Cash-Strapped Disney

WDW Pro

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Read: SeaWorld clientele

Just know I'm not saying that because I view people as being more or less respectable based on their income. I also have wanted Disney to find better ways to give families in lower socioeconomic status an opportunity to enjoy the parks. But if you lower costs too much right now, you run the risk of bringing in people who view the chance of being removed for poor behavior as not such a big deal.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
Of course they could have a “coupon day” where all those people could enter.

Also only in Florida is Sea World considered the budget option. You are all spoiled, if I was to compare theme park chains to stores:

Disney/Universal=Designer Store brands (Versachi, Kate Spade, Coach)
Sea World=Macy’s, kind of high class
Cedar Fair=Target, it’s basic, fine respectable, does what it does well but the best thing about it is that it’s not....
Six Flags: Walmart. Oh the sights you see...

Bonus one:
Hershunds: Bass Pro Shop, you go there for a specific experience and feel, it may not be “classy” but those big stores (Dollywood & Silver Dollar City) are fun and wholesome
 
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Mrtko

Member
Just as a silly game, I wanted to look at what Disney Q3 20 might look at to see what WDW PRO is talking about when he says they are cash strapped. I have no inside information so I am going to make numbers up just to see how bad things might be. When looking at financial reports, the key figure is cash. When a company begins running out of cash, they get desperate. GE got desperate in this way and sold Universal Parks (and all of NBC) to Comcast at a discount. Let's see where Disney might land this quarter.

Revenues:

Media Networks - Received $7,257M in Q2. This is ABC plus the Cable channels like ESPN. Let's say with lower advertising, they report down by ($1B) to $6,257M. Still making lots of money. I don't know if that is real, but let's pretend.

Parks, Experiences and Products - Received $5,543M in Q2. This is attendance at the parks, cruise lines, adventures, and character licensing. Here is where the virus hit hard. With all parks closed, let's say they are down $4B to $1,543M Revenue. Maybe all of it is gone, I don't know, but we will say $4B down.

Studio Entertainment - Received $2,539M in Q2. This is primarily the movies and Q2 included Frozen II and SW-ROS, both big movies. There is nothing in Q3 except ONWARD that I am aware of. Let's say they are down ($2B) to $539M.

Direct to Consumer - Received $4,123M in Q2. This is HULU, DISNEY+ and ESPN+. Let's say things went really good and DISNEY+ is doing great. Let's add $1B new revenue for Q3, making it $5,123M. I doubt they went backward.

So in our game, Q2 reported $18,009M in revenue. In Q3 we imagine they are reporting $12,009M, down $6B. Ouch.

Operating Income. Revenue minus the cost of generating the product. Negative Operating Income means tap the cash reserves.

Media Networks - After expenses they made $2,375M in Q2. I don't know if they reduced cost by Q3 so let's say they ate the entire $1B drop in revenue. Q3 Operating Income will be $1,375M. Well it still looks positive.

Parks, Experience and Products - After expenses they made $639M in Q2. Parks are expensive. They did take measures to control cost but things still had to happen. With a $4B loss in revenue (in our silly game) let's say they could only halt $1B in cost. So Q3 Operating Income will be down $3B to ($2,361M)

Studio Entertainment - After expenses they made $466M in Q2. Let's say of the $2B in lost revenue they ate $1B of it and stopped spending of $1B. So Q3 Studio and Entertainment Operating Income will be ($544M). Maybe.

Direct to Consumer - After expenses they reported a loss of ($812M) in Q2. The cost of rolling out Disney+ was a lot. Let's pretend with their extra $1B in revenue, they actually break even. I doubt it but it's just a game. No operating income or loss here.

So Disney may say Q3 Operating Income will be ($1,800M) loss. Disney business segments will lose almost $2B after expenses.

Effect on Cash

After the ($1.8B) loss in operating income, they have to pay interest on loans ($500M) and they were sinking $2.0B into Capital Expenditures for the park expansion and $300M into technology for Disney+. This was for the entire 6 month. So let's say they had to throw another $1B into capital expenditures overall in Q3. That means the hit to cash will be somewhere around ($3.3B) in Q3. Disney had $14B in cash at the end of Q2. So in our game, Disney will still have a bit over $10B in cash after Q3.

I don't know what the real numbers will look like but I don't see Disney considering selling assets or taking desperate moves to hold it together. Now if they run like this for nine more months then Katie bar the door, they are circling the drain. When we see Q3 real numbers, it will be fun for me to see what they look like. I am sure WDW PRO has a sense of it but Disney looks strong enough to hang on for awhile. What major item am I overlooking?
 
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_caleb

Well-Known Member
Hotel was FY17 blue sky funding ... aka well after SWL construction started.

Thanks for the snark, maybe stay in your lane next time.
I wasn’t trying to be snarky! I was just assuming you weren’t actually a new member since you seemed to using a burner account to correct @WDW Pro. Sorry it came across that way.

You came in and said, “it didn’t happen that way“ but didn’t provide an alternative account. I asked for you to give your side of the story. You did. Thanks.

What is my lane?
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
What is my lane?
1594793336869.png
 

londwar

New Member
Oh, one thing I forgot to mention:

This whole Splash Mountain thing was torpedoed by Tokyo. Disney wanted to get completely away from Song of the South, but OLC essentially told them to pound sand. That meant they're stuck spending enormous money just to match the current quality, and simultaneously NOT getting away from Song of the South. So the only gain they get is Tiana might sell better in the souvenir shop.
Just out of curiosity, did they really have this idea well in hand before they made the announcement, or do you feel someone had a concept and announced it because Disney needed to virtue signal to the world? To me, the timing of the announcement just seemed very strange, specifically because of all the unrest going on. Probably just me.
 

rle4lunch

Well-Known Member
Just know I'm not saying that because I view people as being more or less respectable based on their income. I also have wanted Disney to find better ways to give families in lower socioeconomic status an opportunity to enjoy the parks. But if you lower costs too much right now, you run the risk of bringing in people who view the chance of being removed for poor behavior as not such a big deal.

Completely agree.
 

rle4lunch

Well-Known Member
Of course they could have a “coupon day” where all those people could enter.

Also only in Florida is Sea World considered the budget option. You are all spoiled, if I was to compare theme park chains to stores:

Disney/Universal=Designer Store brands (Versachi, Kate Spade, Coach)
Sea World=Macy’s, kind of high class
Cedar Fair=Target, it’s basic, fine respectable, does what it does well but the best thing about it is that it’s not....
Six Flags: Walmart. Oh the sights you see...

Bonus one:
Hershunds: Bass Pro Shop, you go there for a specific experience and feel, it may not be “classy” but those big stores (Dollywood & Silver Dollar City) are fun and wholesome

Okay okay. READ: Busch Gardens? Lol. Or Greater Wynnewood Exotic Animal Park?
 

CastAStone

5th gate? Just build a new resort Bob.
Premium Member
Of course they could have a “coupon day” where all those people could enter.

Also only in Florida is Sea World considered the budget option. You are all spoiled, if I was to compare theme park chains to stores:

Disney/Universal=Designer Store brands (Versachi, Kate Spade, Coach)
Sea World=Macy’s, kind of high class
Cedar Fair=Target, it’s basic, fine respectable, does what it does well but the best thing about it is that it’s not....
Six Flags: Walmart. Oh the sights you see...

Bonus one:
Hershunds: Bass Pro Shop, you go there for a specific experience and feel, it may not be “classy” but those big stores (Dollywood & Silver Dollar City) are fun and wholesome
Cedar Fair is more like a specialty retailer (Patagonia?) than a Target - if you love unthemed thrill rides they at phenomenal at that. If you want kids stuff or a multi-faceted experience you should probably go somewhere else.
 

WDW Pro

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Just as a silly game, I wanted to look at what Disney Q3 20 might look at to see what WDW PRO is talking about when he says they are cash strapped. I have no inside information so I am going to make numbers up just to see how bad things might be. When looking at financial reports, they key figure is cash. When a company begins running out of cash, they get desperate. GE got desperate in this way and sold Universal Parks (and all of NBC) to Comcast at a discount. Let's see where Disney might land this quarter.

Revenues:

Media Networks - Received $7,257M in Q2. This is ABC plus the Cable channels like ESPN. Let's say with lower advertising, they report down by ($1B) to $6,257M. Still making lots of money. I don't know if that is real, but let's pretend.

Parks, Experiences and Products - Received $5,543M in Q2. This is attendance at the parks, cruise lines, adventures, and character licensing. Here is where the virus hit hard. With all parks closed, let's say they are down $4B to $1,543M Revenue. Maybe all of it is gone, I don't know, but we will say $4B down.

Studio Entertainment - Received $2,539M in Q2. This is primarily the movies and Q2 included Frozen II and SW-ROS, both big movies. There is nothing in Q3 except ONWARD that I am aware of. Let's say they are down ($2B) to $539M.

Direct to Consumer - Received $4,123M in Q2. This is HULU, DISNEY+ and ESPN+. Let's say things went really good and DISNEY+ is doing great. Let's add $1B new revenue for Q3, making it $5,123M. I doubt they went backward.

So in our game, Q2 reported $18,009M in revenue. In Q3 we imagine they are reporting $12,009M, down $6B. Ouch.

Operating Income. Revenue minus the cost of generating the product. Negative Operating Income means tap the cash reserves.

Media Networks - After expenses they made $2,375M in Q2. I don't know if they reduced cost by Q3 so let's say they ate the entire $1B drop in revenue. Q3 Operating Income will be $1,375M. Well it still looks positive.

Parks, Experience and Products - After expenses they made $639M in Q2. Parks are expensive. They did take measures to control cost but things still had to happen. With a $4B loss in revenue (in our silly game) let's say they could only halt $1B in cost. So Q3 Operating Income will be down $3B to ($2,361M)

Studio Entertainment - After expenses they made $466M in Q2. Let's say of the $2B in lost revenue they ate $1B of it and stopped spending of $1B. So Q3 Studio and Entertainment Operating Income will be ($544M). Maybe.

Direct to Consumer - After expenses they reported a loss of ($812M) in Q2. The cost of rolling out Disney+ was a lot. Let's pretend with their extra $1B in revenue, they actually break even. I doubt it but it's just a game. No operating income or loss here.

So Disney may say Q3 Operating Income will be ($1,800M) loss. Disney business segments will lose almost $2B after expenses.

Effect on Cash

After the ($1.8B) loss in operating income, they have to pay interest on loans ($500M) and they were sinking $2.0B into Capital Expenditures for the park expansion and $300M into technology for Disney+. This was for the entire 6 month. So let's say they had to throw another $1B into capital expenditures overall in Q3. That means the hit to cash will be somewhere around ($3.3B) in Q3. Disney had $14B in cash at the end of Q2. So in our game, Disney will still have a bit over $10B in cash after Q3.

I don't know what the real numbers will look like but I don't see Disney considering selling assets or taking desperate moves to hold it together. Now if they run like this for nine more months then Katie bar the door, they are circling the drain. When we see Q3 real numbers, it will be fun for me to see what they look like. I am sure WDW PRO has a sense of it but Disney looks strong enough to hang on for awhile. What major item am I overlooking?

The issue is that so much of their operation runs out of California, which doesn't appear to be getting better. So I appreciate how well you did with all of this, but 9.2b is what I'm hearing from the inside for remaining Q3 reserves. Now, 9.2b is fine, but let's play out a possible scenario: let's say this situation as we are in today continues through the month of September. Let's say stockholders start getting very nervous. That's why they will do whatever it takes to keep WDW up and running (16-20% of all profit). It's because there is a foreseeable future where film is still sidelined, merch is not selling, cruises are docked, and all you've got is TV (which is way down), streaming, and Disney World. The converse is possible but it isn't guaranteed. And let's keep in mind the massive capex expenditures they have to finish at WDW which eat into that 9.2b, especially if parks operate at a loss short term.
 

WDW Pro

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Just out of curiosity, did they really have this idea well in hand before they made the announcement, or do you feel someone had a concept and announced it because Disney needed to virtue signal to the world? To me, the timing of the announcement just seemed very strange, specifically because of all the unrest going on. Probably just me.

They needed to prevent any opportunity for boycotts against Disney+.
 

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