A sequel? Nah, not this one

[lazyboy97o]

Several of the insiders on this site have been saying this for YEARS. That Epcot was a park held up by events and that there was no strategy that was seriously considered by management beyond this.

Fans who thought piecemeal changes like Frozen Ever After was going to substantially increase attendance were proven wrong. The park needed real investment, not IP redecoration.

The pandemic is not Disney's fault, but running Epcot into the ground was. Maddening given the park's potential and initial strong design.

Beyond Epcot, Disney was riding a global tourism bubble and lifestyle branding while patting themselves on the back for not listening to the dolts that work in the business. The bubble didn't deflate, it popped, and now they don't know what to do since they long ago fired those who held their institutional knowledge.

I don't think it started there. I do think they started to see how much it would cost once they gutted UoE though. That building needed help

Disney doesn't know what a reasonable budget is, and often still has to make cuts, but they do tend to stick with the ridiculous figure that was approved at the outset.

 

[erasure fan1]

This begs the question.
When do you price yourself out of the market

I guess we'll see. For a long time now Disney has had the mentality that there is no ceiling with prices. And for the most part, they've been right. Huge price increases equaling huge attendance and profit. I have to think that once things get back to normal, people are back in droves. I've been wondering when the tipping point would come for a long time. It hit me around 2015.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

For 1/4 of that, they probably could have just updated UoE.

Or build a new Journey into Imagination. But it helped kill the beer pong table, so that’s a plus.

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

Question for all of you more knowledgeable about economics than I am- if attendance is so low, why not open back up AP sales again? Even if it's just for FL residents. I'm back in Orlando and I would consider buying an AP, but that's not even possible at this point. I mean, they have a 2 day park pass for FL residents, right? I know APs don't spend as much cash on merch and food in the parks, and I certainly don't know Disney's marginal costs, but would it really cost them extra to have more APs? Like, if the park is already operating, and they're paying all the operational costs, the benefit from new APs (as low as it may be) seems like it would be higher than the cost. Of course, you have to take into account the virus and if you even want to be encouraging travel within the state (although it would seem they're already doing that with the tickets for FL residents).

Also, I was a 2020 CP, and a I know a lot of CPs ended up working at Seaworld for the time being. Why would they be hiring right now if things are so bad? And if I'm not mistaken, aren't there SW team members that are on furlough still? I'd greatly appreciate someone explaining that to me, because from a PR perspective, it doesn't look great to have your existing team members on furlough while hiring people for those same positions (of course they might be able to pay those new team members less, so...)

 

[wdwmagic]

The Guardians ride at Epcot cost $450 million. I am not messing with you all.

This is accurate, and it still boggles my mind having heard this a couple of years back. Would love to see a breakdown of exactly where that money went.

 

[wdwmagic]

if attendance is so low, why not open back up AP sales again

Because they don't feel comfortable (and rightly so) selling an AP with the current Disney Park Pass and no-hopping restrictions.

 

[The_Jobu]

This is accurate, and it still boggles my mind having heard this a couple of years back. Would love to see a breakdown of exactly where that money went.

How much does it cost to have Batista show up for 2 days green-screen work?

 

[Mac Tonight]

This is accurate, and it still boggles my mind having heard this a couple of years back. Would love to see a breakdown of exactly where that money went.

Is it reasonable to assume some of that budget would have gone to the actors/directors for any filmed scenes? Not that that would put a huge dent in 450, but it's something.

 

[Epcot82Guy]

Because they don't feel comfortable (and rightly so) selling an AP with the current Disney Park Pass and no-hopping restrictions.

I totally agree with that. But I'm shocked they aren't offering a lower tier offering to align to that. Both Universal and Sea World have. I get it could upset current passholders, but they are alienating a group and not really appealing to APs either. I'm especially surprised they haven't reopened Epcot After 4 passes. There seems to be no reason for that one.

 

[lazyboy97o]

This is accurate, and it still boggles my mind having heard this a couple of years back. Would love to see a breakdown of exactly where that money went.

Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Change Design, Start Again.
Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Too Expensive, Go Back to Original Design.

 

[Magicart87]

I totally agree with that. But I'm shocked they aren't offering a lower tier offering to align to that. Both Universal and Sea World have. I get it could upset current passholders, but they are alienating a group and not really appealing to APs either. I'm especially surprised they haven't reopened Epcot After 4 passes. There seems to be no reason for that one.

The thing is though, Disney doesn't "really" care about passholders and especially not offering an even greater discount on top of it. One can of course argue that it would bring people to the park but it's marginal/nominal at best. Mainly just not worth the hassle.

 

[Mac Tonight]

Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Change Design, Start Again.
Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Too Expensive, Go Back to Original Design.

Don't forget all the Starbucks to fuel those meetings.

 

[Epcot82Guy]

Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Change Design, Start Again.
Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Too Expensive, Go Back to Original Design.

That is so untrue and unfair. At least 30% of those were brand standards and integrity meetings. (Plus one meeting about how they can add a bar to the building.)

 

[JoeCamel]

Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Change Design, Start Again.
Review Meetings.
Micromanage Vendors.
Review Meeting Review Meetings.
Review Meeting Review Review Meetings.
Executive Review Meetings.
Study Building Actual Spaceship for Authenticity.
Executive Review Review Meeting.
Too Expensive, Go Back to Original Design.

Wasn't there an actual trip out to the galaxy for research? All in the name of immersion.....
That will dent the budget.

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

Because they don't feel comfortable (and rightly so) selling an AP with the current Disney Park Pass and no-hopping restrictions.

That's fair. Hopefully, once those restrictions lift, they'll start selling APs again.

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

That is so untrue and unfair. At least 30% of those were brand standards and integrity meetings. (Plus one meeting about how they can add a bar to the building.)

Don't forget the snack stand with a $10 cupcake and a limited edition Groot's head popcorn bucket (popcorn not included)

 

[Epcot82Guy]

The thing is though, Disney doesn't "really" care about passholders and especially not offering an even greater discount on top of it. One can of course argue that it would bring people to the park but it's marginal/nominal at best. Mainly just not worth the hassle.

While I understand the argument, I'm not sure I believe that data - especially since the data gathered has had the slant of downplaying APs. Numbers are numbers at some point, especially with what we're seeing. Obviously time will tell. But, there is no way around Sea World and Universal getting money from me on a weekly basis that Disney would otherwise be getting. And, those are empty slots in their parks - not slots being taken by someone else. So, it is lost revenue.

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

The thing is though, Disney doesn't "really" care about passholders and especially not offering an even greater discount on top of it. One can of course argue that it would bring people to the park but it's marginal/nominal at best. Mainly just not worth the hassle.

You would think right now, though, they'd want to be catering to APs. Yeah, they don't spend as much money in the parks as the people who visit once a year, but since those people aren't visiting right now, APs are the next best thing. An AP spending $2 on a popcorn refill is better than $0.

 

[spresso81]

This is accurate, and it still boggles my mind having heard this a couple of years back. Would love to see a breakdown of exactly where that money went.

I know the AK opened a bit over 20 years ago but it is insane to think that one ride (a ride that is set mainly in an unthemed box!!!) can cost more than 1/2 an entire theme park which is the largest by size.

Disney needs to clean house at WDI and other departments which allow such large cost overruns.

 

[Riverrafter21]

How much does it cost to have Batista show up for 2 days green-screen work?

Six figures and a shot at the heavyweight title