finger scan controversy?

[djronnieb]

Check this out from Local 6:
<!--StartFragment --> An upgrade on Disney's finger scanning technology implemented to prevent ticket fraud or resale is raising concerns from privacy advocates, according to Local 6 News.
<!--StartFragment --> For years, Walt Disney World has been reading the shape of visitors' fingers on its property. Now, the upgraded controversial finger scanning machines scan fingerprint information.<TABLE class=storyAd cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=storyAdObj>

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"Privacy advocates worry that Disney is getting too much of your personal information and their concern is where that information goes after it is scanned," Local 6 reporter Jessica D'Onofrio said.

Disney representatives said the technology does not store the entire fingerprint image and scanned information is purged in 30 days.

"We are not collecting fingerprints," Disney representative Kim Prunty said. "We are not collecting personal information. The sole purpose is to create a numerical value that links out guest with their Magic Your Way tickets.

"They're collecting fingerprints," Central Florida ACLU President George Crossley said. "They're taking fingerprints. They can call it whatever they want. They're taking fingerprints. Everything that chips away at personal rights, anything that chips away at the right to privacy, I'll always be concerned about."

"The system takes an image, it identifies points on that image and measures the distance between those points and immediately creates a numerical value on the blink of an eye," Prunty said. "And it's the numerical value that's stored in our system and recalled when a guest reenters our turn styles using their Magic Your Way tickets."

The Central Florida ACLU said they know Disney is not doing anything illegal but said people should know what they're submitting to before they enter the park.

"If Uncle Sam decides to hit Walt Disney with a subpoena because they want those records, what is Walt Disney going to do?" Crossley said. "They're going to provide the records right?"

A Disney representative said visitors who object to the finger scanners can use a photo ID instead. However, that option is not advertised at the theme parks.

The machine upgrades should be completed by the end of September, the report said.
http://www.local6.com/news/9774630/detail.html


hmmm intresting......

 

[clarkstallings]

No they aren't.

 

[Teenchy]

ACLU strikes again.......Hopefully that means that no one from the ACLU is going to visit WDW.

By the way the title of this thread should be different because in the news report it says that even the ACLU knows that Disney is NOT doing anything illegal.

 

[Hakunamatata]

Check this out from Local 6:
<!--StartFragment --> An upgrade on Disney's finger scanning technology implemented to prevent ticket fraud or resale is raising concerns from privacy advocates, according to Local 6 News.
<!--StartFragment --> For years, Walt Disney World has been reading the shape of visitors' fingers on its property. Now, the upgraded controversial finger scanning machines scan fingerprint information.<TABLE class=storyAd cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=storyAdObj>

​

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

"Privacy advocates worry that Disney is getting too much of your personal information and their concern is where that information goes after it is scanned," Local 6 reporter Jessica D'Onofrio said.

Disney representatives said the technology does not store the entire fingerprint image and scanned information is purged in 30 days.

"We are not collecting fingerprints," Disney representative Kim Prunty said. "We are not collecting personal information. The sole purpose is to create a numerical value that links out guest with their Magic Your Way tickets.

"They're collecting fingerprints," Central Florida ACLU President George Crossley said. "They're taking fingerprints. They can call it whatever they want. They're taking fingerprints. Everything that chips away at personal rights, anything that chips away at the right to privacy, I'll always be concerned about."

"The system takes an image, it identifies points on that image and measures the distance between those points and immediately creates a numerical value on the blink of an eye," Prunty said. "And it's the numerical value that's stored in our system and recalled when a guest reenters our turn styles using their Magic Your Way tickets."

The Central Florida ACLU said they know Disney is not doing anything illegal but said people should know what they're submitting to before they enter the park.

"If Uncle Sam decides to hit Walt Disney with a subpoena because they want those records, what is Walt Disney going to do?" Crossley said. "They're going to provide the records right?"

A Disney representative said visitors who object to the finger scanners can use a photo ID instead. However, that option is not advertised at the theme parks.

The machine upgrades should be completed by the end of September, the report said.
http://www.local6.com/news/9774630/detail.html


hmmm intresting......

Typical of the ACLU. They hollar and screem when its over nothing, but let someone try to do some real harm to someone, they are nowhere to be found. Bunch of do-nothings if you ask me.

 

[DisneyMusician2]

Oh no! Mickey Mouse MAY go out and have fun using MY FINGERPRINTS!!!!! And Uncle Sam having my personal information! GOD HELP US ALL!!!! I wouldn't even give the government my social security number....oh wait, they already have it. Actually, they gave it to me....

This is so ridiculous. Even if they were taking fingerprints, people need to relax a bit. There is another option, and they are technically violating no law.

 

[SteveUK]

Firstly, they are not breaking the law - that is even acknowledged by the article. Secondly, if you don't want to submit to these information collecting procedures - don't go. Nobody comes to your door and forces you to give information. If you don't want your information taken or used in this way then you have every right to choose not to walk through a Disney turnstile.

 

[kcnole]

This thread should be closed. Disney is doing nothing illegal. The ACLU is doing their normal complain about something that's not a big deal and defend those who are the scum of the earth routine. Even the ACLU admits that Disney is not breaking any laws.

So what if the Federal government supboenas Disney's records, they're going to get a database with a bunch of numeric values related to a customers name. Disney has stated that those numbers cannot be reversed to create a fingerprint, even if you know the algorithm used to create the number. Disney scans the fingerprint, compares a few select locations on the fingerprint measuring the distance, does some sort of proprietary formula to those measurements and then creates a number. The number is what is stored.

When you come back to the park, it reads that fingerprint information agains, runs the formulas and then compares the number to the number stored in the database. If they match you're let in, if they don't then they'll need picture ID or something like that. Disney is not storing your fingerprints and that data that they do have on record is of no use to the federal governmnet.

Disney has also stated that if you don't want to take the fingerprint scan you don't have to. You can go through a picture identification process. They just don't advertise this, but if a guest complains they have a process for it.

 

[unkadug]

This thread should be closed...

Why, because

• you don't want to read it or want others to read it
• you dont want others to be able to respond to it?

Just because you don't like the news doesn't mean that it should be censored.

 

[LudwigVonDrake]

Disney is not breaking the law. The title of this thread should be changed.

 

[Master Yoda]

This has been discussed in depth before...but here goes anyway. The scanners do not store enough information from the print scan to actually reproduce a finger print. The scanner scans key points on the print, runs those distances through an algorithm which generates a code that is put on your ticket. The idea of someone reversing that process and producing an actual finger print would be as probable am me giving you the letters "c,a,e,w" and you being able to accurately tell me what book I pulled them from. There simply is not enough information stored in the code.

The ACLU, not unlike many other activist groups, are their own worst enemy. They cry foul at every possible opportunity weather justified or not so no matter what they say they are ignored.

Maybe we should send them a copy of "The boy who cried wolf."

 

[NeedABreak]

Common tactic of the ACLU. They hate big business so if they arn't doing anything illegal the goons dig till they find something almost illegal and then mack a big fuss about it.

Do a little research and you'll find that they attack like this at least 3 times a year. Buncha nuts if you ask me.

 

[napnet]

The title for this is silly... Disney isn't breaking the law they are simply trying to save them self money.

 

[tigsmom]

Well, I feel this way...if you aren't guilty of anything you really have nothing to be worried about. *shrugs*

My fingerprints are on file with the state of NY, I'm sure they can do a lot more with them that Disney can with a finger scan.

 

[Eeyore]

Given the article, this topic is very difficult to keep from getting political. Please be careful. I'm going to leave it open for now to see where things go. But, it will be closed if necessary. :wave:

oh- and I changed the title to avoid confusion.

 

[mkt]

Disney = private company. As much as I typically side with the ACLU on many things.... MANY THINGS.... WAY TOO MANY THINGS... this has been blown out of proportion. With a private company, you get a choice... you DON'T have to buy their tickets and you don't have to go to their parks. It's a choice.

Now if this was the government taking a database of fingerprints.... yeah, I'd probably side with the ACLU.

 

[Unplugged]

Disney is not breaking the law. The title of this thread should be changed.

Agreed! Change the title, but keep it so all can voice (what appears to be unani-mouse) in that Disney is in the clear.

Typical ACLU #&*%s! They are so technology ignorant. :hammer:Who's running it, Dale Gribble? (King of the Hill reference)

The thing Disney should state for the record, to clarify to bone-heads like these ACLU nut jobs, is that Disney cannot re-create a biometric (fingerprint) from the numeric. They can recalc the number for ID as needed when a guest provides the finger, but in no way can the finger print be backward generated from the numeric.

This is such a waste of society's time......DOWN WITH THE ACLU!

 

[reptar77]

Oh please!!!!!!!!!!

 

[head mouse]

"If Uncle Sam decides to hit Walt Disney with a subpoena because they want those records, what is Walt Disney going to do?" Crossley said. "They're going to provide the records right?"

WRONG. Disney (in a way) has its own little government. There have ben MANY counts where "Uncle Sam" has TRIED to subpoena information from Disney and was denied.

ie: when there was a guest hurt on Disney property, the guest tried to sue Disney. Their [the guest] lawyer tried to get a subpoena for the incident repot and was denied being told that ANY information gathered by the Disney Company was private and they can not be forced in any way to release that information for any reason.

 

[mousermerf]

That's kinda true - since when has Disney ever copoporated with any enitity other than Disney if it wasn't lookin out for the best interest of Disney?

 

[CoffeeJedi]

From Cory Doctorow (a huge Disney fan), I tend to agree with him:

"Disney is now fingerprinting visitors to Walt Disney World as part of its ticket-fraud prevention scheme. They're not being very transparent about it, either: there are no signs posted about the data collection or retention, and Disney's official line is that they're not collecting fingerprints, just mathematical representations of same.

But those mathematical representations are exactly what you need if you want to join up two fingerprint databases, like Disney's and the NSA's -- while the NSA may store photos of fingerprints, they work with hashes of them, using those mathematical representations to compare and sort prints. Saying that you only store the mathematical representations of a fingerprint is like saying that you only store the mathematical representations of a JPEG, not the actual paint, canvas and frame that it depicts. It's true, but it sure doesn't mean that you haven't captured something important.

Now that our national immune system has begun to attack us in a terrible anaphylactic spasm -- indiscriminate NSA wiretaps, meaningless TSA security theater, secret aviation rules and no-fly lists, "free speech zones," suspension of habeas corpus and all the rest -- it's absolutely irresponsible to gather this kind of information and leave it where the savage toddlers of the national security apparat might find it and wreak havoc with it.

For me, the worst part of this is that it conditions us to get used to being treated like crooks. If you were asked for a fingerprint when you bought a doughnut, you'd rightly leave the store. Why should an amusement park get a walk?"

http://www.boingboing.net/2006/09/01/walt_disney_world_fi.html

And could everyone please stop bagging on the ACLU, while you may not agree with them on all their policies, you have to remember that they're fighting for the rights of all Americans, regardless of whether they agree with them or not, and if they budged a tiny bit on a single issue, it would compromise their entire mission.