The Frozen 'Initiative' ...

phillip sugarman

Well-Known Member
My guess is that Disney goes the cheap route and rethemes Goofy Sky School into a new Frozen ride. Unless they want it to be a boat ride like Maelstrom, than they could just add a Frozen theme on to Grizzly River Run. It's not like Grizzly River Run is actually themed to anything.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
My guess is that Disney goes the cheap route and rethemes Goofy Sky School into a new Frozen ride. Unless they want it to be a boat ride like Maelstrom, than they could just add a Frozen theme on to Grizzly River Run. It's not like Grizzly River Run is actually themed to anything.
Grizzly River Run is not themed to anything? Is that a serious comment?
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Just some added info I didn't have time for earlier:

This 'initiative' is very late and very thrown together. It speaks to Disney not having faith in its product to begin with. Frozen may well be the highest grossing animated picture of all-time, but in no way, shape or form did Disney ever have faith (other than maybe its creators in their dreams) that this would be much more successful than Princess Tangled was.

I so wish that I could drop an anecdote about someone VERY high up's reaction to the film just a little over a month prior to release, but I'd likely be a real Spirit if I did. But understand this: Disney and its leadership didn't have the faith in this and it is nothing new. The only films they feel can't miss today have Marvel in front of them.

This isn't Michael Eisner's Disney that at the very least staged lavish parades and shows and, sometimes, real attractions that debuted along with the films throughout the 90s.

I almost decided to 'conceal, don't reveal' this whole thing because what I'd most like to write about is what I can't write about (at least for the foreseeable future).

More details:

Both DCA and HKDL (and looks like DLP can be added now thanks to a kind source) will be getting temporary attractions that will very likely be there for years. And I use the word 'attraction' very liberally here. Think meet-and-greet-and-gropes and singalongs and things of that nature. They will not be replacing anything right now, just utilizing existing and or new real estate.

Frozen will NOT be replacing Aladdin in the short term, especially with Robin Williams' passing, but could very well wind up in the Hyperion down the road AND at whatever you want to call the Studios park at WDW (Tangled was supposed to replace Beauty and the Beast, but it took so long to move thru approval that it won't happen now.)

None of this affects Maelstrom, which is in its final full month of operation now.

If I could armchair Imagineer a bit (something I generally despise because it always seems to be stuff of fifth gates or moving attractions from park to park ... Small World to EPCOT anyone?), I can't fathom a more perfect major addition to MK than Frozen. A park that lacks capacity and (unlike other WDW gates) actually needs more every day. A park that has been denuded over the last 15 years and feels like a concrete wasteland. A park where the IP would fit perfectly.

Just imagine a giant show building way yonder in Fantasyland. One that looks like an ice palace. Inside, multiple rides (think what was done with Mermaid Lagoon in TDS) ... a few cheap carnie types ... you know like Sven's Special Sleds ... one E-Ticket type attraction ... a QSR ... a shop or two ... all with ICE Cold AC in a perpetual twilight sky. Again, if I can spitball this all in 10 minutes, then why can't WDI's talent come up with better and why can't Iger, Staggs, Rasulo, Crofton and Co see the big picture here?

Nope. It's all going to be a rush job (again, except likely Tokyo and, if they decide on it, Shanghai) because they never had faith in this film ... and they don't have faith in any IP they put out these days that doesn't have Marvel on it. And we all know just how little Disney can do with Marvel at WDW. (And at the rate they are going, Disney will build Marvel stuff elsewhere just about the time people are tired of the IP).

Hope that helps explain the news and puts into perspective stuff you'll be hearing in the near future.
 

Stevek

Well-Known Member
Just some added info I didn't have time for earlier:

This 'initiative' is very late and very thrown together. It speaks to Disney not having faith in its product to begin with. Frozen may well be the highest grossing animated picture of all-time, but in no way, shape or form did Disney ever have faith (other than maybe its creators in their dreams) that this would be much more successful than Princess Tangled was.

I so wish that I could drop an anecdote about someone VERY high up's reaction to the film just a little over a month prior to release, but I'd likely be a real Spirit if I did. But understand this: Disney and its leadership didn't have the faith in this and it is nothing new. The only films they feel can't miss today have Marvel in front of them.

This isn't Michael Eisner's Disney that at the very least staged lavish parades and shows and, sometimes, real attractions that debuted along with the films throughout the 90s.

I almost decided to 'conceal, don't reveal' this whole thing because what I'd most like to write about is what I can't write about (at least for the foreseeable future).

More details:

Both DCA and HKDL (and looks like DLP can be added now thanks to a kind source) will be getting temporary attractions that will very likely be there for years. And I use the word 'attraction' very liberally here. Think meet-and-greet-and-gropes and singalongs and things of that nature. They will not be replacing anything right now, just utilizing existing and or new real estate.

Frozen will NOT be replacing Aladdin in the short term, especially with Robin Williams' passing, but could very well wind up in the Hyperion down the road AND at whatever you want to call the Studios park at WDW (Tangled was supposed to replace Beauty and the Beast, but it took so long to move thru approval that it won't happen now.)

None of this affects Maelstrom, which is in its final full month of operation now.

If I could armchair Imagineer a bit (something I generally despise because it always seems to be stuff of fifth gates or moving attractions from park to park ... Small World to EPCOT anyone?), I can't fathom a more perfect major addition to MK than Frozen. A park that lacks capacity and (unlike other WDW gates) actually needs more every day. A park that has been denuded over the last 15 years and feels like a concrete wasteland. A park where the IP would fit perfectly.

Just imagine a giant show building way yonder in Fantasyland. One that looks like an ice palace. Inside, multiple rides (think what was done with Mermaid Lagoon in TDS) ... a few cheap carnie types ... you know like Sven's Special Sleds ... one E-Ticket type attraction ... a QSR ... a shop or two ... all with ICE Cold AC in a perpetual twilight sky. Again, if I can spitball this all in 10 minutes, then why can't WDI's talent come up with better and why can't Iger, Staggs, Rasulo, Crofton and Co see the big picture here?

Nope. It's all going to be a rush job (again, except likely Tokyo and, if they decide on it, Shanghai) because they never had faith in this film ... and they don't have faith in any IP they put out these days that doesn't have Marvel on it. And we all know just how little Disney can do with Marvel at WDW. (And at the rate they are going, Disney will build Marvel stuff elsewhere just about the time people are tired of the IP).

Hope that helps explain the news and puts into perspective stuff you'll be hearing in the near future.

So you're saying it's not "Soarin over Not Quite Norway?" Dang, my sources suck. You'd think bribing a tram driver with churros would pay off nowdays.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Once I saw the pics of Tom Staggs, Bruce V, and a bus full of execs being toured around the DHS offerings I could see this one coming.

Question is, will it still be relevant?

I think so.

I think folks get caught up in that line of thinking with IP (SW, Potter, Avatar ...)

Disney just opened a ride at the MK based on a film that was released before World War II.

I am not in love with Frozen like the fanbois, but it is quality (not that it matters ... see Avatar) and has hit on the cultural zeitgeist across generations. I've called it this generation's Lion King and I believe that.
 

Magenta Panther

Well-Known Member
Just some added info I didn't have time for earlier:

This 'initiative' is very late and very thrown together. It speaks to Disney not having faith in its product to begin with. Frozen may well be the highest grossing animated picture of all-time, but in no way, shape or form did Disney ever have faith (other than maybe its creators in their dreams) that this would be much more successful than Princess Tangled was.

I so wish that I could drop an anecdote about someone VERY high up's reaction to the film just a little over a month prior to release, but I'd likely be a real Spirit if I did. But understand this: Disney and its leadership didn't have the faith in this and it is nothing new. The only films they feel can't miss today have Marvel in front of them.

This isn't Michael Eisner's Disney that at the very least staged lavish parades and shows and, sometimes, real attractions that debuted along with the films throughout the 90s.

I almost decided to 'conceal, don't reveal' this whole thing because what I'd most like to write about is what I can't write about (at least for the foreseeable future).

More details:

Both DCA and HKDL (and looks like DLP can be added now thanks to a kind source) will be getting temporary attractions that will very likely be there for years. And I use the word 'attraction' very liberally here. Think meet-and-greet-and-gropes and singalongs and things of that nature. They will not be replacing anything right now, just utilizing existing and or new real estate.

Frozen will NOT be replacing Aladdin in the short term, especially with Robin Williams' passing, but could very well wind up in the Hyperion down the road AND at whatever you want to call the Studios park at WDW (Tangled was supposed to replace Beauty and the Beast, but it took so long to move thru approval that it won't happen now.)

None of this affects Maelstrom, which is in its final full month of operation now.

If I could armchair Imagineer a bit (something I generally despise because it always seems to be stuff of fifth gates or moving attractions from park to park ... Small World to EPCOT anyone?), I can't fathom a more perfect major addition to MK than Frozen. A park that lacks capacity and (unlike other WDW gates) actually needs more every day. A park that has been denuded over the last 15 years and feels like a concrete wasteland. A park where the IP would fit perfectly.

Just imagine a giant show building way yonder in Fantasyland. One that looks like an ice palace. Inside, multiple rides (think what was done with Mermaid Lagoon in TDS) ... a few cheap carnie types ... you know like Sven's Special Sleds ... one E-Ticket type attraction ... a QSR ... a shop or two ... all with ICE Cold AC in a perpetual twilight sky. Again, if I can spitball this all in 10 minutes, then why can't WDI's talent come up with better and why can't Iger, Staggs, Rasulo, Crofton and Co see the big picture here?

Nope. It's all going to be a rush job (again, except likely Tokyo and, if they decide on it, Shanghai) because they never had faith in this film ... and they don't have faith in any IP they put out these days that doesn't have Marvel on it. And we all know just how little Disney can do with Marvel at WDW. (And at the rate they are going, Disney will build Marvel stuff elsewhere just about the time people are tired of the IP).

Hope that helps explain the news and puts into perspective stuff you'll be hearing in the near future.

Your ideas for Frozen in MK are AWESOME. And I agree about the fixation on Marvel. I have said before that Robert Iger has no faith in Disney product AT ALL. That's why he thought he had to look outside the studio for new attractions for AK (Iger: "No, forget about the Lion King and the Jungle Book - today's crowds will NEVER go for those - we've got to get the newest cinematic eye candy created by the nerd god James Cameron!!!" The idiot.)

As for Frozen - I'd heard that there were people at Disney who didn't think much of the film before its premiere. And I bet they're still skeptical because they hate to be proven wrong. I'm not much of a Frozen fan, but I'm delighted by its success nonetheless. It just figures that Iger's Disney is not thinking of Frozen's potential to add real magic to the parks, but about how to exploit the to the limit the suckers who love the film.

Absolutely disgusting.
 

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Will have to wait to see what the actual products are to judge.. but to question or challenge the idea that Frozen SHOULD be out there... boggles the mind.

This is the issue.

Frozen absolutely should have a large presence at many Disney parks (EPCOT wouldn't be one, but ...) but the question is should it be something cheap and thrown in quickly in what feels like and looks like (because it is) a desperate move to further capitalize on a phenomenon that Disney didn't expect and didn't know how to respond to (something that if I was a Wall Street analyst I might question before drooling over Iger)?
 

wdwmagic

Administrator
Moderator
Premium Member
I think so.

I think folks get caught up in that line of thinking with IP (SW, Potter, Avatar ...)

Disney just opened a ride at the MK based on a film that was released before World War II.

I am not in love with Frozen like the fanbois, but it is quality (not that it matters ... see Avatar) and has hit on the cultural zeitgeist across generations. I've called it this generation's Lion King and I believe that.
But old is cool, recently current is not.

Opening up an attraction based on Snow White is like releasing something based on The Beatles - nobody is ever going to complain on that choice. Opening up something big on Frozen could be like basing it on One Direction.

I really wouldn't like to call it.
 

SirLink

Well-Known Member
Just some added info I didn't have time for earlier:

This 'initiative' is very late and very thrown together. It speaks to Disney not having faith in its product to begin with. Frozen may well be the highest grossing animated picture of all-time, but in no way, shape or form did Disney ever have faith (other than maybe its creators in their dreams) that this would be much more successful than Princess Tangled was.

I so wish that I could drop an anecdote about someone VERY high up's reaction to the film just a little over a month prior to release, but I'd likely be a real Spirit if I did. But understand this: Disney and its leadership didn't have the faith in this and it is nothing new. The only films they feel can't miss today have Marvel in front of them.

This isn't Michael Eisner's Disney that at the very least staged lavish parades and shows and, sometimes, real attractions that debuted along with the films throughout the 90s.

I almost decided to 'conceal, don't reveal' this whole thing because what I'd most like to write about is what I can't write about (at least for the foreseeable future).
.

Thanks for the info.

To the statement in red, the only real films that Disney produce worth a damn are those from Marvel Studios. Everything is utter mediocre like Frozen, Wreck it Ralph, Tangled, Pooh. Or butchered to the point of incoherency ala The Lone Ranger, and sometimes films that should never of been green lit to begin with see John Carter. Marvel are the only ones that matter and maybe if Star Wars are decent and well produced.
 

Stevek

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the info.

To the statement in red, the only real films that Disney produce worth a damn are those from Marvel Studios. Everything is utter mediocre like Frozen, Wreck it Ralph, Tangled, Pooh. Or butchered to the point of incoherency ala The Lone Ranger, and sometimes films that should never of been green lit to begin with see John Carter. Marvel are the only ones that matter and maybe if Star Wars are decent and well produced.
Which is an opinion of course as I quite enjoyed Frozen, Ralph and Tangled. I've even found some of the Marvel films to be less than I expected. Entertaining but a certain feeling of sameness when the universes are intertwined. Hardly the "best films in history" as some fanbois might say.
 

hpyhnt 1000

Well-Known Member
...very late and very thrown together.

That phrase about sums up The Walt Disney Company these days. Add "cheap" and you've got yourself a new slogan.

None of this affects Maelstrom, which is in its final full month of operation now.

Oh, of course THAT hasn't been cut from the plan. And to think that only a year ago there were those rumors that made us all hopeful that Epcot's decay and mismanagement might be reversed. How wrong we were.
 

Mike C

Well-Known Member
This is the issue.

Frozen absolutely should have a large presence at many Disney parks (EPCOT wouldn't be one, but ...) but the question is should it be something cheap and thrown in quickly in what feels like and looks like (because it is) a desperate move to further capitalize on a phenomenon that Disney didn't expect and didn't know how to respond to (something that if I was a Wall Street analyst I might question before drooling over Iger)?

How cheap and thrown together quickly? Is this quick show conversions or things like Narnia/Jack Sparrow exhibits? (Which is the first thing that comes to my mind)
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
But old is cool, recently current is not.

Opening up an attraction based on Snow White is like releasing something based on The Beatles - nobody is ever going to complain on that choice. Opening up something big on Frozen could be like basing it on One Direction.

I really wouldn't like to call it.

It's like the old saying in the computer business "no one ever got fired for buying IBM".
 

SirLink

Well-Known Member
Which is an opinion of course as I quite enjoyed Frozen, Ralph and Tangled. I've even found some of the Marvel films to be less than I expected. Entertaining but a certain feeling of sameness when the universes are intertwined. Hardly the "best films in history" as some fanbois might say.

I haven't felt them samey in the way you describe:
  • Phase I - Upbeat woo hoo we are super heroes
  • Phase II - Introduce a darkness to the MCU
  • Phase III - ...
 

Alektronic

Well-Known Member
They should keep up with the World Showcase theme and put an ICE Bar in Norway and put the Meet and Greet elsewhere like next door between Norway and Mexico.
 

danv3

Well-Known Member
Frozen absolutely should have a large presence at many Disney parks (EPCOT wouldn't be one, but ...) but the question is should it be something cheap and thrown in quickly in what feels like and looks like (because it is) a desperate move to further capitalize on a phenomenon that Disney didn't expect and didn't know how to respond to (something that if I was a Wall Street analyst I might question before drooling over Iger)?

Quoted for emphasis.
 

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