Pirates of the Caribbean Auctioneer/Redhead Changes NO POLITICS or SOCIAL ISSUES, PLEASE!

JohnD

JohnD

Well-Known Member
It's hard not to talk about this issue without mentioning politics or social issues. That was the very reason for changing the scene. It's no longer "politically correct" to feature a wench up for auction. Today's politics and social issues demand that the scene by changed so that the redhead is a woman-empowered pirate. I'm not saying I don't like the change. It's simply the reality.
 
HMF

HMF

Well-Known Member
The Duck said:
That would be fine with me but since they finally seem to have it working again (or is it broken again?), they might be reluctant to do that. Besides, mist and a projector are a whole lot cheaper than a state of the art AA. Also, the mist screen seems to be in Paris now so it may be some Imagineer's pet project.
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I interpret the mist in Paris to be the point you travel back in time as in Anaheim. At wdw there is no time travel and Blackbeard should still be alive so the mist makes no sense.
 
HMF

HMF

Well-Known Member
Amidala said:
I mean, I think it's important to point out that women are guests at WDW too, and it's hard to feel like part of the magic when the boys get to be pirates and the girls get to be...sold? It might be a different if Ana Maria or Elizabeth had been added to the ride and shown fighting alongside the other pirates, but as it stands...what you see is what you get.

Besides, the concept of the pirates ride is in itself a sanitization of history...you exit into a gift shop where you're expected to buy pirate-related merchandise and get a pirate makeover–enough said. I also don't see how "[x] was in the original version of the ride" is a viable justification for leaving things unchanged...logically, it's going to happen on a case-by-case basis. The motivation behind this change wasn't to censor violence (if that was the idea, like you said, all of the actual violence would be removed), it was to make sure that guests don't feel alienated from the experience.

That being said, I'd be 100% fine with the current ride being torn out and replaced with the Shanghai version. I've worked merch at the pirates store and a day never went by without the ride shutting down for maintenance. It's a good concept, but the original in Disneyland seems to be the undisputed "winner" between the two, and between this, the tiki room and Jungle Cruise, Adventureland could use some tech upgrading.
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The Paris ride in it,s original incarnation was by no means an endorsement of piracy and I personally think shoving Jack into the treasure horde in the grotto is a rotten thing to do.
 
Amidala

Amidala

Well-Known Member
HMF said:
The Paris ride in it,s original incarnation was by no means an endorsement of piracy and I personally think shoving Jack into the treasure horde in the grotto is a rotten thing to do.
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An endorsement of piracy is definitely a strong way of putting it. I've never been to DL Paris but at the very least find WDW's Pirates to be a pretty lighthearted and child-friendly interpretation, by necessity. There are of course much darker themes upon closer inspection, but, again, all portrayed so that a child sitting through the ride would think nothing of it. My point being that rides (classic or otherwise) see changes all the times, and the metrics for when that's acceptable and when it isn't are...confusing to me.

On a slightly unrelated note, Jim Hill mentioned something really interesting about this in a podcast. Back when the ride was still set to be a walk-through wax exhibit, Anne Bonny was one of the planned characters, and Marc Davis has drawn concept art of two women (Anne Bonny and another?) handling treasure in a way that feels...pretty reminiscent of this new scene.

Anne_Mary_Crew.jpg

I'm in favor of the change either way, but still thought this was a pretty cool tie-in.
 
HMF

HMF

Well-Known Member
Amidala said:
An endorsement of piracy is definitely a strong way of putting it. I've never been to DL Paris but at the very least find WDW's Pirates to be a pretty lighthearted and child-friendly interpretation, by necessity. There are of course much darker themes upon closer inspection, but, again, all portrayed so that a child sitting through the ride would think nothing of it. My point being that rides (classic or otherwise) see changes all the times, and the metrics for when that's acceptable and when it isn't are...confusing to me.

On a slightly unrelated note, Jim Hill mentioned something really interesting about this in a podcast. Back when the ride was still set to be a walk-through wax exhibit, Anne Bonny was one of the planned characters, and Marc Davis has drawn concept art of two women (Anne Bonny and another?) handling treasure in a way that feels...pretty reminiscent of this new scene.

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I'm in favor of the change either way, but still thought this was a pretty cool tie-in.
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The MK version does not have as much of a moral statement as Disneyland still does to an extent and Paris definitely had before "Great Moments with Mr. Sparrow".
 
HMF

HMF

Well-Known Member
What happening? The refurb is in 2018. What it entails I don,t know but I do hope they put Barbossa in Dead Mans Cove in lieu of the mermaids and remove the "Marketing mist", Maybe even bring back the Barker Bird and of course put the Captain of the Wicked Wench back on his ship.
 
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LAKid53

LAKid53

Official Member of the Girly Girl Fan Club
Premium Member
Grimley1968 said:
There's one way they could do this that would be fine with me, though it would be probably too long a scene and there would be challenges with the AA's:

Begin with the auction scene as it is now, but the Redhead grabs a rifle from somewhere, cows the auctioneer and becomes a pirate herself, robbing everyone else in the auction scene.

Unfortunately, the proposed artwork doesn't suggest anything nearly as fun, IMO.
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Now, I like that idea! Not enough female pirates, IMHO.
 
S

Sonic Sunglasses

Well-Known Member
Amidala said:
On a slightly unrelated note, Jim Hill mentioned something really interesting about this in a podcast. Back when the ride was still set to be a walk-through wax exhibit, Anne Bonny was one of the planned characters, and Marc Davis has drawn concept art of two women (Anne Bonny and another?) handling treasure in a way that feels...pretty reminiscent of this new scene.

View attachment 218905

I'm in favor of the change either way, but still thought this was a pretty cool tie-in.
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Mary Read was the other female pirate considered. I love this concept art of dividing the plunder. Lots of elements that draw inspiration from the artwork of Howard Pyle, who is largely credited with creating the modern stereotype of pirate dress.
 
crxbrett

crxbrett

Well-Known Member
Magicart87 said:
So when's this happening?
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Not sure it's been made official or public yet. It will most likely close immediately following the New Year & christmas breaks in early January. Disney probably wants it re-opened in time for spring break, which will be the last week of March or first week of April in 2018. I think it will open the week of March 19th or March 26th.
 
BenJacobs

BenJacobs

Well-Known Member
RSoxNo1 said:
So with the other thread shifting into the political, any chance we can have a discussion about the actual change itself while keeping the social issues in the other thread?

The other thread for social discussion can be found here: http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/the-redhead-is-changing.928716/

As for this scene, I think they would be better off with a total wholesale change to the scene. The redhead is iconic, as is the auctioneer, but if the scene is inappropriate, why not retire them outright? What Imagineer wouldn't love the opportunity to create an entirely new scene for this space? It could be sword fighting pirates, or could be an explosion sequence, it could be a combination of all of them. Instead the new proposal appears to keep the characters but ignore the rolls they once played. That doesn't work as well (see Figment).
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They are obviously changing it for political correctness(a stupid reason to change anything), but the way they have done it is very good, and works well.
 
Amidala

Amidala

Well-Known Member
Benjlufc said:
They are obviously changing it for political correctness(a stupid reason to change anything), but the way they have done it is very good, and works well.
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"Political correctness" as a phrase is honestly devoid of all meaning by this point, especially on the internet...They're making changes because women and young girls would like to see themselves represented in a beloved ride in a way that doesn't involve being sold like objects. Specificity is key.

Still not sure when this is actually happening though (?) Hopefully not at the same time that Splash Mountain is also down for refurbishment.
 
becca_

becca_

Well-Known Member
Amidala said:
"Political correctness" as a phrase is honestly devoid of all meaning by this point, especially on the internet...They're making changes because women and young girls would like to see themselves represented in a beloved ride in a way that doesn't involve being sold like objects. Specificity is key.

Still not sure when this is actually happening though (?) Hopefully not at the same time that Splash Mountain is also down for refurbishment.
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My guess is January(ish), but no one has confirmed/said much about a date.
 

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