not going to agree.
 
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TP2000

Well-Known Member
First of all, fabulous insight @Mousertainment! Thank you for sharing what you know. It helps shed light on some things.

Secondly...
I like the idea of a Moana show in the Hyperion.

Eh, yeah, kind of. That property seems like it would be a better fit for the Fantasyland Theatre, and back in 2016 when the movie came out. Disneyland used to do that routinely with the Fantasyland Theatre; do a new show based on that summer's big animation blockbuster. But then they stopped.

But now? Five years after Moana came out? I think that ship has sailed.
Come to think of it, I'm kind of shocked that they haven't thought about using Fantasyland Theater for some seasonal holiday shows.

That's another thing they used to do a lot at Disneyland. A Christmas show in the Fantasyland Theatre. Mickey's Nutcracker was a thing for many years there. @Mousertainment probably knows better details on that than I can provide from my rusty memory banks.

I haven’t heard of any Disneyland unions “ousting back” against vaccination. In fact, most unions have signed agreements with Disney, including the performers unions. The major holdouts are the Master Service’s Council who are working under an expired contract.

That's the Million Dollar Question. I've asked it repeatedly in the Covid thread here, but no one knows. Disneyland was supposed to have had a vaccine mandate for all Cast Members that kicked in back in October. But.... silence.

It appears to have been something quietly dropped by Disney's Burbank execs and TDA execs. No vaccine mandate in Anaheim, at least not yet. And it's November.
 

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