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Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion
- Thread starter Parker in NYC
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- coronavirus covid covid-19
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And in the USA:
DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
No but it changes the likeness. I'm just speculating as to what the reasons might be.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
No it doesn’t. Mickey Mouse in a mask is still Mickey Mouse.
Disstevefan1
Well-Known Member
What is “doing everything it can”? Shutdown everything again? Curfews again? Mask mandates when 80 percent of the US is already masking and we have 100 percent masking in WDW?
If/when you find out there are cases caused by visiting WDW, please let the rest of us know.
Heppenheimer
Well-Known Member
Just like Vampire Mickey Mouse, Indiana Jones Mickey Mouse, Surgeon Mickey Mouse, and Jedi Mickey Mouse
I posted and we discussed this study in Nature back a couple dozen pages:
Massive dataset reveals 4 superspreader sites to avoid in winter 2021
Researchers examining mobility offer robust evidence that social distancing works — and pinpoint locations to avoid during the pandemic.www.inverse.com
This is no real surprise, but a recent study published today in Nature is proving to be very timely to the discussion on indoor dining:
The article linked is a decent summary, here’s the actual study itself:
Mobility network models of COVID-19 explain inequities and inform reopening - Nature
An epidemiological model that integrates fine-grained mobility networks illuminates mobility-related mechanisms that contribute to higher infection rates among disadvantaged socioeconomic and racial groups, and finds that restricting maximum occupancy at locations is especially effective for...
www.nature.com
And here is a relevant graph from the study, ranking types of establishments by modeled risk of infection:
The study did not model Orlando among the handful of cities they looked at, I believe this graph is from Chicago data. There’s also not a ‘theme park / resort’ category, but I think it’s fair to make some associations from categories that have similar components of interaction.
This data is the closest science I’ve seen to suggest that WDW does in fact represent a higher risk environment, perhaps even with in place mitigation. Since we don’t have viable contact tracing and a WDW visit necessitates multiple accessory interactions, I don’t think you’re going to ever see any hard data pinning an outbreak to WDW specifically, outside of model studies like this. Perhaps the closest would be a documented cast member outbreak, which I’ve seen implied on social media but never verified by an official source.
So yeah, personally, I’m kind of just assuming based on what we now know about how the virus behaves. Is it possible to visit WDW without hitting higher risk venues like indoor dining? Sure. Are you at lower risk overall eating indoors at WDW compared to your neighborhood Applebee’s? Undoubtedly. But to me there’s a lot of common sense to the fact that a place with lots of people, from very geographically diverse sources, should now be recognized as a place of higher risk.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Not mandate that local authorities not adjust to their situations?
Not force openings when no Health experts thought it was warranted/too early?
Not be a general inmate run asylum?
The little things.
And cases are up everywhere. You think a place with 30,000 employees slogging in and out from Kissimmee, BVL and clermont are wrapped in anti-viral bubble wrap? You think a thermal scan does the job?
...I got some beans to sell you.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
On that graph... is full service restaurants assuming normal operation or social distance operations?I posted and we discussed this study in Nature back a couple dozen pages:
The article linked is a decent summary, here’s the actual study itself:
Mobility network models of COVID-19 explain inequities and inform reopening - Nature
An epidemiological model that integrates fine-grained mobility networks illuminates mobility-related mechanisms that contribute to higher infection rates among disadvantaged socioeconomic and racial groups, and finds that restricting maximum occupancy at locations is especially effective for...
And here is a relevant graph from the study, ranking types of establishments by modeled risk of infection:
View attachment 513754
The study did not model Orlando among the handful of cities they looked at, I believe this graph is from Chicago data. There’s also not a ‘theme park / resort’ category, but I think it’s fair to make some associations from categories that have similar components of interaction.
This data is the closest science I’ve seen to suggest that WDW does in fact represent a higher risk environment, perhaps even with in place mitigation. Since we don’t have viable contact tracing and a WDW visit necessitates multiple accessory interactions, I don’t think you’re going to ever see any hard data pinning an outbreak to WDW specifically, outside of model studies like this. Perhaps the closest would be a documented cast member outbreak, which I’ve seen implied on social media but never verified by an official source.
So yeah, personally, I’m kind of just assuming based on what we now know about how the virus behaves. Is it possible to visit WDW without hitting higher risk venues like indoor dining? Sure. Are you at lower risk overall eating indoors at WDW compared to your neighborhood Applebee’s? Undoubtedly. But to me there’s a lot of common sense to the fact that a place with lots of people, from very geographically diverse sources, should now be recognized as a place of higher risk.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
The data seems to be pointing to the unfortunate concept that it really doesn’t matter.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
It’s frustrating that more studies aren’t being done. If restaurants are spreading the virus with or without distancing they shouldn’t be open right now. That includes restaurants inside the wdw Resort.
Err... that’s actually a good question I’ve been trying to figure out. I believe it’s simply ‘reopening’ without defining capacity. They run though a bunch of capacity simulations as well to give some weight to that, if you read further into it.
But..
that’s kind of what I believe also. The social component of indoor dining coupled with the need to be unmasked for most of the meal is what it is. And it’s not good.
New Orleans has released specific guidance for Mardi Gras 2021... no parades permitted this year:
Florida is also NOT doing everything it can to prevent actual deaths (not cases) of cancer, heart disease, etc. Should WDW be held responsible for NOT doing more? When you begin to deal in absolutes, you have already failed.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Oh...we’re gonna go back to the false equivalency gong show again??
And there were no darts thrown at wdw. They’re doing what they can...credit to them. But they don’t have mystical control. It’s a fantasy vacation compound...the real world is always backstage...and definitely across 535 and 192
...this isn’t gonna end well.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
There were people who got infected at WDW. It would be statistically impossible given the level of community spread for that not to be the case. Pixie dust doesn‘t magically protect you and they have a bunch of indoor dining locations open which we know are not ideal. Has there been a mass outbreak tied back to WDW? No, but that’s different than saying there are no cases.
On the subject of doing more, it’s a lot of tone from the top. Many states that resisted masks for months are now turning the corner and mandating them statewide. I’m not sure if that’s just because the big guy lost his election and they feel less pressure to be ”team players” or if they really have come around on the idea that masks help. Having indoor dining and bars open without restrictions is a big mistake IMHO. You have to be willing to adjust up and down based on circumstances. It’s foolish to say lock everything down (one extreme) or to say no restrictions (the other extreme). A good leader adjusts to the situation and anticipates a need. Cases in FL are clearly rising. Why wait until they hit 15,000+ a day to finally do something? The tone from the top also matters. Is the Governor publicly recommending people refrain from private parties and gatherings? Are there guidelines laid out for the upcoming holidays? I don’t really know the answers to those questions but it’s stuff like that which also matters. It’s not all about Lockdowns.
Patcheslee
Well-Known Member
From what I can read this graph is based on not even opening, at the same time a theoretical reopening with capacity limits was also studied.I posted and we discussed this study in Nature back a couple dozen pages:
The article linked is a decent summary, here’s the actual study itself:
Mobility network models of COVID-19 explain inequities and inform reopening - Nature
An epidemiological model that integrates fine-grained mobility networks illuminates mobility-related mechanisms that contribute to higher infection rates among disadvantaged socioeconomic and racial groups, and finds that restricting maximum occupancy at locations is especially effective for...
And here is a relevant graph from the study, ranking types of establishments by modeled risk of infection:
View attachment 513754
The study did not model Orlando among the handful of cities they looked at, I believe this graph is from Chicago data. There’s also not a ‘theme park / resort’ category, but I think it’s fair to make some associations from categories that have similar components of interaction.
This data is the closest science I’ve seen to suggest that WDW does in fact represent a higher risk environment, perhaps even with in place mitigation. Since we don’t have viable contact tracing and a WDW visit necessitates multiple accessory interactions, I don’t think you’re going to ever see any hard data pinning an outbreak to WDW specifically, outside of model studies like this. Perhaps the closest would be a documented cast member outbreak, which I’ve seen implied on social media but never verified by an official source.
So yeah, personally, I’m kind of just assuming based on what we now know about how the virus behaves. Is it possible to visit WDW without hitting higher risk venues like indoor dining? Sure. Are you at lower risk overall eating indoors at WDW compared to your neighborhood Applebee’s? Undoubtedly. But to me there’s a lot of common sense to the fact that a place with lots of people, from very geographically diverse sources, should now be recognized as a place of higher risk.
Actually, WDW has taken significant recent steps to combat heart disease by making sure healthy and vegetarian options exist at every dining outlet property-wide.
I believe you’re looking for the ‘Heart disease and WDW’ thread over on the dining forum.
Figgy1
Premium Member
They also do low fat, low salt, allergen free, and keto adjustments to menu items
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