News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Okay. Waiting to see how that will work with regular session right around the corner starting March 7 then for 60 days.
It was mentioned above, and I have no idea if it's true, nor the time to determine if it's true, BUT...

A special session does away with certain regular order rules, like debate, which allows laws to be more easily railroaded... oops, I mean, which allows laws to be responded to more quickly in emergency situations.

So, it's not the timing of the session, but what the kind of session allows to happen.

In this clearly very emergency situation.

I think.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
It was mentioned above, and I have no idea if it's true, nor the time to determine if it's true, BUT...

A special session does away with certain regular order rules, like debate, which allows laws to be more easily railroaded... oops, I mean, which allows laws to be responded to more quickly in emergency situations.

So, it's not the timing of the session, but what the kind of session allows to happen.

In this clearly very emergency situation.

I think.
It’s absolutely an emergency…I mean…this has run fine since 1967…

Gotta “nip it in the bud” now
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
It was mentioned above, and I have no idea if it's true, nor the time to determine if it's true, BUT...

A special session does away with certain regular order rules, like debate, which allows laws to be more easily railroaded... oops, I mean, which allows laws to be responded to more quickly in emergency situations.

So, it's not the timing of the session, but what the kind of session allows to happen.

In this clearly very emergency situation.

I think.
Technically speaking they passed the original bill to dissolve RCID without any real plan and it goes into effect in June so we are fast approaching an emergency situation. It’s a self made emergency but they do actually need to do something before June. I agree 100% on the special session point. This is clearly being done to hide the true plan until it’s been adopted. If they allowed actual debate and discussion the first time around maybe they wouldn’t need to undo the last knee jerk reaction. History repeating itself.
 
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MR.Dis

Well-Known Member
Well it seems I have brought out a lot of IRE. Let's go back to what I originally posted. The Reedy Creek District will NOT be desolved. Instead the Special Session will pass legislation to change the management of the District. Instead of Disney appointing the 5 person board it will be the Governor. There will be No disruption in any of the other counties or municipalities, just business as usual. All debts stay with the District with Disney still being responsible for paying them. The sky will not fall, the world will not come to an end. The rest is my opinion in that Disney will accept the new arrangement and will not fight it. Instead they will adapt and learn to work with the new board. In my opinion at least one of the board members will be a local resident (i.e. a Disney employee). That is it. If anyone wants to argue if this is right or wrong, that is a separate argument. If someone believes Disney should lawyer up and fight this, we can agree to disagree. While the change was spurred by that school bill, the truth is that both parties have been talking about ending Disney's complete governance of the District for several years. If this governor had not taken action, IN MY Opinion, it would have happened eventually anyway.
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Well it seems I have brought out a lot of IRE. Let's go back to what I originally posted. The Reedy Creek District will NOT be desolved. Instead the Special Session will pass legislation to change the management of the District. Instead of Disney appointing the 5 person board it will be the Governor. There will be No disruption in any of the other counties or municipalities, just business as usual. All debts stay with the District with Disney still being responsible for paying them. The sky will not fall, the world will not come to an end. The rest is my opinion in that Disney will accept the new arrangement and will not fight it. Instead they will adapt and learn to work with the new board. In my opinion at least one of the board members will be a local resident (i.e. a Disney employee). That is it. If anyone wants to argue if this is right or wrong, that is a separate argument. If someone believes Disney should lawyer up and fight this, we can agree to disagree. While the change was spurred by that school bill, the truth is that both parties have been talking about ending Disney's complete governance of the District for several years. If this governor had not taken action, IN MY Opinion, it would have happened eventually anyway.
Your confidence in the Florida legislature will be your undoing. -Palpatine
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
the truth is that both parties have been talking about ending Disney's complete governance of the District for several years.
The truth is that while those talks have happened, both parties have come to the conclusion time and time again that the district was benefiting the state, was operating legally as intended, and would be nearly impossible to modify in a way that would be beneficial for the state and its tax payers. That is… until this current administration.
 

networkpro

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
That’s truly sad in the boring somewhat tasteless cuisine of Central Florida when Tiger eats some of his meals at Dennys

Blame a lot of the transplants. Markets adjust to meet the tastes and demands of the consumers. As others have pointed out quite well, outside of the usual tourist environs there is plenty of great food with flavor, but it might not fit the sensibilities of people from other regions.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Well it seems I have brought out a lot of IRE. Let's go back to what I originally posted. The Reedy Creek District will NOT be desolved. Instead the Special Session will pass legislation to change the management of the District. Instead of Disney appointing the 5 person board it will be the Governor. There will be No disruption in any of the other counties or municipalities, just business as usual. All debts stay with the District with Disney still being responsible for paying them. The sky will not fall, the world will not come to an end. The rest is my opinion in that Disney will accept the new arrangement and will not fight it. Instead they will adapt and learn to work with the new board. In my opinion at least one of the board members will be a local resident (i.e. a Disney employee). That is it. If anyone wants to argue if this is right or wrong, that is a separate argument. If someone believes Disney should lawyer up and fight this, we can agree to disagree. While the change was spurred by that school bill, the truth is that both parties have been talking about ending Disney's complete governance of the District for several years. If this governor had not taken action, IN MY Opinion, it would have happened eventually anyway.
Where were there posts talking about the sky falling or the world ending? TWDC doesn’t really need RCID anymore but that’s really not the point.

I have no problem having a serious discussion about this situation but the narrative that this was somehow “the plan” all along is simply false. If we cannot agree that this was done by the Governor as retaliation and a punish against Disney for opposing him then there’s no point continuing the discussion. It’s easy enough to find numerous public comments from the Governor and others involved confirming this. If this was the plan all along then why the special session? Why a bill passed without discussion or debate and without a plan? If this is part of a larger plan why not look at all special districts in the state? Why not the Villages? I think we all know the answer. So my point is we can discuss the merits of this move, we can discuss the legality of it, but it’s hard to try to have a serious discussion if we cannot all admit this is politically driven.
 

MR.Dis

Well-Known Member
Where were there posts talking about the sky falling or the world ending? TWDC doesn’t really need RCID anymore but that’s really not the point.

I have no problem having a serious discussion about this situation but the narrative that this was somehow “the plan” all along is simply false. If we cannot agree that this was done by the Governor as retaliation and a punish against Disney for opposing him then there’s no point continuing the discussion. It’s easy enough to find numerous public comments from the Governor and others involved confirming this. If this was the plan all along then why the special session? Why a bill passed without discussion or debate and without a plan? If this is part of a larger plan why not look at all special districts in the state? Why not the Villages? I think we all know the answer. So my point is we can discuss the merits of this move, we can discuss the legality of it, but it’s hard to try to have a serious discussion if we cannot all admit this is politically driven.
I NEVER claimed otherwise.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
No resident of Florida is being denied their rights to vote in a general election.

RCID’s original charter was founded under the charter of “one acre, one vote”. Rich landowners receive disproportionate power. This is the antithesis of democracy.

If anyone was disinfranchised, it was the smaller landowners within RCID.
The District’s voting structure is not unique and not the issue. That system is not being undone across the state. There were no smaller landowners within the area of the District when it was created.
 

JohnD

Well-Known Member
It was mentioned above, and I have no idea if it's true, nor the time to determine if it's true, BUT...

A special session does away with certain regular order rules, like debate, which allows laws to be more easily railroaded... oops, I mean, which allows laws to be responded to more quickly in emergency situations.

So, it's not the timing of the session, but what the kind of session allows to happen.

In this clearly very emergency situation.

I think.
Everything I've heard on the news is about a regular session bill. I'm leaving Epcot now. Continue discussion...
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Transfer of powers. — By law or by resolution of the governing bodies of each of the governments affected, any function or power of a county, municipality or special district may be transferred to or contracted to be performed by another county, municipality or special district, after approval by vote of the electors of the transferor and approval by vote of the electors of the transferee, or as otherwise provided by law.​
This is where the whole case would be decided. The constitution clearly lays out how transfer of power should work. It requires approval by vote of the electors. That seems black and white and clearly in this case the electors would vote no and the transfer proposal would fail. They leave that “as otherwise provided by law“ clause in there which could open a door for something unintentional to slip through but that would have to apply across the board broadly. In other words the as otherwise provided by law cannot be a bill that says this applies just to RCID. So if a judge rules that clause allows a transfer to occur without approval of the electors it opens a broad ranging can of worms. The powers of the government of Miami for example could be shifted to another municipality by simple majority vote of the legislature. Never the intention of that clause in the constitution and I think it would have a slim chance of working. Probably why the plan shifted from creating a new district to amending the existing one.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
I don't believe the Florida constitution explicitly addresses dissolution of a special district.
My questions wasn't about the dissolution. I'm sure you're correct that the dissolution of RCID is possible. That it was retaliation creates other issues, but ignoring that, I would assume it's very possible.

My question was about the statement the governor is replacing the elected board with state appointees of the existing district. This was the proposed plan suggested. Which also side steps any questions around creating a new district. Presumably, with this new plan replacing the prior passed legislation. It's all just a guess until it pass of course.

Transfer of powers. — By law or by resolution of the governing bodies of each of the governments affected, any function or power of a county, municipality or special district may be transferred to or contracted to be performed by another county, municipality or special district, after approval by vote of the electors of the transferor and approval by vote of the electors of the transferee, or as otherwise provided by law.​
If we're using that as justification that the state legislature can simply vote to replace the governing body of any other governing body that's within the state. Then, it follows that the same would apply to the mayors of Miami or Orange County. The assumption that there is nothing else that makes this not possible would also be what allows this to set precedent that it's completely possible. When the state decides to take control of Miami or Orange county or whomever later, the takeover of RCID would be the precedent. If that sounds absurd, then it's just as absurd that it'll work for RCID.
 
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GoofGoof

Premium Member
If we're using that as justification that the state legislature can simply vote to replace the governing body of any other governing body that's within the state. Then, it follows that the same would apply to the mayors of Miami or Orange County. The assumption that there is nothing else that makes this not possible would also be what allows this to set precedent that it's completely possible. When the state decides to take control of Miami or Orange county or whomever later, the takeover of RCID would be the precedent. If that sounds absurd, then it's just as absurd that it'll work for RCID.

One would assume there's plenty of examples of Miami or Orange County being to woke, hence requiring takeover by the state.
It does not sound absurd at all. Remember there was a desire during Covid to stop local governments from acting to protect their citizens. There is certainly a desire to limit or eliminate the powers of local governments and centralize power from the current administration. There are real consequences of these actions. Maybe people support this guy now, but keep in mind when “the other side” gets power they will have the same rules to play by. Better to keep checks and balances for everyone.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
This aspect of any future lawsuit seems clear. Together, the legislature and governor have the legal authority to do what they have already done and are about to do.

The real question is whether they are violating some other section of the U.S. or Florida Constitution

This is the problem with your argument - you're caveating the actual conflict everyone is actually trying to point out.

No one is contesting the state has the power to legislate state laws (the tired 'the state did it, they can undo it') - but just because you have a power to do something doesn't make that power unilateral or above other constraints. The issue is layered because the powers granted allowed the birth of other constraints coming into play and because the kind of changes being discussed. "otherwise provided by law" doesn't create a override over any conflicts, it leaves an opening for another avenue to be created without having to rewrite that passage. That doesn't mean the new method is all-powerful.

The state laws are limited by the constitution, which has already been pointed out that has very relevant topics in play here..

So yes.. when you say "well it all can be done" (paraphrasing) defacto but caveat with "unless it really can't be done" (paraphrasing)... It makes the entire reference pretty pointless. It's like harping on "well the state are the ones who make state laws!" -- yeah.. but pointless to the actual debate.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
It does not sound absurd at all. [...] There is certainly a desire to limit or eliminate the powers of local governments and centralize power from the current administration.
I didn't mean it was absurd that the current governor would want to centralize and eliminate local governments. I meant that the ability to do that without any agreement by those governed by those local governments sounds absurd.
 
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