Frozen in Norway: Am I the only one who doesn't mind?

Does anyone not mind if Frozen Ever After is in EPCOT?

  • Yes

    Votes: 11 44.0%
  • No

    Votes: 14 56.0%

  • Total voters
    25

Heppenheimer

Well-Known Member
Ask Disney that question as to why they don’t actually use it as a studio anymore.. but the fact remains.. the rides there have always been focused strictly on the film IPs developed, collaborated & owned (via by either contractual rights or outright ownership) by said studios (Disney in this case) thus, they’re easily more fit for a studios themed park than a real world concept & culture focused park…. It’s that simple
Maybe Marni1971 can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the "working studios" idea died a quick death because productions didn't much like working under fishbowl conditions.

Another factor may have been cost, since the infrastructure to fully support a viable film and television industry in central FL simply wasn't there. Building a couple of sound stages isn't a replacement for having to pay per diem rates and relocation costs to all the specialists who would be needed to make full use of the facility.

Finally, I think we're overstating how much of a "studio" this park ever really was. When the park opened, it was mostly just shows, one dark ride, and the "backlot tour", which despite the name, was more like a glorified static of props and effects display via drive-by and walk-through than an actual working studio backlot. The only "studio" parts were the brief walk-by of the sound stages, which seemed to be almost permanently devoid of activity.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the animation studio seemed to last much longer. Up until at least the mid 1990s, I remember seeing evidence of actual film work being done.
 
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SteveAZee

Well-Known Member
Maybe Marni1971 can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the "working studios" idea died a quick death because productions didn't much like working under fishbowl conditions.

Another factor may have been cost, since the infrastructure to fully support a viable film and television industry in central FL simply wasn't there. Building a couple of sound stages isn't a replacement for having to pay per diem rates and relocation costs to all the specialists who would be needed to make full use of the facility.

Finally, I think we're overstating how much of a "studio" this park every really was. When the park opened, it was mostly just shows, one dark ride, and the "backlot tour", which despite the name, was more like a glorified static display via drive-by and walk-through of props and effects than an actual working studio backlot. The only "studio" parts were the brief walk-by of the sound stages, which seemed to be almost permanently devoid of activity.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the animation studio seemed to last much longer. Up until at least the mid 1990s, I remember seeing evidence of actual film work being done.
The only 'real' thing I recall seeing there was taking the animation tour and seeing people toiling away on their computers doing animation work (at least that's what we were told). It seemed really intrusive to be seeing inside someone's cubicle, their personal items, all of that... I can't imagine having to work and concentrate in those conditions. I suppose some just got used to it.
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the animation studio seemed to last much longer. Up until at least the mid 1990s, I remember seeing evidence of actual film work being done.

I think the animation studio worked all the way into the early 2000s, although it may have been the late 90s.

I remember people working on Mulan when I was there in the mid 90s.
 

marni1971

Park History nut
Premium Member
The only "studio" parts were the brief walk-by of the sound stages, which seemed to be almost permanently devoid of activity.
Here’s a link (don’t want to copy) to main productions shot / recorded at DMGM:


Despite DMGM being designed to add another four sound stages, the biggest issue was talent didn’t want to live / work in Florida. Studios elsewhere didn’t want shows to relocate. Then certain states become more shooting friendly than Florida. I could however show you certain days when the six studios at my day job are also devoid of activity. There is no argument though that for TWDC and NBCU it was a grand experiment that flopped.
 

mharrington

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
1. There have been objections to Toy Story & Star Wars in DHS

2. DHS is in an identity crisis right now, and currently it's just viewed as a "ride the movies park," so Star Wars and Toy Story fit just fine, as would Frozen.

3. EPCOT has a strong identity, like it or leave it, and so a thematic inconsistency will be reacted to strongly. DHS does not have a strong identity, and its theme isn't really even clear let alone cohesive.

There "have been" objections to Toy Story and Star Wars in DHS? Why then does the second indicate that there are no problems with them being at DHS? I personally believe that Frozen in the Studios would be even more egregious than Epcot, where they at least tried to tie it in to Norway. I would like to share something with you that proves my point and hopefully puts this concern to rest. While Arendelle itself may not be a real place, it is named after a real place: https://www.visitnorway.com/places-to-go/southern-norway/arendal/.

And furthermore, there's this...

"Per Disney, Arendelle gets its name from Arendal, a 16th-century shipping town about a three-hour drive southwest of Oslo"
Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/trav...outhern-fjords-180956427/#btdCgAs5lKEvxDhT.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

So Frozen being in the Norway Pavilion is actually very thematically appropriate.
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
There "have been" objections to Toy Story and Star Wars in DHS? Why then does the second indicate that there are no problems with them being at DHS? I personally believe that Frozen in the Studios would be even more egregious than Epcot, where they at least tried to tie it in to Norway. I would like to share something with you that proves my point and hopefully puts this concern to rest. While Arendelle itself may not be a real place, it is named after a real place: https://www.visitnorway.com/places-to-go/southern-norway/arendal/.

And furthermore, there's this...

"Per Disney, Arendelle gets its name from Arendal, a 16th-century shipping town about a three-hour drive southwest of Oslo"
Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/trav...outhern-fjords-180956427/#btdCgAs5lKEvxDhT.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

So Frozen being in the Norway Pavilion is actually very thematically appropriate.

That's as big a stretch as I've ever seen. Using this logic, it would be thematically appropriate to put a sci-fi ride set on another planet named Beijingal in the China pavilion because they based the name on Beijing, which is a real place in China.

Regardless, I'm not sure why you're so desperate to prove Frozen is a good thematic fit in Norway. If you believe it is, that's great. But you're not going to convince people who don't agree because they've already seen/heard anything you could bring up.
 

SteveAZee

Well-Known Member
Here’s a link (don’t want to copy) to main productions shot / recorded at DMGM:


Despite DMGM being designed to add another four sound stages, the biggest issue was talent didn’t want to live / work in Florida. Studios elsewhere didn’t want shows to relocate. Then certain states become more shooting friendly than Florida. I could however show you certain days when the six studios at my day job are also devoid of activity. There is no argument though that for TWDC and NBCU it was a grand experiment that flopped.
I forgot about Thunder in Paradise. :rolleyes:
 

SteveAZee

Well-Known Member
Also filmed exterior The Living Seas if I recall.
Yes, and the Canada pavilion, I believe. It was a little excruciating to watch... it seemed like they were shoehorning storylines (as they were) to fit places around the resort that they could film.

Ah, here's a list:

 

Heppenheimer

Well-Known Member
There "have been" objections to Toy Story and Star Wars in DHS? Why then does the second indicate that there are no problems with them being at DHS? I personally believe that Frozen in the Studios would be even more egregious than Epcot, where they at least tried to tie it in to Norway. I would like to share something with you that proves my point and hopefully puts this concern to rest. While Arendelle itself may not be a real place, it is named after a real place: https://www.visitnorway.com/places-to-go/southern-norway/arendal/.

And furthermore, there's this...

"Per Disney, Arendelle gets its name from Arendal, a 16th-century shipping town about a three-hour drive southwest of Oslo"
Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/trav...outhern-fjords-180956427/#btdCgAs5lKEvxDhT.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

So Frozen being in the Norway Pavilion is actually very thematically appropriate.
Btw... something that has always bugged me. Under Norwegian orthography (and pretty much every Germanic language except English), using the spelling "Arendelle" would give a pronunciation of something like "AHR-en-del-a". So, in addition to Scandinavians being freaked out by snow, Disney got that wrong too.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Here’s a link (don’t want to copy) to main productions shot / recorded at DMGM:


Despite DMGM being designed to add another four sound stages, the biggest issue was talent didn’t want to live / work in Florida. Studios elsewhere didn’t want shows to relocate. Then certain states become more shooting friendly than Florida. I could however show you certain days when the six studios at my day job are also devoid of activity. There is no argument though that for TWDC and NBCU it was a grand experiment that flopped.
I was lucky enough to see Tom Hanks filming an intro for 'From the Earth to the Moon' in the 90's. When I say 'filming' he was actually stood in the studio below talking and drinking a beverage as our group passed overhead and we were told he was making a tv series. I have the boxset and it's great, however he just appears in front of a backdrop for around 2 minutes at the start of each episode explaining what that episode is based on in case anyone rushes out to buy it thinking he acts in it which he doesn't.
 

mharrington

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
That's as big a stretch as I've ever seen. Using this logic, it would be thematically appropriate to put a sci-fi ride set on another planet named Beijingal in the China pavilion because they based the name on Beijing, which is a real place in China.

Regardless, I'm not sure why you're so desperate to prove Frozen is a good thematic fit in Norway. If you believe it is, that's great. But you're not going to convince people who don't agree because they've already seen/heard anything you could bring up.
I just want to know if there are others here besides me who are willing to accept Frozen being in Epcot.

Anyway, there is one more thing: https://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2016/07/a-look-inside-frozen-ever-after-at-epcot/. At least one person posted in the comments there that Arendelle is directly inspired by Norway, in architecture and clothing. More importantly, the filmmakers actually went to Norway to conduct research. Even some of Norway's landmarks appear in the film.

There is no way that a Frozen ride would fit in the Studios if it was as carefully and deliberately researched for Norway as it was.
 

BlakeW39

Well-Known Member
There "have been" objections to Toy Story and Star Wars in DHS? Why then does the second indicate that there are no problems with them being at DHS? I personally believe that Frozen in the Studios would be even more egregious than Epcot, where they at least tried to tie it in to Norway. I would like to share something with you that proves my point and hopefully puts this concern to rest. While Arendelle itself may not be a real place, it is named after a real place: https://www.visitnorway.com/places-to-go/southern-norway/arendal/.

And furthermore, there's this...

"Per Disney, Arendelle gets its name from Arendal, a 16th-century shipping town about a three-hour drive southwest of Oslo"
Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/trav...outhern-fjords-180956427/#btdCgAs5lKEvxDhT.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter

So Frozen being in the Norway Pavilion is actually very thematically appropriate.

??? Because both can be true? Something can be criticized but still have merit. Personally I think the changes to DHS are for the best, but some who are attached to the original concept have voices their objections.

I'm not really sure what your point is though? Is it that you think Frozen does fit in EPCOT? Or that there are worse offenders? Because everytime I answer your questions, to just reply with another random example of Disney doing something unrelated that you think should be criticized....as well? instead?
 

mharrington

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
??? Because both can be true? Something can be criticized but still have merit. Personally I think the changes to DHS are for the best, but some who are attached to the original concept have voices their objections.

I'm not really sure what your point is though? Is it that you think Frozen does fit in EPCOT? Or that there are worse offenders? Because everytime I answer your questions, to just reply with another random example of Disney doing something unrelated that you think should be criticized....as well? instead?
I think Frozen does fit in Epcot, especially now that I know that the people who did the movie have done research on it.
 

mharrington

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
So many have insisted that Frozen would work great in the Studios, and yet all I can think of is the ride being housed in a generic building, like the Little Mermaid show:
Featured-Voyage-of-the-Little-Mermaid-620x330.jpg
 

Inspired Figment

Well-Known Member
There is no way that a Frozen ride would fit in the Studios if it was as carefully and deliberately researched for Norway as it was.
I’m sorry man.. but.. you could make the same argument for films like Little Mermaid or literally ‘any’ other animated feature that had research done on it to make it’s locations & elements as believable as possible, as they’re ‘inspired’ by those places/elements. If we’re strictly going off the ‘content’ presented within the ride however.. the ride is, in essence, a movie focused darkride with songs and the familiar characters throughout, the underlying story is we’re supposed to meet Elsa at her ice palace for a snowy summer celebration .. there’s nothing there that specifically makes it an ‘EPCOT’ ride (being a recreation or showcase of a ‘real’ place and it’s cultures). Pretty sure it could be placed at DHS via a Frozen Land (ala Galaxy’s Edge) and could fit easily. That park has mostly movie themed rides & lands of that nature. Heck, that’s the treatment it’s getting being cloned/brought over to some of the other parks around the world… further proving that there’s nothing about the ride that makes it truly fit uniquely at EPCOT other than the ‘fictional’ world of Arendelle being ‘inspired’ by Scandavian locations and it being shoehorned into the Norway pavilion (which is supposed to recreate the ‘real’ elements & locals of Norway) previously built in the 80s without it.
 
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Inspired Figment

Well-Known Member
Just because the fantasy realm of Arendelle was created via research by visiting various parts of Scandinavia to make it more believable for the ‘movie’.. doesn’t make it a “perfect fit” for EPCOT. It, again, is not a real, genuine place you can visit in Norway.. and the ride’s content doesn’t make any strong efforts to truly showcase or tie itself into ‘real’ Norwegian locals, it’s people, or it’s customs.
 
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