Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[danlb_2000]

I was definitly worried about my state, NJ, a month or so ago, but things have really turned around, 80% decline in cases over the past 14 days, currently the biggest percentage decline of any state by a wide margin.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html

 

[GoofGoof]

I was definitly worried about my state, NJ, a month or so ago, but things have really turned around, 80% decline in cases over the past 14 days, currently the biggest percentage decline of any state by a wide margin.

View attachment 557736

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html

My local area in PA has seen over a 50% drop in the 14 day daily average in the past 2 weeks. Really steep drop off. It seems like once the vaccine rate hits a certain point the decline is fast, even with a lot of the variant driven cases around.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

This could help the kids that want one but parents are anti-vax? Only thing I can read into it.

In New PA Bill, Kids Could Get Vaccine Without Parental Approval

A bill about to be introduced in the state Senate would let some minors be legally able to receive vaccinations without parental consent.

patch.com

 

[Thelazer]

My local area in PA has seen over a 50% drop in the 14 day daily average in the past 2 weeks. Really steep drop off. It seems like once the vaccine rate hits a certain point the decline is fast, even with a lot of the variant driven cases around.

FWIW, Heard Immunity is a lot lower than you've been lead to believe. I won't bother to quote or back this up, you can google yourself and go down the rabbit hole...

 

[Chi84]

You are totally missing my point. I’m not challenging the change in any way. I just think giving more than 12 hours notice would have been nice for guests already on site. Whether the guest thinks the change is positive or negative isn’t the point.

How much more than 12 hours, though? One or two days? Enough notice to cancel a flight? Once the decision is made, I don't see anything "nice" about waiting to implement it. I don't think I'm missing the point, but I doubt we'll agree. I feel very strongly that mitigation measures should be based solely on safety and should end the minute they are no longer needed. Apparently, so does Disney.

We just returned from WDW, and if I could have escaped wearing masks outside in that heat for even a day or two, I would have been enormously grateful. Requiring masks outdoors after the decision was made to discontinue them - based only on the possibility that another guest might have liked more notice - makes no sense to me. In any event, I don't think Disney even entertained that possibility.

 

[mmascari]

There are many people in that category still. In a lot of places we are not 6 weeks beyond when vaccines opened to the general public so many people who waited their turn aren’t done yet. Many are getting close.

I was joking. I don’t believe that was all the people and the rest were Fully Vaccinated. Some, sure, but not an even split.

Yep, I am in that category, still a week and a half to go, although I cheated today and hugged someone.

If they were vaccinated, not even cheating. I’m sure we can let it slide even if they were not. Hope it was a big hug, with a second one too.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

You are totally missing my point. I’m not challenging the change in any way. I just think giving more than 12 hours notice would have been nice for guests already on site. Whether the guest thinks the change is positive or negative isn’t the point.

Agree 100%. Disney gives plenty of heads up for many things.. changes to when you can reserve things.. dining changes.. magical express..etc. they have always given notice of anything coming down the road. Forgetting whether it’s safe or guidelines or whatever, they usually think about their guests first with this I believe implemented way to quickly for people that are already at WDW expecting differently.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

It's interesting that people who have been arguing constantly that people like Dr. Fauci are wrong, that the science has been wrong or inconsistent, are tripping over themselves to take new CDC guidelines as the gospel truth.

I'm not in either camp, except I think both Dr. Fauci and the CDC could have more consistent/clear in their messaging all along, including now.

Two weeks ago, the CDC director was on the air talking about the dangers of the new variants, and how we all needed to keep wearing masks. To me, it sounded too much like Chicken Little. The most recent announcement feels inconsistent.

In my view, public messaging needs to be clear, relatively simple, but ALSO- and this is the key part- the public needs to know the objective. Why is the public being asked to do something?

In my view, a better approach would have been to set a clear goal and clear benchmarks, and how close we were getting to those benchmarks. A better message, in my view, would have been two part. this is just a sample of the type of message they could have said, not actual specific numbers:

We will be able to begin relax the mask mandate - be degrees- when we reach two critical benchmarks:
A. 65% of the population is vaccinated (or some other number)
AND
B. We see national case numbers drop below 10 per 100,000 population. (or some other number).

Please do your part to help us get to these benchmarks, because we are in this together. We are all on the same team.

C. It also feels weird to me that this was relaxed less than a week after 12-15 year olds became eligible to be vaccinated. Relaxing the mask mandate sends a message that 12-15 year olds - as people- do not matter. To me, it would have been better to give that age group a minimum of 2 weeks to get shot #1/partial vaccination.

I think the message would have been all around much stronger if the CDC's message had been more inclusive. It was a missed opportunity, because the message could have been done in such a way that it would have encouraged 12-15 year old to be part of the solution! The message could have been something like WHEN we get 50% of teens vaccinated, then we'll reach our goal of having 65% of the population vaccinated. We are SO close! Help us reach our goal!

And just....well..12-15 years olds are VERY effective at persuaders. Every vaccinated teen has the ability to talk their parents into getting vaccinated. Eager to-be-vaccinated year-olds vs. scared-of-a-little-needle adults.

We could have had a positive message out of this as a way to incentivize reluctant adults.

 

[Chi84]

Agree 100%. Disney gives plenty of heads up for many things.. changes to when you can reserve things.. dining changes.. magical express..etc. they have always given notice of anything coming down the road. Forgetting whether it’s safe or guidelines or whatever, they usually think about their guests first with this I believe implemented way to quickly for people that are already at WDW expecting differently.

I swear, sometimes I think I visit a different WDW than the people who post here. A little over a week ago, people were struggling with masks in the sun with heat indexes in excess of 100 degrees. They would have been thrilled with a CM knocking on their door at 3 am to tell them they could discontinue outdoor mask-wearing.

Notice is usually given for a purpose - to allow people to make changes. With the kind of advance planning WDW requires, it's difficult to know what purpose would be served by notice of a change in health protocols (which, by the way, most reasonable people would probably anticipate anyway). Notice of a few days wouldn't accomplish anything because it would be too late to make changes, and long-term deferral of a change in protocols would unduly burden guests and was never going to happen.

 

[GoofGoof]

How much more than 12 hours, though? One or two days? Enough notice to cancel a flight? Once the decision is made, I don't see anything "nice" about waiting to implement it. I don't think I'm missing the point, but I doubt we'll agree. I feel very strongly that mitigation measures should be based solely on safety and should end the minute they are no longer needed. Apparently, so does Disney.

We just returned from WDW, and if I could have escaped wearing masks outside in that heat for even a day or two, I would have been enormously grateful. Requiring masks outdoors after the decision was made to discontinue them - based only on the possibility that another guest might have liked more notice - makes no sense to me. In any event, I don't think Disney even entertained that possibility.

I would say at least 24 hours to allow guests and CMs to absorb the change.

Disney has not operated that way since the start of Covid. When Disney closed WDW March 2020 they gave 3 days notice the park was closing. They gave over a week notice on changes to temp screenings recently, they announced reducing physical distancing from 6 feet to 3 feet and said it would be implemented over the next few weeks. Not much has been. done Immediately.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I

I swear, sometimes I think I visit a different WDW than the people who post here. A little over a week ago, people were struggling with masks in the sun with heat indexes in excess of 100 degrees. They would have been thrilled with a CM knocking on their door at 3 am to tell them they could discontinue outdoor mask-wearing.

Notice is usually given for a purpose - to allow people to make changes. With the kind of advance planning WDW requires, it's difficult to know what purpose would be served by notice of a change in health protocols (which, by the way, most reasonable people would probably anticipate anyway). Notice of a few days wouldn't accomplish anything because it would be too late to make changes, and long-term deferral of a change in protocols would unduly burden guests and was never going to happen.

You once again are missing the point. I think I was down at Disney while you were at some point. I was struggling with masks as I’m sure thousands of others were. BUT, and this is what your not getting.. there are others.. thousands actually that planned and paid for their vacation based on mitigation’s put in place by Disney that they felt comfortable with. Idols why they planned their vacation. They wanted something different for their family and they had the rug polluted out from underneath them. Sometimes it’s not just about you.
You are correct in saying “notice is usually given for a purpose “. What better purpose would there be to have their guests experience what they paid for? I sometimes just don’t get people who just don’t see other peoples point of view.
In saying all that, it was brutal with the masks, BUT I knew it when I booked. I wasn’t blindsided .

 

[GoofGoof]

I

I swear, sometimes I think I visit a different WDW than the people who post here. A little over a week ago, people were struggling with masks in the sun with heat indexes in excess of 100 degrees. They would have been thrilled with a CM knocking on their door at 3 am to tell them they could discontinue outdoor mask-wearing.

Notice is usually given for a purpose - to allow people to make changes. With the kind of advance planning WDW requires, it's difficult to know what purpose would be served by notice of a change in health protocols (which, by the way, most reasonable people would probably anticipate anyway). Notice of a few days wouldn't accomplish anything because it would be too late to make changes, and long-term deferral of a change in protocols would unduly burden guests and was never going to happen.

I can say from direct experience because this literally happened to my family with Hershey Park on Friday. It didn’t change our plans or make us cancel, but we had all the plans set and assumed the mask requirements and distancing. They also changed the rules overnight but not details were given. It lead to a lot of confusion and misinformation being shared. Ultimately it didn’t change the level of enjoyment for the trip but it would have saved some running around trying to figure out what was required.

At Disney there seemed to be more organization with the announcement with actual details so I give them credit there. The timing was off but maybe they worried about too many complaints yesterday if they delayed it a day.

 

[Chi84]

You once again are missing the point. I think I was down at Disney while you were at some point. I was struggling with masks as I’m sure thousands of others were. BUT, and this is what your not getting.. there are others.. thousands actually that planned and paid for their vacation based on mitigation’s put in place by Disney that they felt comfortable with. Idols why they planned their vacation. They wanted something different for their family and they had the rug polluted out from underneath them. Sometimes it’s not just about you.
You are correct in saying “notice is usually given for a purpose “. What better purpose would there be to have their guests experience what they paid for? I sometimes just don’t get people who just don’t see other peoples point of view.
In saying all that, it was brutal with the masks, BUT I knew it when I booked. I wasn’t blindsided .

I'll admit I don't understand parts of your post, but it seems you are arguing that WDW should keep outdated health protocols in place because some people may have depended on them when they booked their vacation. Disney decided not to do that; no one seems to be doing that. And I think Disney is very aware of what their guests expect.

 

[GoofGoof]

I'll admit I don't understand parts of your post, but it seems you are arguing that WDW should keep outdated health protocols in place because some people may have depended on them when they booked their vacation. Disney decided not to do that; no one seems to be doing that. And I think Disney is very aware of what their guests expect.

I can’t speak for him, but I am not saying that. I’m saying keep the protocol in place an extra day to allow people time to absorb it. They can make up their mind what to do (if anything) after that.

 

[Jrb1979]

I'm not in either camp, except I think both Dr. Fauci and the CDC could have more consistent/clear in their messaging all along, including now.

Two weeks ago, the CDC director was on the air talking about the dangers of the new variants, and how we all needed to keep wearing masks. To me, it sounded too much like Chicken Little. The most recent announcement feels inconsistent.

In my view, public messaging needs to be clear, relatively simple, but ALSO- and this is the key part- the public needs to know the objective. Why is the public being asked to do something?

In my view, a better approach would have been to set a clear goal and clear benchmarks, and how close we were getting to those benchmarks. A better message, in my view, would have been two part. this is just a sample of the type of message they could have said, not actual specific numbers:

We will be able to begin relax the mask mandate - be degrees- when we reach two critical benchmarks:
A. 65% of the population is vaccinated (or some other number)
AND
B. We see national case numbers drop below 10 per 100,000 population. (or some other number).

Please do your part to help us get to these benchmarks, because we are in this together. We are all on the same team.

C. It also feels weird to me that this was relaxed less than a week after 12-15 year olds became eligible to be vaccinated. Relaxing the mask mandate sends a message that 12-15 year olds - as people- do not matter. To me, it would have been better to give that age group a minimum of 2 weeks to get shot #1/partial vaccination.

I think the message would have been all around much stronger if the CDC's message had been more inclusive. It was a missed opportunity, because the message could have been done in such a way that it would have encouraged 12-15 year old to be part of the solution! The message could have been something like WHEN we get 50% of teens vaccinated, then we'll reach our goal of having 65% of the population vaccinated. We are SO close! Help us reach our goal!

And just....well..12-15 years olds are VERY effective at persuaders. Every vaccinated teen has the ability to talk their parents into getting vaccinated. Eager to-be-vaccinated year-olds vs. scared-of-a-little-needle adults.

We could have had a positive message out of this as a way to incentivize reluctant adults.

I agree completely. It's what I have been saying. Unfortunately many in here say that since it will take til fall to reach goals, good enough is good enough.

 

[Chi84]

I can say from direct experience because this literally happened to my family with Hershey Park on Friday. It didn’t change our plans or make us cancel, but we had all the plans set and assumed the mask requirements and distancing. They also changed the rules overnight but not details were given. It lead to a lot of confusion and misinformation being shared. Ultimately it didn’t change the level of enjoyment for the trip but it would have saved some running around trying to figure out what was required.

At Disney there seemed to be more organization with the announcement with actual details so I give them credit there. The timing was off but maybe they worried about too many complaints yesterday if they delayed it a day.

There seemed to be a snowball effect with other theme parks and I don't think WDW wanted to be left out there hanging. I'm not sure what good one day of notice would have been to anyone, but I can respect your opinion that it may have made a difference to some.

 

[DisneyFan32]

@GoofGoof what did Dr. Fauci told that some people have to wear masks on seasonal season like fall/winter this year. Will I will not wear mask ever again after the pandemic is over?

 

[GoofGoof]

There seemed to be a snowball effect with other theme parks and I don't think WDW wanted to be left out there hanging. I'm not sure what good one day of notice would have been to anyone, but I can respect your opinion that it may have made a difference to some.

I don’t disagree that the change was coming either way for Disney parks. It’s a good thing and definitely a big step towards the end of this pandemic. I applaud Disney for not dragging their feet on the actual decision.

 

[GoofGoof]

@GoofGoof what did Dr. Fauci told that some people have to wear masks on seasonal season like fall/winter this year. Will I will not wear mask ever again after the pandemic is over?

Only on Halloween

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I can’t speak for him, but I am not saying that. I’m saying keep the protocol in place an extra day to allow people time to absorb it. They can make up their mind what to do (if anything) after that.

I would go just a bit further and say as of June 1st all these new things would start. Is 2 weeks really that much? I mean it’s disney not 6 flags. We hold them to a bit of a higher standard with things. Is 2 weeks crazy? Give people on vacation to not have to worry about things while they are at the park.. gives others with vacations coming up some time to see if they still want to go.. and on the other hand, gives families who don’t want to wear masks get on the phone and start booking. Win-win all around.