Proof of Vaccination or Negative COVID Test required for theme parks soon?

[Bullseye1967]

Who said anything about it being fun? The reason I use polio as an example is because people don’t complain that polio vaccine requirements are oppressing them and robbing them of their personal choice. That less than 1% of people infected with the polio virus would actually develop polio is exactly the sort of statistic that is being used to dismiss COVID-19. COVID-19 also continues to surprise. Long COVID. Negative impacts to the lungs, heart and other organs even in people who barely had any symptoms or never had any at all. Who knows if there might be a Post COVID Syndrome that comes back to haunt people. But there are safe, effective vaccines that even supposed “advocates” are spreading misinformation about.

I am fully vaxxed and have never spoken a word against people being vaccinated, in fact I suggest to those around me.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I am fully vaxxed and have never spoken a word against people being vaccinated, in fact I suggest to those around me.

Anti-vaccine bunk about safety was in what you described as “seems pretty factual.”

 

[Disney Irish]

True. But the data and media sources I use are generally correct (and if they are, the California Department of Public Health has a much bigger problem on its hands!).

You appear to disagree with my personal opinion on stuff, like parenting decisions.

You don't disagree with the actual facts and data I provide. You disagree with my personal opinion based on that data. That's all.

It also appears to anger folks that I dare to voice an opinion that would be forbidden in the Faculty Lounge or a campus coffee shop. And that is absolutely hysterical to me! No dissent allowed, you must obey and stick only to approved Talking Points.

There is a difference between voicing an opinion and trying to pass that opinion off as fact. I may disagree with your opinions on a lot of topics, but that isn't what we're talking about here. There is a reason why I didn't mention your opinion on parenting decisions, because its beside the point and not relevant.

Its about the misinformation on the virus and vaccine that have been posted that a lot of us have an issue with and have been trying to correct here for the last 18 months.

 

[TP2000]

I am fully vaxxed and have never spoken a word against people being vaccinated, in fact I suggest to those around me.

I got that too.

Which made me think... Who here is actually anti-vaccine??? I can't think of a single poster here in recent memory who has voiced an anti-vaccine opinion. I would remember that as I'd love to hear their thoughts on that matter. I don't know anyone in my social circle or extended family who is not vaccinated.

So if that's the case, and someone like me who spends regular time on here can't think of anyone here who is anti-vaccine, then what the heck are some of these folks so upset about?

It's almost like our words show up differently on their computer screens or something. Apparently my long-term very pro-vaccine opinions have translated into "Anti-Vaxxxxxxx!" for some readers here. It's very odd.

 

[Bullseye1967]

Anti-vaccine bunk about safety was in what you described as “seems pretty factual.”

What he stated about polio was very factual. It was in the article he posted. Was the article misinformation? Like I said previously, I am very familiar with Polio. I have been a member for a support group for people with family members with Polio for 33 years and have done our monthly newsletter for the last 12 years. As far as his opinion is concerned he is certainly entitled to it. He stated it as an opinion and not a fact.

 

[lazyboy97o]

What he stated about polio was very factual. It was in the article he posted. Was the article misinformation? Like I said previously, I am very familiar with Polio. I have been a member for a support group for people with family members with Polio for 33 years and have done our monthly newsletter for the last 12 years. As far as his opinion is concerned he is certainly entitled to it. He stated it as an opinion and not a fact.

I already broke down how the facts regarding polio were misleading.

The “long term effects“ of vaccines is not a matter of opinion.

 

[TP2000]

I've got TV to catch up on, so I'm about done for the evening. I'll leave us all with some misinformation um... actual facts and data on how vaccinations and Covid is doing in Orange County (Disneyland, Knott's Berry Farm) and LA County (Universal Studios, Magic Mountain)...

As per usual since mid August, Covid case rates and hospitalizations continue to decline in Orange County...

Los Angeles County Case Rates and Hospitalizations show the similar trend to Orange County...

While vaccination rates continue a slow but steady trend line upward. San Diego County and Orange County remain the most highly vaccinated counties in SoCal, and above the state average.

LA County coronavirus tracker: Cases, vaccines, maps and more

Los Angeles County coronavirus tracker: Cases, vaccines, maps and more The coronavirus pandemic continues to take a toll across Los Angeles County. Here is the latest information available from hea…

www.dailynews.com

 

[TP2000]

Its the old anti-vax stance that if we don't have an HIV vaccine yet after 40 years how can we trust a vaccine made in less than 12 months for COVID19. Its pack full of BS and lies. I'm not claiming that you're anti-vax, just that the information you're posting is coming right from the anti-vax playbook.

Just clarifying, so you are aware. There is still no HIV vaccine. We've been waiting for decades for an HIV vaccine, to no avail. Many Americans have died of AIDS, and particularly in the 1980's and early 90's things were tragic on that front.

None of that has anything to do with Covid-19 or why I've been consistently pro-vaccine here.

 

[Bullseye1967]

I already broke down how the facts regarding polio were misleading.

The “long term effects“ of vaccines is not a matter of opinion.

They were still facts whether you think they were misleading or not. Your take is he picked random facts rather than telling the whole story of Polio. That is your opinion and NOT a fact. He responded to you with a fact filled response. His facts were correct. Whether you think he is cherry picking select facts to support his argument is your opinion. It does not change the fact that they are true. You also claim that his numbers are not correct. I familiar with these numbers and he is spot on. You claim he choose the worst year and he admits he did to show how bad Polio was. This is my last response to you regarding Polio but if you think you have any clue about Polio compared to me you are barking up the wrong tree. Polio or post Polio is a big part of my every day life. I usually agree and like most of your posts bit if you have an issue with TP take it to a DM. At some point you have to figure out you got a little over zealous and walk a way. Feel free to argue all you want with @TP2000 but you hold no ground with me. I would also like to see @Heppenheimer weigh in on my thoughts. He actually is qualified.

 

[truecoat]

Just clarifying, so you are aware. There is still no HIV vaccine. We've been waiting for decades for an HIV vaccine, to no avail. Many Americans have died of AIDS, and particularly in the 1980's and early 90's things were tragic on that front.

None of that has anything to do with Covid-19 or why I've been consistently pro-vaccine here.

It appears that mRNA vaccines will be the wave of the future. They started human HIV vaccine trials last month and I believe a mRNA skin cancer vaccine is close to testing. It will also allow for a better, almost universal flu vaccine. Many other applications are possible such as malaria, Ebola and cystic fibrosis.

On a personal note, my grandma had polio. She was lucky enough to go to the Sister Kenny institute which probably allowed her a better outcome than others. She could walk somewhat with the help of her “sticks” as she called them, a short pair of modified crutches that she used.

 

[TP2000]

They were still facts whether you think they were misleading or not. Your take is he picked random facts rather than telling the whole story of Polio. That is your opinion and NOT a fact. He responded to you with a fact filled response. His facts were correct. Whether you think he is cherry picking select facts to support his argument is your opinion. It does not change the fact that they are true. You also claim that his numbers are not correct. I familiar with these numbers and he is spot on. You claim he choose the worst year and he admits he did to show how bad Polio was. This is my last response to you regarding Polio but if you think you have any clue about Polio compared to me you are barking up the wrong tree. Polio or post Polio is a big part of my every day life. I usually agree and like most of your posts bit if you have an issue with TP take it to a DM. At some point you have to figure out you got a little over zealous and walk a way. Feel free to argue all you want with @TP2000 but you hold no ground with me. I would also like to see @Heppenheimer weigh in on my thoughts. He actually is qualified.

Thank you so much!

I'm not sure how we got to a place where something like the historically accurate scourge of Polio was negotiable or subject to interpretation, but apparently here we are.

 

[TP2000]

It appears that mRNA vaccines will be the wave of the future. They started human HIV vaccine trials last month and I believe a mRNA skin cancer vaccine is close to testing. It will also allow for a better, almost universal flu vaccine. Many other applications are possible such as malaria, Ebola and cystic fibrosis.

I agree. I have read several articles in the past six months or so about all this mRNA stuff. It's exciting. There was brief hope earlier this year about an HIV vaccine, but just like always, there was a setback. I know they'll get there eventually on HIV, I just know it, but that decades long road has been full of so many false hopes and dead ends that you'll have to excuse my melancholy.

I also read about the permanent flu vaccine. That would be handy, although personally I enjoy my Flu shot every October. It's a fun thing for me, and I chat with the nurse and have a celebratory lunch at Rockwell's Cafe and make an afternoon of it.

I'll miss the annual Flu shot if it soon gets replaced with a lifetime version!

On a personal note, my grandma had polio. She was lucky enough to go to the Sister Kenny institute which probably allowed her a better outcome than others. She could walk somewhat with the help of her “sticks” as she called them, a short pair of modified crutches that she used.

Interesting. There was a generation of Americans who dealt with so much and did it with such dignity and grace. I'm afraid we've lost that now, if one dares to go on Twitter or Instagram.

Polio and its defeat was a massive accomplishment. It's amazing to think it's entirely gone not just in wealthy countries like the USA, but worldwide now. If you'd told someone that a hundred years ago they'd never believe you.

 

[Disney Irish]

Just clarifying, so you are aware. There is still no HIV vaccine. We've been waiting for decades for an HIV vaccine, to no avail. Many Americans have died of AIDS, and particularly in the 1980's and early 90's things were tragic on that front.

None of that has anything to do with Covid-19 or why I've been consistently pro-vaccine here.

This is honestly without a doubt one post you didn't need to write. I am fully 100% aware there is no HIV vaccine, more than you know. As I'm sure almost all posters here are also aware. And really is beside the point of the whole topic we were discussing.

The fact that no HIV vaccine exists yet doesn't make the COVID vaccine any less safe or trustworthy, that is the whole point.

 

[Heppenheimer]

What breed(s)?

Beagle and Bernese mountain dog, the latter still a puppy (but now a big puppy).

 

[smooch]

Covid is entirely new. No one had even heard of Covid until 20 months ago. The vaccines didn't start until January. Covid's impact on healthy children is statistically tiny and medically negligible. Very little research has been done into Covid-19, much less the long term impacts of the vaccines on adults, much less children.

Not true, coronaviruses have been around for more than the last 20 months, and vaccines for coronaviruses were around before that as well. In fact, in 2002 another virus called Sars which was a coronavirus-related viral respiratory disease had an outbreak. Because of this outbreak research began for a vaccine for that strain of coronavirus. COVID-19 is a novel form of the coronavirus, so there have been coronaviruses as well as research into vaccines for coronaviruses for almost two decades now. And the next point was covered previously in the thread already but the idea of a long term impact from a vaccine is flawed, as that is not how a vaccine works. It does not sit and stay in your body for the rest of your life. As the previous poster said: you wouldn't blame a stomach ache today on bad fish you ate 6 months ago.

This isn't some unheard of type of virus we have never encountered before, it's just a novel version of a type of virus we have previously encountered and researched vaccines for. You could argue an mRNA vaccine should be safer than a typical vaccine because instead of injecting the actual virus into someone like a traditional vaccine you are just teaching your body to produce the non-harmful spike proteins on the outside of the virus to teach your immune system to attack it in case your body ever encounters actual COVID-19 particles. But that is beside the point, the fact remains that yes people have known about other coronaviruses, maybe not COVID-19 specifically but they have been researched for decades, we didn't start from square one with this vaccine, in fact the reason it was created so quickly is specifically because of our work on the 2002 Sars outbreak.

This article explains the history and timeline of our work on the COVID-19 vaccine and how we created it so quickly pretty well. And the fact that 99% of hospitalizations are unvaccinated people and like it was said before only 4 people have died directly due to a COVID-19 vaccine and that is only 1 of the 3 vaccines we have been distributing to hundreds of millions of Americans. If we get out of this pandemic and a decade from now I grow a third arm because of the vaccine I will personally apologize for being wrong, but with all the information available now it is clear the vaccine is safe and effective and is our only chance of returning to anything resembling "normal." We won't ever get back to the real normal, much like how things were permanently changed by the events on 9/11 we will basically have a "before COVID" and "after COVID" sense of reality. COVID will hopefully just become something we're aware of and take extra precautions to avoid spreading it too much, I'm not saying permanent mask mandates or social distancing, but I do not see a future in which we can live and ignore the fact that COVID exists without overloading health care systems with patients and having thousands of people die every day from COVID.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Beagle and Bernese mountain dog, the latter still a puppy (but now a big puppy).

View attachment 587131View attachment 587132

Beauties!

 

[DCBaker]

For LA county, it does look like it Theme Parks will be included -

 

[October82]

For LA county, it does look like it Theme Parks will be included -

This is very good news.

 

[TP2000]

Not true, coronaviruses have been around for more than the last 20 months, and vaccines for coronaviruses were around before that as well. In fact, in 2002 another virus called Sars which was a coronavirus-related viral respiratory disease had an outbreak. Because of this outbreak research began for a vaccine for that strain of coronavirus. COVID-19 is a novel form of the coronavirus, so there have been coronaviruses as well as research into vaccines for coronaviruses for almost two decades now. And the next point was covered previously in the thread already but the idea of a long term impact from a vaccine is flawed, as that is not how a vaccine works. It does not sit and stay in your body for the rest of your life. As the previous poster said: you wouldn't blame a stomach ache today on bad fish you ate 6 months ago.

This isn't some unheard of type of virus we have never encountered before, it's just a novel version of a type of virus we have previously encountered and researched vaccines for. You could argue an mRNA vaccine should be safer than a typical vaccine because instead of injecting the actual virus into someone like a traditional vaccine you are just teaching your body to produce the non-harmful spike proteins on the outside of the virus to teach your immune system to attack it in case your body ever encounters actual COVID-19 particles. But that is beside the point, the fact remains that yes people have known about other coronaviruses, maybe not COVID-19 specifically but they have been researched for decades, we didn't start from square one with this vaccine, in fact the reason it was created so quickly is specifically because of our work on the 2002 Sars outbreak.

This article explains the history and timeline of our work on the COVID-19 vaccine and how we created it so quickly pretty well. And the fact that 99% of hospitalizations are unvaccinated people and like it was said before only 4 people have died directly due to a COVID-19 vaccine and that is only 1 of the 3 vaccines we have been distributing to hundreds of millions of Americans. If we get out of this pandemic and a decade from now I grow a third arm because of the vaccine I will personally apologize for being wrong, but with all the information available now it is clear the vaccine is safe and effective and is our only chance of returning to anything resembling "normal." We won't ever get back to the real normal, much like how things were permanently changed by the events on 9/11 we will basically have a "before COVID" and "after COVID" sense of reality. COVID will hopefully just become something we're aware of and take extra precautions to avoid spreading it too much, I'm not saying permanent mask mandates or social distancing, but I do not see a future in which we can live and ignore the fact that COVID exists without overloading health care systems with patients and having thousands of people die every day from COVID.

Totally get that. I honestly do. A year ago? I had no idea what mRNA was, even though it turns out that phrase had been used in a few articles I'd read years prior about the HIV vaccine. But mRNA sticking in my vocabulary? Nope. But I believe in vaccines, wholly.

But look at that text you wrote? Three giant paragraphs to explain the point. In today's environment it's going to take better marketing to get that point across for many folks.

You are up against the Twitter Era, where people with millions of Twitter followers can just throw out a few short words like this and completely undermine the medical facts behind the vaccines, as you so nicely said above. This Tweet was from less than a year ago, by a prominent MSNBC host with 2 Million followers.

EDIT: Tweet from Joy Reid was removed by Moderator, probably because Joy Reid was peddling in obvious vaccine disinformation.

That said, my long held pro-vaccine opinions are in regards to adults. And when it comes to Covid, especially adults with serious health problems pre-existing (obesity, heart disease, lung disease, diabetes, etc.), I'm rabidly pro-vaccine. But...

When it comes to children, I go hands off. The decision on what medicine to give to their children and when is completely up to the responsible parents of those children. I am in no position to tell others how to parent their children. None whatsoever, and I really don't think most others are either.

(Heck, I'm the uncle who just realized in another thread that I rented Roger Rabbit on VHS twenty years ago while babysitting nephews. That movie is kinda raunchy! What was I thinking?!? So I'm not about to start giving childhood medical advice to parents.)

And regardless of the long explanation behind mRNA vaccines, none of us knew what Covid-19 was less than two years ago. It's going to take some time for some, especially parents of young children, to adjust to that. See Joy Reid's Tweet from 2020 as but one example of that.

 

[TP2000]

For LA county, it does look like it Theme Parks will be included -

I'm not opposed to this concept, but the thought that young people don't know how to go out on the town with a fake ID card of some sort is hysterically funny!

Especially when the fake ID cards are just awkwardly shaped pieces of white card stock without any serial number or QR code, and are available for free download everywhere on the Internet. You have to put your own ballpoint pen scribbles on it though.

LA County is giant and extremely wealthy, with a huge population (10.1 Million) and huge budget ($36 Billion) larger than many states. They have a massive bureaucracy at the sprawling Los Angeles Department of Public Health, and that bureaucracy knows exactly who is vaccinated and who is not, down to each zip code.

I would hope that LA County has a more targeted approach to vaccinations than just telling unvaccinated barflies, foodies and Date Niters to fake a vaccine card to get into a joint.

Here are the current statistics on vaccinations in Los Angeles County for mid September, 2021:

LA County Total Residents Over Age 12 Fully Vaccinated: 58%

LA County Total Residents Over Age 12 Receiving At Least 1 Dose: 76%
Males Over 12 = 73%
Females Over 12 = 78%
Ages 65 to 79 = 95%
Ages 18 to 29 = 67%

Asians = 80% At Least One Dose
Whites = 71% At Least One Dose
Latinos = 60% At Least One Dose
Blacks = 52% At Least One Dose

Okay, so what's the plan here LA? What are you going to do to get out into the Black and Latino communities and get the young folks, especially young men of color, vaccinated ASAP? The Johnson&Johnson vaccine only takes one shot. From a recent trip to a CVS in Del Mar, there's plenty of J&J shots sitting on shelves in SoCal. What's your plan???

Here's the latest LA County zip code map of who is currently most vaccinated (wealthy coastal communities and happy hillside suburbs) and who is least vaccinated (inland and urban working class communities, often of color).

What's the plan to turn Lakewood and Watts just as dark green as Pacific Palisades and Pasadena? And while we're at it, what's the deal with Catalina Island? I know the buffalo out there aren't vaccinated, but what about the few thousand humans? My only guess is that like that little speck of brown in West LA that represents the UCLA campus, almost everyone with an address on Catalina also has an address on the mainland?

LA County COVID-19 Vaccine Dashboard - LA County Department of Public Health

publichealth.lacounty.gov