News Disney plans to include a black Santa Claus at Walt Disney World this year as the company continues its diversity and inclusion program

[castlecake2.0]

I love the people trying to cover their outdated thoughts with the guise of it not being fair to make santa not white unless they make him every other race.

 

[sullyinMT]

Thank you for clarifying, apologies for my assumption. I agree with that notion but I do think it could be confusing for kids who are taught to believe he is one, real person. I think removing him is better overall.

But why wouldn’t a simple “We don’t know what he looks like. Nobody’s ever see Santa, dear,” be sufficient?

 

[Dear Prudence]

Define Indian. Are we talking about an Indian as in the republic of India where there is a lot of Indian Diaspora or are we talking about Indigenous Americans?

Because if we are talking about the latter, 9 chances out of 10 some portrayer of Santa will claim they are 1/16th Cherokee or a popular one in Florida Blackfoot (but this is for other reasons) and not have any heritage linking to the Cherokee Nation, Keetoowah Band or Eastern Band.

Bonus fact 1: You need to be 1/4th and have documents directly linking you to someone of the Dawes Roll for to actually be able to sign up the Cherokee Nation, Keetoowah Band or Eastern Band.

Bonus Fact 2: Blackfoot tribes are people of the Northern Plains, Montana and Alberta, Canada. They were never part of the trail of tears so they during this time wouldn't be linked to the Cherokee, and given the prominence of this claim in the southern states. More specifically the ones of the confederacy, where one is proud of their confederate heritage, it was more so their ancestors covering up the African bloodline that is in their past.

Signed - An actual indigenous person.

Hi there, fellow Native/ Indigenous Person. Seconding this post.

 

[JohnD]

My only issue is it could be confusing for young kids who still believe in Santa. Many communities have a version of Santa in malls, etc. that are consistent with the Santas that kids are taught in their homes (that are consistent with their race). And they can go and visit those Santas at a time of their choosing. I think this is a unique issue because belief is a major component of this. I think Disney would be better off removing Santa altogether and give parents more control over their kids belief in Santa.

Black kids/parents face the problem all of America right now because we continue to promote white Santa.

Just tell the child if he can deliver presents to every child in the world from a sleigh driven by flying reindeer, he can change the complexion of his face.

 

[monothingie]

So first you criticize Disney for doing this as a "press release" and making a media spectacle out of this, and then say that what they should have done is do this with no fanfare if they want to be inclusive.




Then when people ask what PR spectacle, you go on about how everything is about clicks and views.


Then multiple people point out that this was not a press release and not announced by Disney, thereby doing the exact thing you suggested would be more inclusive.


Then you jump to the conclusion that, well, of there wasn't a press release, there will be!






Then Steve points out that he doesn't think there will be an announcement, thereby doing exactly what you originally suggested.


And so then instead of maybe admitting that you were wrong, and that maybe Disney is doing something good here, you go on to criticize them about floor tiles.

Seriously, can you ever give Disney credit for anything? They did exactly what you thought they should do, and you can't even compliment them on that. This is the perfect illustration that Disney can do absolutely no right in your eyes, which kind of gives your other criticisms less weight, and frankly gets a little tiring. Seriously, can you give Disney a real compliment, even just this once?

@wdwmagic knew enough to post this as news on this site and social media, which will undoubtedly be picked up by others because of this sites following and reputation for accuracy.

It is my thought, that based on the track record Disney has with making announcements that they will make it into a press release, which will be picked up by some in the media and generate controversy, just like it's apparently doing here and just the way it has anytime else when Disney has done anything involving social issues with their products and offerings. Let me be clear I'm not debating the merits of what they are doing. But if you feel that given their track record they won't seek to gain any sort of public relations boost on this in some manner, I disagree with you.

As you mentioned, I'm no fan of the current leadership in TWDC, and I'm not ashamed to say that. There hasn't been a lot to be proud of lately with how the parks have been handled.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

But why wouldn’t a simple “We don’t know what he looks like. Nobody’s ever see Santa, dear,” be sufficient?

Because when a child sees 2 different people that are both supposed to be the real Santa and they look wildly different, how is that possibly a sufficient response?

 

[mikejs78]

Not to burst your bubble but you do realize that a lot of people from history both fiction and nonfiction that are depicted as White were not actually White don't you? You don't really believe that Jesus was the only White dude around Jerusalem 2000 years ago do you?

If you have to have a conversation with your child because there's a Black Santa Claus it's probably because you need to have a conversation with your child.

Or, if you have to have a conversation with your child about this, perhaps you should take a long hard look at yourself.

Our current conceptualization of Santa came from a Coca Cola ad campaign that started in the 1920's.

Yup, even the 19th century Twas the Night before Christmas" had Santa as a tiny elf.

Santa wasn't based on St. Nicholas for appearance. The gift giving part was. The character being discussed here was a character that was created in Europe.

Things like this create more division than they do inclusion. I would fully support Disney coming up with a new character for a Christmas special who is Black or Hispanic and then including that character at WDW. That would be inclusive.

That's not accurate. The name Santa Claus itself is a corruption of the Dutch for St Nicholas. He wasn't a European invention, he was an evolution from St Nicholas. In fact, the character arrived in NY as St. Nicholas in the late 18th/early 19th century. The Santa Claus as we know it is a uniquely U.S. evolution that stemmed from the Dutch traditions around St. Nicholas. So, you're completely historically inaccurate.

 

[Gringrinngghost]

I love the people trying to cover their outdated thoughts with the guise of it not being fair to make santa not white unless they make him every other race.

Let's settle this!

 

[brb1006]

Well this is interesting news to wake up to this afternoon.

Going to keep my mouth shut on this topic since I can already predict this topic to get quickly heated. See you guys on the Q4 2021 Earnings Result Webcast later today.

 

[G00fyDad]

Or, if you have to have a conversation with your child about this, perhaps you should take a long hard look at yourself.

Those people do not want to look in the mirror.

 

[doctornick]

Not to burst your bubble but you do realize that a lot of people from history both fiction and nonfiction that are depicted as White were not actually White don't you? You don't really believe that Jesus was the only White dude around Jerusalem 2000 years ago do you?

(getting completely off topic....)

It's funny because the term "white" (or "Caucasian") seems to have changed significantly over the years. When I was younger, I found the term often used to describe and include people from the Middle East and North Africa but now they are firmly in a non-white "brown" category. In fact, Caucasian refers to the Caucasus mountains and the Armenians, Georgians, Azerbaijani, etc people who live there aren't exact lily white Europeans.

Regardless, more specific to this topic, historical St. Nicholas was of Greek decent. And most people (I think) would consider "Greeks" to be "White" even if they tend to be darker/olive skin, dark hair and eyes, etc. than northern European. Which is more a reflection about how imprecise and stupid classifying anyone by "race" really is.

 

[mikejs78]

@wdwmagic knew enough to post this as news on this site and social media, which will undoubtedly be picked up by others because of this sites following and reputation for accuracy.

It is my thought, that based on the track record Disney has with making announcements that they will make it into a press release, which will be picked up by some in the media and generate controversy, just like it's apparently doing here and just the way it has anytime else Disney has done involving social issues with their products and offerings. Let me be clear I'm not debating the merits of what they are doing. But if you feel that given their track record they won't seek to gain any sort of public relations boost on this in some manner, I disagree with you.

As you mentioned, I'm no fan of the current leadership in TWDC, and I'm not ashamed to say that. There hasn't been a lot to be proud of lately with how the parks have been handled.

I'm saying that it is rather ridiculous to criticize them for what they might do. If they actually market this, feel free to criticize them. But criticizing them for what they might do snacks of just criticism for criticism's sake.

Also, Steve gets info from many sources, not just PR. So now your saying Steve is doing stuff just for clicks?

 

[DisneyDreamer08]

Our kids meet Santa every year, usually at the mall, and at Christmas we line the pictures up on our mantle. Clearly, the Santas are all different men. We have told our kids from the start that Santa is far too busy to visit every mall and Christmas event in the world so he sends out helper Santas. But, you never know if you’re meeting the real Santa or a helper Santa so it’s always important to be polite, happy and kind. They’ve literally never questioned it

 

[Gringrinngghost]

Because when a child sees 2 different people that are both supposed to be the real Santa and they look wildly different, how is that possibly a sufficient response?

That Santa is magical and thusly would have the power to alter the appearance of himself.

Hell Disney taught me that.

 

[mikejs78]

Which was based on the description in ‘Twas the Night Before Christmas printed about 100 years earlier.

The night before Christmas portrayed Santa as a tiny elf.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Our current conceptualization of Santa came from a Coca Cola ad campaign that started in the 1920's.

I'm asking this sincerely. Should Mickey Mouse be redesigned with a darker skin tone? If not, why not?

Mickey Mouse has only been around since 1928, and he's only been in color since 1935. "White Mickey" has even less history behind him than "White Santa".

(I'm including myself in this. I have no problem with a Black man playing Santa, but if they reanimated Mickey, it would really bother me. But I can't explain why.)

 

[brb1006]

No one complained when they had a Mouse dressed up as Santa.
View attachment 599796

What about Santa Goofy?

 

[sullyinMT]

I love the people trying to cover their outdated thoughts with the guise of it not being fair to make santa not white unless they make him every other race.

Trying to reconcile the past, or what could be seen as an outdated tradition, with new ideas on how to make it better, isn’t covering anything. Some of the posters here and what has been a growing trend elsewhere in the US to depict Santa in different ways might do or say messy things, but that doesn’t equate to thinly veiled erm, “nostalgia.”

 

[Disney Glimpses]

Our kids meet Santa every year, usually at the mall, and at Christmas we line the pictures up on our mantle. Clearly, the Santas are all different men. We have told our kids from the start that Santa is far too busy to visit every mall and Christmas event in the world so he sends out helper Santas. But, you never know if you’re meeting the real Santa or a helper Santa so it’s always important to be polite, happy and kind. They’ve literally never questioned it

Good idea

 

[sullyinMT]

Because when a child sees 2 different people that are both supposed to be the real Santa and they look wildly different, how is that possibly a sufficient response?

The same way they might see live nativities, artwork, etc, depicting the real image of Jesus.