Does anyone else think DVC ruins the spirit?

[lamarvenoy]

I know alot of members here belong to the DVC and a few years ago I ALMOST joined in. However, as time passes I am getting more and more anti-dvc. The members all seem to be happy but you can't really go by that because even if they felt a bit slighted they wouldn't want to make themselves feel any worse about blowing 10K. I sat through a high pressure pitch back in '00 and I seriously considered it-weighed out the points to dollars to night per room and it seemed like a great deal, then something funny happened.I was looking for a room for an unplanned Easter weekend trip and teh only thing available was a DVC room at the Wilderness Lodge. I was so MISERABLY DISAPPOINTED with the room I changed my mind that weekend and have never looked back.I stayed in the very last room in that building on the 2nd floor. Look at that room on your map and you can see it is a physically small room and the walk out to the car was ridiculous. what I hated most was the "little things" that a deluxe resort has that their programs lack....just like any time share I've ever seen. I missed a real front desk and housekeeping without asking or paying extra. I missed the hotel feeling period. Most people who know me on this board know that I stay on property....alot. In 04 a total of 17 nights and 03 I believe it was 26, and I just couldn't live without those little things-I'd rather stay at POP then WLDVC any day. Sure you can stay in regular hotels and use your points that way but suddenly the deal isn't nearly as sweet.

What bothers me most is the wasted space, money, and manpower in the parks and around Disney property promoting this program.I feel it really cheapens Disney and the whole Disney experience. Time shares have a stigma, a bad odor, an overall bad feeling about them and it bothers me Disney is pushing them so hard. Of course DVC is a seperate entity then Disney and doesn't fall under the same guidlines. Its seperation from the Disney company could come in very handy in the case of something like a membership decline leading to a bankruptcy.However unlikely it is true.I don't want to make members mad and turn this into a "I'm glad I'm DVC" thread-some people are happy I just wanted to relay my feelings about the DVC from MY OWN experience and data-an outsider ,not someone who paid 10K already.

 

[PhilosophyMagic]

Talking of them pushing DVC so hard, I just ordered the video on DL Paris, and I got a DVC video! That's Disney today. It's not Walt. The problem is that one of the main attributes of Disney vacations, that made them so popular, is those special touches that originated from Walt's time, etc. Still, we can rely on the fact that they're not going to get so bad that they lose very substantial numbers of mainstream customers, so we should relax and enjoy it! Let's just have fun!

Let us guests keep the spirit alive!!!

 

[dvcnut39]

Lamarvenoy, the last thing that I would want to do is force-feed my thoughts on the DVC to nonmembers. If you give me a moment, I'll just share a few of my thoughts. I understand that the initial investment is high and the thoughts of having annual dues, every month, for 40-50 years is frightening, but we (my family and other members who have done the math, really done the math) feel that the DVC is for us. I could go on and on, but I'll make it very brief, I really don't feel that I have to defend the DVC to anyone, but I'll give you one example. This July, we used our points (29pts/night x 5 nights= 145pts) to stay five nights, in a two bedroom, at Disney's Vero Beach. This two bedroom retails that same time a year for $390/nt x 5 nights= $1950. I understand that there are discount codes, but bare with me. I then took my initial investment and added all future add-on investments that we plan on making + all future dues + all future dues on my future add-ons. The only thing that I did not account for is the future inflation on the dues. If you look at the history of inflation in regards to DVC dues, you'll see that they are quite reasonable. The way I see it after using my formula, the five nights in Vero cost us $1810 (total- all investments + all dues) compared to the retail value of $1950. As we all know, the value of the DVC isn't even supposed to take place until year seven. I am only in my third year of ownership. I understand that the points will eventually lose value outside the now seven DVC Resorts. But within those the seven DVC Resorts, we will only gain value by leap and bounds as the years go by.

Another thing that helps balance out the future inflation on the dues is the list of Member Perks, which only get longer, and the tax write-off for our "deeded" property. As I stated earlier, I could go on and on, but I just thought necessary to share my one example.

 

[AEfx]

Although I won't speak to the value of the DVC properties (like anything, it works for some people, doesn't for others), I will say I do find the ubiquitous booths selling the time-shares at all four parks to be distasteful. I kind of felt bad for the CM's there, because when questioned and they have to admit it's an ad for a time share most people just walk away.

AEfx

 

[PhilosophyMagic]

Now my post looks really stupid.

 

[Woody13]

The way I see it after using my formula....

Your formula left out the cost of capital (5% to be very conservative) to buy the membership and you did not factor in the depreciation (flat line 1/40 per year if you have a 40 year membership). The DVC right of first refusal (ROFR) does not last forever. With those factors included, you'd pay less to rent.

 

[speck76]

That's Disney today. It's not Walt.

1. How would we know.....Interval Ownership did not really exist in Walt's day?

2. Walt was all about merchandising and making money. He did not really have the TV show to "be all nice and whatnot" to kids and families....he did it to promote his product and later to promote Disneyland.

 

[raland2002]

I have spent many months reading a numerous amount of interesting information and perspectives on this site. I am not one too choose sides but this topic made me feel obligated to make a point. As I read everyone's feedback, I know the points and perspectives from which everyone is coming from are true. Each of us have our own sets of values and whats important to us. For me and my wife, becoming DVC members was a truly tough decision. We have a family of eight and none of my children have ever experienced Disney. The reason being the cost of it - its not cheap. My wife to this day still feels uncertain on our decision to purchase a membership on what we consider a tight income. For us though, when you do some of the simple math, it works out. Our initial investment pays for itself after approximately three one week visits. My wife and I always wanted the absolutle best for our kids, therefore we did not wanted to always feel we had to coupon cut to make a Disney vacation work. We wanted the kids to experience some of the finer things, stay on property, stay at a deluxe resort vs. a value resort, those types of things as they do not experience on a day to day routine at home in the reality of life.


Sure one can argue about depreciation or inflation or whatever but we can do that in every single purchase we all make. The simple fact is this works for some of us and not for everyone. Hey, it may not work out for us as our first visit is this May. Who know if we can afford to visit every other year as planned but the fact that I know I won't have a looming 5K bill for hotel rooms at the end of our trip makes me rest a bit easier.

 

[DisneyPhD]

lamarvenoy, I am sorry that is they way you feel, but I really disagree with you.

For us as DVC members there is not less magic or convenice of the deluxe resorts. You have a front desk. The very same one that other resort quests use. Expect every time you go the CM tells you "Welcome Home". Every other amentity of the resort is yours to use, expect often are free (such as spa or health club, free valett parking etc...) You have your choice of every WDW resort out there on your points, but it is only more economial to stay at the DVC ones. And really we only want to stay at DCV ones since they are some much more comfortable. DVC rooms, even the studios are much better then a normal Deluxe resort room. One and two bedroms, not to mention grand villas are WAY better.


We get special member events (you do have to pay for them, you don't have to go to them if you don't want t.) Speical member websites, news puplications, speical discounts, toll free member services number for reservations (and PS).

The only thing we don't get is regluar mouse keeping in our rooms daily. We can we just have to pay more for it. (you pay for it as a normal resort guest too.) That is the only one way DVC has any different then normal guests. For me fresh towels aren't that important. :lookaroun I don't really like having maids in my room to start with. When you check in if there is a better room avilible then what you book they most likely will not give you a free upgrade. Only differnces I can see so far. Sure I miss the towel animials, but not that much.

So instead I get to feel like part of the magic all the time. My kids get to go to their "home" at Disney every year with a locked in mostly prepaid rate that we can aford. I don't see a down side at all. If anything I think we are treated better then average WDW resort guests.

I think even members are a little anoid with all the DVC keyasks that are popping up. But really the only people that I find that really don't like DVC are ones who really don't understand it, so this is a way to get the word out their. At 1st it doesn't make sense, then as you understand it better it does. DVC is selling really well after all, the more they get the word out there, the better it does and with the very large SSR open for sale, that is what they are doing.


After all "Member's are Magical"

 

[BeachClubVillas]

I think even members are a little anoid with all the DVC keyasks that are popping up. But really the only people that I find that really don't like DVC are ones who really don't understand it, so this is a way to get the word out their. At 1st it doesn't make sense, then as you understand it better it does. DVC is selling really well after all, the more they get the word out there, the better it does and with the very large SSR open for sale, that is what they are doing.


After all "Member's are Magical"

Well said! Even this member is getting sick of seeing those kiosks all over the place.

 

[Gail Hayden]

Well said, PHD.
I don't mind the kiosks, in fact, I hardly notice them anymore.

 

[DisneyPhD]

Thanks Gail and BCV, I know you guys are thrilled DVC members too.


raland2002, I hope that DVC turns out as good for your family as ours. With a family that big the DVC rooms will be perfect for you and allow you to have a quailty of vaction you couldn't with out it. I understand "what did I just buy" feeling, we had the same thing for about 40 seconds. We haven't regreted it or looked back at this point.

lamarvenoy, I have re-read your 1st post and I am not sure I understand. What is it you miss that staying at a "regular WDW resort" gives you? Exepct for daily mousekeeping there is nothing else DVC doesn't get. Could you elaberate?

As for WVL, last room studio out. We have been there (expect 3rd or 4th floor, facing the wood or lake view.) That room isn't the best, and it is a long walk to the end of the hall. I have always vowed that my kids will not run up and down hotel coridoors, even I wanted to sprint down it. It might be because that hallway is as long as a football field and no turns. They got it right out of the haunted mantion. Hubby says he looked out one night and saw a candleabra floating in the hall. :lol:

Staying in that room or a studio at OKW are not really indicative of the whole DVC experince. You can get a bad room at any resort on WDW prop. In my opinon VWL does not have the best lay out and I perfere BCV. Some people LOVE VWL and not so fond of BVC for other reasons. Personally my stay at OKW wasn't the best, but ask Gail she has stayed there many times and it was GREAT for her family. If you want to be close to your car, you might want to stay at OKW (or even SSR and BCV aren't bad for that.) Differet people different needs. That is why DVC has different resorts and rooms.

Oh and while the DVC kiosks are rather rabbit like in multipying, it is how we learned about DVC. So I guess I can't be too bothered by them. The space is not that big or wasited and the man power are DVC empolyees not WDW cast members.

 

[llrain]

My anti dvc grudge goes like this.
1. I cant buy a silver add on,or gold,or anything....All i get is a room
2. Mousekeeping every 4 days????? I paid how much for this and i cant get
mousekeeping everyday unless i pay extra....AND when they do come THEY DO NOTHING they give u towels and soap...thats it....
with non dvc room I get mousekeeping every day and they make my bed...
3. ooohoohhhh I get 10% off at restaurants.....big deal
4. Because I cant get a silver,romance,gold add on i know have to save a million dollars on top of my monthly mortgage with them, for food unless i want to cook.....but who wants to cook at disney?
5. Passes dont even come with my DVC membership....So i have to save up for that too prior to my trip....

So what exactly does DVC give me.......pretty much a room...Oh and i have to wait 6 months to book that unless i decide to stay at my home resort..
now hows that for a deal

My girlfiends parents are members, of which our most recent trip was a
WL villas, we borrowed points from them cause we were thinking of joining ourselves....so we tested it out
.But not anymore....Its too much of a headache budgetting dinner,bfast lunch, buying passes, etc....that we would rather get the silver plan and have that all taken care of for us.....man what a headache it was...

and this make ur own magic passes thing....Im willing to bet that DVC members cant partake in it using their membership


~~~~~~~~~~Glad we didnt join~~~~~~

 

[DisneyPhD]

My anti dvc grudge goes like this.
1. I cant buy a silver add on,or gold,or anything....All i get is a room
2. Mousekeeping every 4 days????? I paid how much for this and i cant get
mousekeeping everyday unless i pay extra....AND when they do come THEY DO NOTHING they give u towels and soap...thats it....
with non dvc room I get mousekeeping every day and they make my bed...
3. ooohoohhhh I get 10% off at restaurants.....big deal
4. Because I cant get a silver,romance,gold add on i know have to save a million dollars on top of my monthly mortgage with them, for food unless i want to cook.....but who wants to cook at disney?
5. Passes dont even come with my DVC membership....So i have to save up for that too prior to my trip....

So what exactly does DVC give me.......pretty much a room...Oh and i have to wait 6 months to book that unless i decide to stay at my home resort..
now hows that for a deal

My girlfiends parents are members, of which our most recent trip was a
WL villas, we borrowed points from them cause we were thinking of joining ourselves....so we tested it out
.But not anymore....Its too much of a headache budgetting dinner,bfast lunch, buying passes, etc....that we would rather get the silver plan and have that all taken care of for us.....man what a headache it was...

and this make ur own magic passes thing....Im willing to bet that DVC members cant partake in it using their membership


~~~~~~~~~~Glad we didnt join~~~~~~

1) not sure if this is true or not. However add on packages are hardely ever a deal, but they are convenent. I would never do them anyway. You do, that is fine.
2) What you pay is less then a normal room with mousekeeping. If you want it you can pay for it. You can get full housekeeping daily if you want. It is 25 a day. towels just 10. Both a waste of money, but I think it is a waste of money in normal resort rooms. A made bed means more to you then me I guess.
3) perks are just that. They tell you don't get it just for the perks, just like AP.
4) We don't cook at Disney, but having the kicthen allows us to eat snack and lunch or breakfast food in our room, saves ton just on cold bottled water. Really good when you have young kids.
5) DVC did come with pases at OKW at 1st. Then we got 10% off UPH (lengh of stay passes) I never get them, I feel the are a waste of money. Now they are offereing a $100 of AP for up to 8 family members per contract. This is a HUGE saving. Even better then FLA resident savings. (Fla residents get an addtional small amount off the DVC rate.)


There would be no reason DVC couldnt' do magic your way. That is just nuts.

Thanks for listing why DVC isn't for you. To each his own.

 

[llrain]

so why did they get rid of passes then...it would seem more enticing if they
gave things that meant something....
o well......

Im not trying to down dvc .......just one who didnt like it ...thats all..>
although staying in a villa was nice

 

[DisneyPhD]

Gail would know more I think, I belive she owned at OKW back then. However I belive it was an instetive for people to join. DVC was new back then and it was a way to get people to join. However DVC became so popular that it wasn't really needed. (Don't get me wrong, I really wish they still gave them!) But the didn't and we joined anyway and it is still worth it to me. The new discount on AP is great, but DVC is good for us with out it. Members have been asking for that for a while and it is good to know they listen to us.

Some people down DVC because all it pays for it the room, but you would have to pay for all the other stuff anyway. Between DVC, good deals on airfare, the discount on AP and Disney Visa rewards, we are doing 2 trips to WDW and Vero Beach in 2005 that will be extremly economical! :sohappy:

With out DVC there is no way we would be able to go as often or as long (or stay at Deluxe resorts every time.)

If you are or arent a DVC person really does come down to the way you look and and plan things. I do know most people who do end up joining really wish they had sooner (myself encluded.)

Oh and it is 7 months out for non home resorts, 11 for your home. I don't mind that at all.

 

[goofyman]

It's funny how this subject gets such attention! We are DVC members and love it! it pays for us not only for Disney trips but it trade the highest of all timeshares. and as for pressure sales, I have to TOTAlLY disagree here. try sitting at a marriott timeshare thats preasure and any other one for that fact. One of the reason we chose DVC was becasue there was NO preasure!. Anyway, everyone has there opinion. I agree with Disney phd also. And we own at WL and I am not sure what you were missing there. It has everything you said it doesn't? it is so warm and cozy And EVERY hotel has a bad room. I know cause I always get them ..LOL Happy holidays!! :xmas:

 

[Pixie Duster]

I love Walt, to no end. He was a business man. He knew what he was doing and he knew how to sell things, but not too obvious about it. Which is a bit lacking in businesses, including Disney, now a days.
As Brad mentioned the point of Disneyland on TV was purely to promote Disneyland, same with Wonderful World of Color / Disney. Sure it certainly wasn't he's only goal in life, he was a very creative man, a genius, but part of what made him smart was his ability to make a product that was very profitable.
DVC is not a dirty, dirty timeshare. Yes it is a timeshare, but it is lightyears above the common timeshare. And it is the DVC members that will help ensure WDW will be around years from now for the rest of us to enjoy.

 

[Gail Hayden]

so why did they get rid of passes then...it would seem more enticing if they
gave things that meant something....
o well......

Im not trying to down dvc .......just one who didnt like it ...thats all..>
although staying in a villa was nice

The passes were an incentive when they first opened. They discontinued the passes in 95. Not a bad incentive. We joined in 92 and had free passes until 12/31/99.
Most people join without any incentive, just the "being part of the magic" is enough for them.
DVC is advertised as your home away from home. I don't have a problem with not having housekeeping daily, in fact, I rather enjoy not having it. It takes me NO time to make the bed and tidy up. I tidy up in any place I stay, so, to me it is no different.
The rate for daily housekeeping varies with the size of the unit.
I like to cook, so, that is not an issue either. I don't cook every meal, but, we do save a ton of money on food.
I don't think the add on packages are all that great. But, if you like them, go for it.
I am sorry that DVC is not for you, but to compare it with other timeshares is like comparing apples to oranges. And, it has one of the lowest key sales presentations out there, and heck, they even feed you.

 

[Gail Hayden]

DVC is not a dirty, dirty timeshare. Yes it is a timeshare, but it is lightyears above the common timeshare. And it is the DVC members that will help ensure WDW will be around years from now for the rest of us to enjoy.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

ITA.