From the OS: Gator drags child into Seven Seas Lagoon

[SorcererMC]

Incorrect. The actual water is technically owned by the State of Florida.

Wow. That introduces the whole other issue of FL Fish and Wildlife. (I haven't gone back through all of the pages so I apologize if this was already brought up, what liability FWC may or may not have).

 

[DisneyDreamer08]

Did they say first alligator attack or first death from an alligator attack?

In the press conference I saw (and the one referenced in the article) he just says, nothing like this has happened before. So I guess its subjective. I'm just surprised there aren't more signs on property specifically warning of alligators, not just 'no swimming' signs. I think that's the point, alligator attacks can, and have, happened. Obvious to southerns, maybe not so for others.

 

[Nubs70]

Can you swim in 2 inch high water??

Yes, they call me "skeeter"

 

[JohnD]

In the press conference I saw (and the one referenced in the article) he just says, nothing like this has happened before. So I guess its subjective. I'm just surprised there aren't more signs on property specifically warning of alligators, not just 'no swimming' signs. I think that's the point, alligator attacks can, and have, happened. Obvious to southerns, maybe not so for others.

There will be updated signs. We can be sure of that.

 

[SorcererMC]

If there is a lawsuit, Disney's lawyers will submit for immediate dismissal. The laws in FL are that the Fish and Wildlife Commission are responsible for the wildlife, this is a fact and not speculation. They are responsible for the waterways and areas on Disney's property, NOT Disney. The FWC cannot be sued because of actions of wildlife. Another entity cannot be held liable because the responsible entity cannot be sued.

And it appears that my question has already been answered above.

 

[Nemo14]

Our local news (RI) covered that this morning too. The guy showed his scars, and also mentioned a settlement.

 

[SeanWM48]

wanted to add - no need to delete the thread. yes some comments are insensitive but that's life. nothing wrong with some debate, i actually enjoyed reading the legal debates about whether or not WDW has any responsibility. embrace debate don't hide from it.

just because some posts offend you doesn't mean we need to erase 80 pages of content.

 

[Lucky]

Yes. They most definitely will have some form of warning going forward. If they didn't, then it would be negligence.

So if there have been any previous incidents, they were negligent in this instance? Because apparently there have been...

Yesterday in one of the news conferences they mentioned this was the first gator attack on Disney property. I know its been mentioned else where in this thread. For what its worth, that is not the case. My local news reported this last night

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/nh-child-attacked-by-gator-at-disney-world-30-years-ago/345144911

You see warning signs about alligators in state parks and other FL locations frequented by tourists, even where there haven't been incidents.

 

[WEDwaydatamover]

Again DisneyDreamer08- "Nothing like THIS has ever happened before" was said at the Press Conference if I understand you.

That doesn't mean that it hasn't happened before and differenty. Not fatally anyhow and to a toddler. So Disney is being technically truthful but wording it in a deceptive way for those not paying attention.

It clearly has happened before. You posted the link. I'm not being argumentative. It's the words used that you have to think about.

Thanks for your post.

 

[docdebbi]

READ THIS ON A FACEBOOK PAGE- EXACTLY HOW I HAVE BEEN FEELING READING MOST OF THIS THREAD.
I'M SURE THE AUTHOR WOULDN'T MIND MY REPOSTING- I HAVE BEEN IN TEARS FOR DAYS, BUT THIS REALLY BROUGHT THEM OUT.


Parents, I beg of you, stop blaming and shaming other parents.
35 years ago, a mom shopping in a Sears department store went to go look at lamps, and left her six year old with another group of boys, who were all trying out the new Atari game at a kiosk. That boy’s name was Adam Walsh.
30 years ago, an 18 month old toddler playing in her aunt’s backyard fell into a well. Rescuers worked nonstop for 58 hours, finally freeing “Baby Jessica” from the well.
In both cases a tragedy happened, an unforeseen tragic accident took place which left Adam dead, and a toddler fighting for her life deep underground. But they also has something else in common; they had an entire country of moms and dads supporting the grieving parents.
Let me repeat that, EVERYONE SUPPORTED THE RESCUE EFFORTS WITHOUT BLAME. NO BLAME. None. ZERO.
No questions asked, not one single “Where were the parents?” comment. Just a country of other moms and dads, grandmas and grandpas watching in horror as a set of parents, one of their own, went through the unthinkable. Adam was our son. Jessica was our baby daughter.
THOSE PARENTS WERE US.
Flash forward to 2016, the year of THE PERFECT PARENT
Yesterday, a two year old boy, splashing in the magical lakefront waters of a Disney Resort, succumbed to the wilds of mother nature. An aggressive alligator scooped him out of the water, right under the watch of his father, who attempted to fight with the alligator to free his baby son. Pure horror. Sheer Terror. Parents who actually had to watch their baby be taken from them, as if they were in some African nature documentary.
A tragic and unforeseeable accident. An accident.
I weep for this mother and father. I am sick with anguish for the pain, agony, misery, and regret pulsating through their viens this very second. And I bet you are too.
But not everyone is.
You see, we now live in a time where accidents are not allowed happen. You heard me. Accidents, of any form, in any way, and at any time, well, they just don’t happen anymore.
Why? Because BLAME and SHAME.
Because we have become a nation of BLAMERS and SHAMERS.
And how are accidents allowed to happen if we can’t blame someone? Surly, they can’t, right? I mean, random acts of nature, unpreventable tragedies, and fateful life changing events that take place in a matter of nanoseconds cannot possibly take place if everyone is being a responsible parent, right? NOPE.
They can’t, because this country and its population of perfect pitchfork carrying mothers and fathers sitting behind keyboards needs to accuse. They NEED TO BLAME, to disparage, to criticize in every damn way and at every damn corner, the parenting of another.
And when do they really get to lick their blaming chops? When a tragic accident happens. That’s when the pouncing is at its freshest, when raw emotion and ignorance collide, and they dig their word claws in, and take hold of whatever grace these grieving mothers and fathers have left in their souls.
And then they tear it out.
Listen to me very clearly perfect parents, VERY CLEARLY.
I’VE HAD ENOUGH.
I’ve had enough of scrolling through comment threads and seeing over and over again questions like “Where were the parents?” and thoughts like, “This is what happens when you don’t watch your kids.”
I have simply HAD ENOUGH.
I have one question for the blaming and shaming moms and dads. You know the ones who immediately blame the parents, the ones who go on the internet and type comments like, “This is nothing but neglect by the parents,” and “They should have known better. Who was watching that little boy?” and my favorite, “I would never let that happen to my kid.”
Here is my question,
Have you ever been to a child’s funeral before?
I have.
The funeral of a child is an event in life that you never, ever want to experience.
Now let me ask you another question.
In the coming week these parents will fly back to their home in Nebraska without one of their children. They will leave a vacation resort, packing up his Buzz Lightyear pajamas and his favorite blanket, and they will make an excruciatingly difficult journey home. A journey that they never in a million years thought they would be making.
They will meet with a funeral director, pick out a tiny casket, a tiny burial suit, and surrounded by family, they will bury their baby boy.
And they will suffer every single day for the rest of their life.
At the funeral for this two year boy who died in front of his parents, can you do me a favor? Can you walk up to the mother and say the words that you just typed out last week? Can you? Can you greet her, hug her, shake the father’s hand and then say, “ Who was watching that little boy? You should have known better. I would never let that happen to MY child.”
Can you do that for me? I mean, you felt those words so deeply in your heart and soul that you typed them for a million people to read. Certainly you can say it straight to the faces of the people you meant it for, right?
Here, let me help you
Put away your pitchfork for a moment and try this.

To the mother and father who went for a walk on vacation for the last time with their little boy yesterday, I am deeply sorry that you had to experience the worst kind of tragedy possible, an accident. I grieve with you. Your baby was my baby. Your son was my son. I have nothing but love for you, love to help you get though the pain yesterday, today, and for what is gonna seem like a thousand tomorrows. I wrap my thoughts and prayers around your aching heart and soul. May the God of this universe in some miraculous way bring peace to you and your family.

That is what you say. THAT. And just THAT.

Stop the blaming.

Stop the shaming.

In their darkest hours, can we please just LOVE other parents. Please?

 

[flynnibus]

The law is quite clear on this and why like you said Disney won't let it get to court. They would lose and it won't even be close. It not just about the warning. Disney has an obligation to protect it's guests from harm that they are aware of. And Disney of course knows there are gators in the water because they remove them frequently. So as far as the law is concerned the fact that a gator came and grabbed a child on a beach that didn't have a fence to guard against such an attack is enough to have them lose the case.

In short... No. Your premises are actually called out in the previously mentioned case law and were not enough. There is nota standard that Disney must prevent gators from being there, nor are warnings irrelevant in limiting liability.

Disney's obligations to protect its visitors does have limits.

 

[JohnD]

Now that the tragedy is resolved, it's now Thursday Morning quarterback time in the media. The focus is the signage. When they lead with "Did Disney do enough?", you don't need to see the story. The conclusion is already implied: No.

 

[meyeet]

READ THIS ON A FACEBOOK PAGE- EXACTLY HOW I HAVE BEEN FEELING READING MOST OF THIS THREAD.
I'M SURE THE AUTHOR WOULDN'T MIND MY REPOSTING- I HAVE BEEN IN TEARS FOR DAYS, BUT THIS REALLY BROUGHT THEM OUT.


Parents, I beg of you, stop blaming and shaming other parents.
35 years ago, a mom shopping in a Sears department store went to go look at lamps, and left her six year old with another group of boys, who were all trying out the new Atari game at a kiosk. That boy’s name was Adam Walsh.
30 years ago, an 18 month old toddler playing in her aunt’s backyard fell into a well. Rescuers worked nonstop for 58 hours, finally freeing “Baby Jessica” from the well.
In both cases a tragedy happened, an unforeseen tragic accident took place which left Adam dead, and a toddler fighting for her life deep underground. But they also has something else in common; they had an entire country of moms and dads supporting the grieving parents.
Let me repeat that, EVERYONE SUPPORTED THE RESCUE EFFORTS WITHOUT BLAME. NO BLAME. None. ZERO.
No questions asked, not one single “Where were the parents?” comment. Just a country of other moms and dads, grandmas and grandpas watching in horror as a set of parents, one of their own, went through the unthinkable. Adam was our son. Jessica was our baby daughter.
THOSE PARENTS WERE US.
Flash forward to 2016, the year of THE PERFECT PARENT
Yesterday, a two year old boy, splashing in the magical lakefront waters of a Disney Resort, succumbed to the wilds of mother nature. An aggressive alligator scooped him out of the water, right under the watch of his father, who attempted to fight with the alligator to free his baby son. Pure horror. Sheer Terror. Parents who actually had to watch their baby be taken from them, as if they were in some African nature documentary.
A tragic and unforeseeable accident. An accident.
I weep for this mother and father. I am sick with anguish for the pain, agony, misery, and regret pulsating through their viens this very second. And I bet you are too.
But not everyone is.
You see, we now live in a time where accidents are not allowed happen. You heard me. Accidents, of any form, in any way, and at any time, well, they just don’t happen anymore.
Why? Because BLAME and SHAME.
Because we have become a nation of BLAMERS and SHAMERS.
And how are accidents allowed to happen if we can’t blame someone? Surly, they can’t, right? I mean, random acts of nature, unpreventable tragedies, and fateful life changing events that take place in a matter of nanoseconds cannot possibly take place if everyone is being a responsible parent, right? NOPE.
They can’t, because this country and its population of perfect pitchfork carrying mothers and fathers sitting behind keyboards needs to accuse. They NEED TO BLAME, to disparage, to criticize in every damn way and at every damn corner, the parenting of another.
And when do they really get to lick their blaming chops? When a tragic accident happens. That’s when the pouncing is at its freshest, when raw emotion and ignorance collide, and they dig their word claws in, and take hold of whatever grace these grieving mothers and fathers have left in their souls.
And then they tear it out.
Listen to me very clearly perfect parents, VERY CLEARLY.
I’VE HAD ENOUGH.
I’ve had enough of scrolling through comment threads and seeing over and over again questions like “Where were the parents?” and thoughts like, “This is what happens when you don’t watch your kids.”
I have simply HAD ENOUGH.
I have one question for the blaming and shaming moms and dads. You know the ones who immediately blame the parents, the ones who go on the internet and type comments like, “This is nothing but neglect by the parents,” and “They should have known better. Who was watching that little boy?” and my favorite, “I would never let that happen to my kid.”
Here is my question,
Have you ever been to a child’s funeral before?
I have.
The funeral of a child is an event in life that you never, ever want to experience.
Now let me ask you another question.
In the coming week these parents will fly back to their home in Nebraska without one of their children. They will leave a vacation resort, packing up his Buzz Lightyear pajamas and his favorite blanket, and they will make an excruciatingly difficult journey home. A journey that they never in a million years thought they would be making.
They will meet with a funeral director, pick out a tiny casket, a tiny burial suit, and surrounded by family, they will bury their baby boy.
And they will suffer every single day for the rest of their life.
At the funeral for this two year boy who died in front of his parents, can you do me a favor? Can you walk up to the mother and say the words that you just typed out last week? Can you? Can you greet her, hug her, shake the father’s hand and then say, “ Who was watching that little boy? You should have known better. I would never let that happen to MY child.”
Can you do that for me? I mean, you felt those words so deeply in your heart and soul that you typed them for a million people to read. Certainly you can say it straight to the faces of the people you meant it for, right?
Here, let me help you
Put away your pitchfork for a moment and try this.

To the mother and father who went for a walk on vacation for the last time with their little boy yesterday, I am deeply sorry that you had to experience the worst kind of tragedy possible, an accident. I grieve with you. Your baby was my baby. Your son was my son. I have nothing but love for you, love to help you get though the pain yesterday, today, and for what is gonna seem like a thousand tomorrows. I wrap my thoughts and prayers around your aching heart and soul. May the God of this universe in some miraculous way bring peace to you and your family.

That is what you say. THAT. And just THAT.

Stop the blaming.

Stop the shaming.

In their darkest hours, can we please just LOVE other parents. Please?

Thank you for sharing this. It needs to be posted on every social media website. Being a parent is hard enough without having your most vulnerable moments second guessed, mocked, and ridiculed by anonymous people on the internet.

 

[GhostHost1000]

Now that the tragedy is resolved, it's now Thursday Morning quarterback time in the media. The focus is the signage. When they lead with "Did Disney do enough?", you don't need to see the story. The conclusion is already implied: No.

This morning on one of the news stations they were blaming Disney with the signage and even went as far as saying "many of you are also asking, why are alligators even allowed in that water" *major facepalm*

good grief people... it's Florida... that's like asking why are the waves allowed to crash on the ocean shore.

obviously thing will be changing around ALL WDW bodies of water due to this...but if I was bitten by the snake that ran a few feet in front of me on a sidewalk at SSR last week or stung by a bee in a park....I wouldn't be blaming Disney

 

[JohnD]

This morning on one of the news stations they were blaming Disney with the signage and even went as far as saying "many of you are also asking, why are alligators even allowed in that water" *major facepalm*

good grief people... it's Florida... that's like asking why are the waves allowed to crash on the ocean shore.

obviously thing will be changing around ALL WDW bodies of water due to this...but if I was bitten by the snake that ran a few feet in front of me on a sidewalk at SSR last week or stung by a bee in a park....I wouldn't be blaming Disney

You missed the thread about people being stung by wasps at Typhoon Lagoon and that led to a discussion of being stung by bees at the Pop Century pool. It's WDW's fault you see. Their magic was interrupted. You'd think that once you step on WDW property you're inside a dome where everything is controlled.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Again DisneyDreamer08- "Nothing like THIS has ever happened before" was said at the Press Conference if I understand you.

That doesn't mean that it hasn't happened before and differenty. Not fatally anyhow and to a toddler. So Disney is being technically truthful but wording it in a deceptive way for those not paying attention.

It clearly has happened before. You posted the link. I'm not being argumentative. It's the words used that you have to think about.

Thanks for your post.

Well, not since a guest was bit by a gator in 1986.

 

[Baltar]

Yesterday in one of the news conferences they mentioned this was the first gator attack on Disney property. I know its been mentioned else where in this thread. For what its worth, that is not the case. My local news reported this last night

http://www.fox25boston.com/news/nh-child-attacked-by-gator-at-disney-world-30-years-ago/345144911

It was the first fatality. That attack was known about prior. The media just didn't do their diligence in finding that story originally.

 

[Phicinfan]

It doesn't matter what COULD HAVE happened. The child was in the water! And you know tonight a family has lost THEIR CHILD! Stop and think sbout that. A two year old child is dead and is not coming bsck. That entire family will feel that their entire life. Not just parents, but friends, grandparents, siblings and more. come on people

Lets add one more level to this,
This was during the movie. This was NOT just this family on the beach, it was the movie for the GF. What about all the other families, and the small kids that were on that beach at THAT time? How do you face your little ones, and tell them.....hey lets go visit Mickey, and forget about the other kid your age just carried out by a Alligator. How do you do that? Who would ever think they would have to?

Please keep all these things in mind, as you sit there at your computer laying blame to Disney or the family....this was a tragedy. A life was lost. Lets all get a friggen grip please.

 

[NewfieFan]

I've read most of this thread and have found it interesting (liability issues and such). Obviously not including the heartbreaking reality this family is now facing.
But I'm really curious as to where the boy actually was. I've read multiple different accounts online and in news articles. Even on this thread there is a debate about where the boy was when the attack occurred. The latest seems to be an eye witness lifeguard who said he was 10 feet from shore into the water wading. That's a far cry from a foot from shore, not in the water at all, etc.
I think it's important to know where the boy actually was, not to place blame on the parents or this situation but to actually know what we're dealing with here. Are alligators coming onto shore to snatch toddlers away? Are they lurking at the shoreline? Would they touch a human close to shore? Maybe signs telling people not to touch the water will solve this and prevent further incidents!? Maybe we need fences!? I have no idea...?

 

[wsmith1978]

Lets add one more level to this,
This was during the movie. This was NOT just this family on the beach, it was the movie for the GF. What about all the other families, and the small kids that were on that beach at THAT time? How do you face your little ones, and tell them.....hey lets go visit Mickey, and forget about the other kid your age just carried out by a Alligator. How do you do that? Who would ever think they would have to?

Please keep all these things in mind, as you sit there at your computer laying blame to Disney or the family....this was a tragedy. A life was lost. Lets all get a friggen grip please.

Exactly. The impact of this sort of tragedy is just unimaginable, really. It's so easy for all of us to sit back, from a distance, and give our opinions and even our condolences, but honestly none of it matters. The lives of so many people were changed forever in that moment. Not just the kid's parents and sister, but their entire family, and every family that was on the beach with them, that may have witnessed that boy being pulled away. It's an unthinkable horror that no one involved will ever forget.