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Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion (Now with optimism!)

mmascari

Well-Known Member
And yes, the race isn't over. There can still be spikes, but by and large, there is enough vaccinated population that the virus is going to struggle to get a foothold in the U.S. and we've seen that play out in the states that have opened. This is not herd immunity, where the virus dies off because it just can't find a host to jump to. Herd immunity in a global world may be impossible or decades away.
Regionally, between area's with some restrictions on travel between them, herd immunity can happen at different rates.

That's driver behind vaccination records when crossing those borders, anytime someone moves from an area of larger spread to less.

So, between NY and NJ, or even NY and OK, there will be no difference. Both will trend to the same result over time. But, between the US and some other country, they can be at different levels. Nobody in the US get's a TB vaccine, yet TB spread isn't rampant in the US. Conversely, TB spread is rampant in some countries. Travelers from those countries to the US are required to mitigate, so they don't bring it here. Likewise, travelers from the US have to mitigate if they go and are returning. TB is easier to contact trace and spot fast enough, so it's easier to contain after the fact than COVID will be, even in an unvaccinated population.

We don't need global all on the same schedule. Different areas will get there faster. Presumably wealthier countries will get there first, just like everything else.
 

havoc315

Well-Known Member
Personal opinion, especially having no experience with Israel personally. The biggest difference in a sea of perceived differences is Israel’s mandatory service to the country. It causes a deep-seeded sense of teamwork to be a part of something like military service. In no way does it cause people to think in lock-step, but it does foster a sense of “greater good.”

You do indeed know very little of Israel, which is even more polarized than the United States. They haven't even been able to get it together to form a government in the last 2 years. Between the radical right settlers, the religious zealots, the secular centrists, the Israeli Arabs, you think they are more unified than the United States?

They hit 60% vaccination. You really think we can't ever do the same in this country??

 

ABQ

Well-Known Member
What makes us inferior? A very vocal and ignorant part of the population who continues to barf anti-science and anti-expert rhetoric.
I think the more appropriate question may be, what makes us more complicated than other nations? To compare the US to Israel is not at all an apples to apples comparison. Even if adjusted for size an population, you are comparing one of the most strict nations to enter and exit vs a 48 state (continental US) nation with 48 different governing bodies open to one another. Possibly, you could compare the US with the EU as a whole, but I'm not sure what sort of travel they have been allowing between each nation either, but when you see the up and down cases from France, Italy, Spain, Greece and so forth you get a better grasp of a group of bordering areas all dealing with similar struggles as the US has.
 

havoc315

Well-Known Member
NYC metro last spring would like a word. Italy and Spain might need a translator, but would join the conversation, too. Without the relatively harsh mitigation enacted there it was quickly spiraling in that direction.
Anyway, we have a dang good shot at actually getting ahead of our next wave and turning it into a little crest (nationally). We even have a legitimate shot of holding off that wave with way less suggested mitigation than we have currently, if people continue going out and getting their free and (mostly) easily accessible vaccine.

While I suspect India is dramatically under-counting cases and deaths, their per capita numbers are still significantly better than the US, Italy, etc.
 

wdisney9000

Well-Known Member
India. India happens. So, unless you want a world where the stench of a funeral pyre endlessly burns, stop with the nonsense. If you want honest discussion, try a different angle. There’s actually plenty of lively debate in this thread, but very few have a tolerance for adolescent, nonsensical arguments.
Temper temper.... I simply asked a question and you're telling me that asking a question is nonsense? No need to go full tilt totalitarian.

You and many others here apparently only subscribe to a certain sect of data and any data that does not fall in line with your fear based agenda that you have been programmed with is labeled as nonsense and you all form up like Voltron to attack anybody that isn't as afraid as you. The only problem is you're not Voltron. It comes off more like a bunch of raccoons tugging at a trash bag to get something out of it.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
Interesting. New Jersey must be filled up with these anti-Vax Muh Freedom types.

View attachment 556267
You’re trying to prove what exactly? While the red state/blue state explain some of the national numbers by far the biggest driver is age, if you’re >35 around 50% have been vaccinated, 16-34 around 30%. We need to get the young adults to do their part.

Also, FYI, all but two towns in New Jersey are better then the state of Mississippi.
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
Why? Because this is the way science works, we make theories based on what we know and then adjust them as we learn more. With a brand new virus sweeping through the world you can't wait until you are sure about the answers before you give them. You do what is best with the data you had at the time. Of course guidance is going to change as we learn more, I don't see how anyone could think otherwise.

As for disposal of masks, it's not like this is some sort of radioactive waste. You aren't going to get sick from walking past a contaminated mask. Most people are smart enough to know that they should throw them in the trash when they are done with them. For the people who don't, no amount of CDC guidelines is going to change the behavior.
How dare you bring science into this conversation. A few here are on a roll!
 

FormerMember

Well-Known Member
You’re trying to prove what exactly? While the red state/blue state explain some of the national numbers by far the biggest driver is age, if you’re >35 around 50% have been vaccinated, 16-34 around 30%. We need to get the young adults to do their part.

Also, FYI, all but two towns in New Jersey are better then the state of Mississippi.
I’m trying to prove that the dismissive attitude that anyone who’s not getting vaccinated is some moron hillbilly is bull plop.
 

sullyinMT

Well-Known Member
You do indeed know very little of Israel, which is even more polarized than the United States. They haven't even been able to get it together to form a government in the last 2 years. Between the radical right settlers, the religious zealots, the secular centrists, the Israeli Arabs, you think they are more unified than the United States?

They hit 60% vaccination. You really think we can't ever do the same in this country??
I’m not saying political divides don’t exist there. That’s human nature. I’m saying their conscription laws (of which there are any number of exemptions) might help when moving toward the greater good is needed. Vaccines and the use of vaccine passports is way different than political arguments about how to teach common core math or even what to do about their place in the region - it’s more like sugar rationing in the war effort where it’s just “something you do” because at the end of the day the people you argue with about day to day minutiae are still people worth working to save.
 

havoc315

Well-Known Member
I’m not saying political divides don’t exist there. That’s human nature. I’m saying their conscription laws (of which there are any number of exemptions) might help when moving toward the greater good is needed. Vaccines and the use of vaccine passports is way different than political arguments about how to teach common core math or even what to do about their place in the region - it’s more like sugar rationing in the war effort where it’s just “something you do” because at the end of the day the people you argue with about day to day minutiae are still people worth working to save.
If anything, their conscription laws divide them more.

But go ahead and put aside Israeli politics. Simple math: 60% vaccination. If other countries can get 60% vaccination, why can't the US??
 

sullyinMT

Well-Known Member
If anything, their conscription laws divide them more.

But go ahead and put aside Israeli politics. Simple math: 60% vaccination. If other countries can get 60% vaccination, why can't the US??
Fair enough. I still think we can and will get to 60%. I actually think that end number is higher, but not much. Maybe 65 (70 is a stretch but likely in some areas). What we’re hitting now is a wall based on geography and work schedules conflicting with clinic schedules. Of course, there are plenty of considerations and conversations we can have with the unvaccinated to speed that up and get us to 60% as fast as you and I would like, but we’ve reached the point where we either need patience for a couple months or a passport system.

If the Deep South is still having issues in July, the SEC and ACC just need to announce as a body that no unvaccinated fans will be allowed to attend football games or on-campus tailgates. Only partially kidding.
 

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