Breaking Points

[smooch]

Just wanted to weigh in again, my girlfriend is currently in Disneyland and specifically has been in Galaxy's Edge the last hour or so (lost track of time since I'm at work while getting pictures / videos from her and her thoughts) and it's her first time there. She somewhat enjoys Star Wars, I think she saw the PT and OT a long time ago then only saw the ST one time for each movie. She watched Mandalorian Season 1 and we are gonna watch Season 2 together. She kinda knows the general story of Star Wars but not too much in depth knowledge and she is really really enjoying the land for the most part. Loves looking around because it looks so realistic to her, she rode Millenium Falcon and got pilot so she had a blast. She and her family didn't get in the initial boarding group batch for RotR so they are trying again for the noon batch, but she was bummed in the morning when they didn't get a group but has been enjoying her day and it isn't seeming to bother her too much. She got very excited when she saw she can build a droid but when she saw it was $100 she decided it wasn't worth it. She hasn't tried any food yet, aside from the blue milk which she and her family enjoyed. So far, all in all, it seems like she is having fun exploring the land for the first time and seeing things like the life size Falcon, the droids and ships everywhere, etc. but I don't know what her opinion will be on visiting it again in the future. I know I have never been so when we go together eventually we'll go to SW:GE just so I can see it for myself, so she'll probably enjoy watching me react to everything, but after that it doesn't seem like she has found much to return for. A ride on Millenium Falcon if the wait isn't crazy, and a ride on RotR if she gets a group, but all in all not too much to do on return visits. She saw Rey out on a balcony waving / talking to people but hasn't seen any other characters, really.

Long story short it seems like she is enjoying seeing it all for the first time as she never even saw pictures of it beforehand, but other than sightseeing for the first time and riding MF:SR there aren't tons of activities to do unless you wanna shell out $100-200 on a single experience per person. So at the moment yes she is having a ton of fun and is glad Disney built the land, I'm curious to ask her how she would feel about going back in the future after she is done with her day at Disneyland and I see her in a few days.

I know this isn't about my breaking points but I know we were discussing public perception of these lands and wanted to provide insight directly from my girlfriend who enjoys Disney parks but does not go very often and is not a super fan, just an average fan who isn't able to visit multiple times a year / every year.

 

[Mac Tonight]

If Disneyland ever permanently removes/re-themes Pirates or Haunted Mansion, I would be very hard-pressed to find a desire to go.

As others have said, the slow decaying of Disney's standards and overall quality has really been felt in a tremendous way.
My wife and I purchased APs back in 2017 and we loved the ability to go on a whim or stop in for "dinner and Pirates" on a Friday night, but sadly those days are gone.

For me, the most obvious grievance is that Disney continues to prove that they have no interest in preserving their own history. Decisions are made these days based on short-term gain, and making low-hanging "progressive" changes, that they think are going to earn them some points with the social media community.

Modern day Disney is "made for the moment". Meaning, nothing is being done with longevity in mind, because everything now is designed to be fluid and interchangeable. And yes, I'm fully aware Walt changed stuff in his day, but even then, his changes were not based on passing trends and social media whimsy. And he certainly valued original creativity over IP inclusion.

I'm probably paraphrasing others on here, but everything that has come out of the Parks since "The Bobs" took over has felt like it was designed by a paid focus group rather than a team of creative individuals. (I do still believe there is creativity to be found in WDI, but it's been so tamped down by budget cuts that its very hard to even notice.)

There is still beauty and charm to be found at the Parks if you know where to look, but never before have we had to live under a regime where everything, literally everything, feels like its just one bad decision away from being erased forever.

 

[Jumpersmom]

My interest in Disney started plummeting around the time Iger’s love and devotion to the shiny, pretty IPs he purchased steamrolled over any interest in actual “Disney” creations—combined with his ban on anything new or origjnal.

And now, between Garbage Pier, Galaxy’s Eyesore, Garbage Campus and the continued wimpification of rides like Pirates and Snow White AND the increased trend of making the parks into phone-tethered playgrounds for wealthy instagramming adult children with bottomless bank accounts and an endless appetite for overpriced cupcakes...I am done for now.

There’s so much *genuinely* creative awesomeness in the world to appreciate and support, and that’s where I’ll take my leisure dollars. Bobs-Disney can take its “magical enchanted dream wish” of boarding passes, upcharges and rides designed to be toy commercials and take a flying leap into a giant vat of sparkly, hypocrisy-flavored cupcake batter.

You said it perfectly without me even having to say anything

 

[PiratesMansion]

At a certain point it will stop being worth the money, and you could argue that it's almost there right now.

I find it really interesting that it's a problem that is pretty much exclusive to the US parks. I'm planning a trip to Disneyland Paris and it's absolutely shocking how cheap it is compared to our parks here.

And the Asian parks are even cheaper. Disneyland Paris is in a weird position where it's still cheaper than the US parks right now, but it's still more expensive than it used to be before Disney got controlling interest in the resort a few years ago.

There are a lot of great points in this thread. Because I'm not a local to any Disney park and can only visit when time and money permits, I think that has helped insulate me from feeling the impact of every single change the way some people here have felt them. But it's also true that some of the changes (not all of them) bother me less than many here. They haven't come for *my stuff* in the way they've come for others'. Yet.

The only Disney property right now that I have reached my breaking point with is WDW; it's just too expensive and too much of a hassle to extract any value out of the Florida resort at the moment. I'm not there with anything else Disney related. Yet.

Price sensitivity is definitely a concern, as are the risk of more negative changes going forward. But I've always been someone who visits and values amusement/theme parks in general and not just Disney, and so if Disney alienates me completely, I'll just go to other places. Frankly, as other places are (often significantly) less expensive, they might even be doing me a financial favor in the long run or encourage me to travel to new places instead.

 

[TP2000]

Wait a moment, are they actually calling guests "friend" now? The idea of a stranger calling me that, especially if they're likely to be giving an unsolicited direction, is disingenuous to the point it makes me cringe. I may have found my breaking point!

Yes. They removed the introduction to the fireworks they had used since 1958 that went "Ladies and gentleman, boys and girls, Walt Disney/Disneyland/Paul Pressler/Bob Chapek/The Disney Plus Bundle is happy to present..."

And they replaced it with the genderless "Good evening, friends" so as not to offend anyone on Main Street USA who does not consider themselves to be a lady or a gentleman. (I've known a few in my day, and they always wanted one or the other. But I guess no longer?)

You can't make that stuff up. Someone in Burbank actually thinks this is important, and it's going to help something to do something.

Meanwhile, God bless 'em, the 18 dollar an hour kids staffing the park are still getting on their plastic microphones and saying "Ladies and gentleman, Big Thunder Mountain is experiencing technical difficulties..." and ruining any woke inclusion that Burbank HR drones were trying to achieve by erasing hateful gender from their fireworks announcement.

 

[CaptinEO]

Yes. They removed the introduction to the fireworks they had used since 1958 that went "Ladies and gentleman, boys and girls, Walt Disney/Disneyland/Paul Pressler/Bob Chapek/The Disney Plus Bundle is happy to present..."

And they replaced it with the genderless "Good evening, friends" so as not to offend anyone on Main Street USA who does not consider themselves to be a lady or a gentleman. (I've known a few in my day, and they always wanted one or the other. But I guess no longer?)

You can't make that stuff up. Someone in Burbank actually thinks this is important, and it's going to help something to do something.

Meanwhile, God bless 'em, the 18 dollar an hour kids staffing the park are still getting on their plastic microphones and saying "Ladies and gentleman, Big Thunder Mountain is experiencing technical difficulties..." and ruining any woke inclusion that Burbank HR drones were trying to achieve by erasing hateful gender from their fireworks announcement.

We had a whole thread discussing this and the website removed it. It's such a major change too. And unnecessary at that. They should have appended to ladies and gentlemen boys and girls if they felt the line needed to add more. Not removed it all together.

No one is offended that "boys and girls" exist, only Disney corporate thinking they earn woke points this way, while at the same time
bowing down to China who locks people like this in concentration camps.

 

[Californian Elitist]

The thread was shut down not because people were getting offended, but because it had gone too far into political territory, something that isn’t allowed here. Had nothing to do with “laws of nature.”

 

[Magenta Panther]

My interest in Disney started plummeting around the time Iger’s love and devotion to the shiny, pretty IPs he purchased steamrolled over any interest in actual “Disney” creations—combined with his ban on anything new or origjnal.

And now, between Garbage Pier, Galaxy’s Eyesore, Garbage Campus and the continued wimpification of rides like Pirates and Snow White AND the increased trend of making the parks into phone-tethered playgrounds for wealthy instagramming adult children with bottomless bank accounts and an endless appetite for overpriced cupcakes...I am done for now.

There’s so much *genuinely* creative awesomeness in the world to appreciate and support, and that’s where I’ll take my leisure dollars. Bobs-Disney can take its “magical enchanted dream wish” of boarding passes, upcharges and rides designed to be toy commercials and take a flying leap into a giant vat of sparkly, hypocrisy-flavored cupcake batter.

I've been saying stuff like this for a while, but you put it beautifully. Kudos!

And you're right, Iger has zip interest in Walt's stuff - to him, Walt is just another character to exploit/put on a t-shirt to sell to the suckers. He doesn't care about Walt's legacy (although his minions are happy to chirp about it without actually practicing it), park upkeep (broken yeti) or "plussing", except regarding park prices. If anything, "minusing" is his thing - cut services, cut corners, cut projects etc. He's a despicable greedy cement head, who has political ambitions (har de har har). I hate the guy. Duh.

I too am contemptuous of the woke crap that might impress the twits on Twitter but doesn't impress the vast majority of people Twitter doesn't represent. Stupid weak pandering while meanwhile hiring-rehiring pedophiles (which is another, although not totally irrelevant, topic, since Iger is a gross hypocrite too).

I still like Disneyland - the Disney parts of it, anyway. I *might* visit there again. Bu if WDW destroys the Tower of Terror like Disneyland did, that'd be it for me. I'd never set foot there again (and frankly, I haven't been there in years and have no plans to visit in the near future). You are right that there are other theme parks out there which are just as good and/or BETTER than any stateside Disney park, as I've tried to demonstrate here via my posts about Germany's Europa park with its stunning pirates ride "Piraten in Batavia", plus Germany's Phantasialand, which has the awesome Rookburgh steampunk-themed area and its amazing Charles Lindbergh hotel, not to mention its blazing Fly coaster. And then there's Efteling in the Netherlands - now THAT is a park with true enchantment, with joy and theming to spare, and I can't wait to visit there in person. THOSE are the theme parks I want to spend my money on. The only Disney park that's on my bucket list now is - you guessed it - Tokyo Disneyland/Toyko Disney Sea. Which Iger's inept "Imagineers" didn't build, which no doubt is why it's called the most beautiful theme park in the world. I'm happy to reward the Oriental Land Company for respecting, celebrating and upholding Walt Disney's legacy and passion for his theme park concept in ways that Iger can't or won't. So there you have it, FWIW.

 

[el_super]

The reason Disneyland fans hate change is because the changes are almost always of extremely poor quality.

If their changes are almost always poor quality, why has there been no financial impact over the course of the last 10, 20 or 30 years?

Their business is growing because they are offering a product people want. It's just as simple as that.

 

[Californian Elitist]

If their changes are almost always poor quality, why has there been no financial impact over the course of the last 10, 20 or 30 years?

Their business is growing because they are offering a product people want. It's just as simple as that.

Pretty sure they were referring to hardcore, more traditional fans and not general fans.

 

[mickEblu]

If their changes are almost always poor quality, why has there been no financial impact over the course of the last 10, 20 or 30 years?

Their business is growing because they are offering a product people want. It's just as simple as that.

There is sometimes financial impact but they begin to course correct. They just like to see what they can get away with from time to time.

To answer your question- because there is nothing else like it. Specifically what Walt and his protégés did from the 50s through the 90s.

 

[britain]

I still love all the parks, haven’t been to WDW since ‘04. Wanted to plan a trip to show it to my kids but, sigh, my favorite things aren’t there anymore. Showing my kids Martin’s vids is cheaper and more nostalgic for me.

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

I still love all the parks, haven’t been to WDW since ‘04. Wanted to plan a trip to show it to my kids but, sigh, my favorite things aren’t there anymore. Showing my kids Martin’s vids is cheaper and more nostalgic for me.

I hadn't been to the world in almost a decade when I went back in 2018. There's still good things to be found. It's just different- especially my beloved Epcot. (You can read of our first day to Epcot here or read Day Three trip report of our second ay to Epcot.)

 

[PiratesMansion]

Modern WDW is so frustrating. I WANT to love it-and there are so many things there that none of the other resorts can equal!

But the people who run it can't get out of their own way and it inevitably ends up host to all of modern Disney's worst impulses on grand scale. Maximize profits at all costs at the expense of everything else, cut this, upcharge that, rip this ride out instead of updating it appropriately or building much-needed capacity....

 

[BasiltheBatLord]

I'm planning on going to WDW for the 50th, probably next year sometime. Haven't been since 2013/2014. So much has changed since then and is continuing to change.

I feel like it's almost kinda overlooked the crazy amount of expansion and change that has been happening at WDW in the past 7-10 years or so. DHS and Epcot are being completely overhauled (and they both needed it, even if the execution is debatable), MK is getting its first new E-ticket in years, AK got its first new land in almost 20 years.

 

[October82]

I'm planning on going to WDW for the 50th, probably next year sometime. Haven't been since 2013/2014. So much has changed since then and is continuing to change.

I feel like it's almost kinda overlooked the crazy amount of expansion and change that has been happening at WDW in the past 7-10 years or so. DHS and Epcot are being completely overhauled (and they both needed it, even if the execution is debatable), MK is getting its first new E-ticket in years, AK got its first new land in almost 20 years.

DHS had nowhere to go but sideways, but Epcot seems worse off (IMO) now than it was. Epcot is one small step forwards, three large steps back nowadays.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I have no desire to visit WDW or any other Disney park around the world.

 

[October82]

I have no desire to visit WDW or any other Disney park around the world.

Tokyo DisneySea?

 

[Californian Elitist]

Tokyo DisneySea?

Nope.

Not saying that I would never visit the other parks because I absolutely would. But I just don’t have a deep desire to visit any of them. They’re not a priority, if that makes sense. Like I would never travel to France solely to visit DLP (especially now that that Premiere crap is coming). Same for Japan and China. I would potentially add it to my list of things to do out there, but it still wouldn’t be a priority.

 

[October82]

Nope.

Not saying that I would never visit the other parks because I absolutely would. But I just don’t have a deep desire to visit any of them. They’re not a priority, if that makes sense. Like I would never travel to France solely to visit DLP (especially now that that Premiere crap is coming). Same for Japan and China. I would potentially add it to my list of things to do out there, but it still wouldn’t be a priority.

Ah, I understand that. I'm there with you.