Dissapointed

WDWFantasmic

New Member
DisneyWales said:
Out of the two complaints i have made the first one i had three Cast Member Cheer and thank me for saying it, (Chester and Hester) They were glad that Guests were going to them to say what they thought about that area of AK. I wasn't trying to get anything out of them, I just wanted to tell them how I felt, and Surprise Surprise they thanked me!

LOL!!!:lol: I'm glad you complained about Dinorama because honestly, I hate it.:hurl: It doesn't fit in AK and should be changed to actually fit in Dinoland without detracting from the atmosphere. The rides are good but the theme is not!:brick:
 

DisneyWales

Member
Original Poster
Thanks

WDWFantasmic said:
LOL!!!:lol: I'm glad you complained about Dinorama because honestly, I hate it.:hurl: It doesn't fit in AK and should be changed to actually fit in Dinoland without detracting from the atmosphere. The rides are good but the theme is not!:brick:

Thanks, after the bashing ive recived here thats means alot. And thats all it was, just a comment to say, AK is astunning park, beautiful themed, untill Dinorama. I now boycott it, even my mum said on her first visit (and shes not a big Disney Fanatic) how much that area is a let down, particularly after walking past EE.
 

WDWFantasmic

New Member
DisneyWales said:
Thanks, after the bashing ive recived here thats means alot. And thats all it was, just a comment to say, AK is astunning park, beautiful themed, untill Dinorama. I now boycott it, even my mum said on her first visit (and shes not a big Disney Fanatic) how much that area is a let down, particularly after walking past EE.

I hope they modify it or remove it in the future for a better ride that actually makes the park better. What were they thinking when they built this?:brick: :lookaroun
 

DisneyWales

Member
Original Poster
WDWFantasmic said:
I hope they modify it or remove it in the future for a better ride that actually makes the park better. What were they thinking when they built this?:brick: :lookaroun

Cheap Kiddie area. I guess it could be put in without any major work, and taken out withouit any major work.
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
DLP has a few fundamental flaws, its in France, it has French staff, it has a French (Parisian) attitude, the French (and Parisians in particular) hate everything that isnt French. The French smoke like a McDonald Douglas engine, they have Bolshi unions to match they’re ________ poor attitude and why any one thought they would actually get the concept of a Disney park is beyond me. Perhaps they thought that making it near Paris would give the brand a cultural boost?

The weather makes a difference, they should have built it in southern Spain, it would have taken twice as long to build, but at least you could staff it with ex pat Brits and Germans, appeal to your base customers.

Im going in Feb, I will not be staying in a Disney hotel, I can get 5 star hotels in London for less, Ill be honest had I not been making a trip to France I would have not visited. You cant beat WDW and no matter what you say you will make comparisons.

I was going to say I don’t dislike the French, but Corsicans dont consider themselves French and people in the Pyrenean region consider themselves Bask. :drevil:
 

Kristofke

Member
than just stop complaining and don't visit!

Then you don't have a problem! If you hate the French, fine, go to Walt Disney World and stay there.

Djeezes.
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
Kristofke said:
than just stop complaining and don't visit!

Then you don't have a problem! If you hate the French, fine, go to Walt Disney World and stay there.

Djeezes.

Oh dear, chocolate a bit brittle this morning or is the pate off?
 

Martin2k5

New Member
I've visited both WDW and DLRP and to be honest they are completly different experiences.

WDW has the "Disney Atmosphere" and I had an amazing time on both visits.

I like DLRP just as much as WDW. While it may not have as much of the called "Disney Atmosphere" or the all smiling, all dancing atmosphere that WDW has, I think it still more than deserves the title of a "Disney" theme park.

I have had no problems with CMs in DLRP, they have all been patient and helpful when I have tried to communicate in very basic French and I find their customer service to be very high. I'm not saying that all DLRP CMs are like this, but every business has employees with different personalities, they cannot be forced to be happy and cheerful if they really don't want to be. I saw an example of this in WDW when a CM on Jungle Cruise blatently couldn't be bothered with the job and read the whole script with a boring and fast voice, with a few sarcastic comments thrown in.

I know CMs in DLRP and can assure you that they put 100% into their job, despite falling moral and budget cuts within all departments. There are lots of changes happening with DLRP at the moment and I think the fact that they continue to do their job and offer what I believe to be the Disney experience is to be applauded.

I don't think the parades can be faulted at DLRP. Granted, The Wonderful World of Disney Parade has been there since 1998, but is a timeless classic. The Christmas Parade features different music and transformed floats which creates a festive atmosphere throughout the park, again I don't think it is a poor effort at all.

It's a bit unfair to compare the current Fantillusion to Tokyo's version. Tokyo goes to town with their parades and they are always spectacular. DLRP really can't afford to spend as much on entertainment due to their financial situation. Granted, the original version was huge and I would love to see it in DLRP. However, what many people do not understand is that when Tokyo were finished with the parade the floats were in appalling condition, requiring DLRP to spend millions on repairing and adapting the floats for the park. I prefer Fantillusion to Spectromagic, even thought it's shorter I think the music and floats are miles ahead of Spectro. The parade stops on Fantillusion certainly set it apart from Spectro in my view.

Anyway, that's my two cents.
 

DisneyWales

Member
Original Poster
Martin2k

Martin i would like to thank you for offering constructive feedback to my comments, instead of taking the low ground, you took on board what i had to say, gave your opionion and gave reasons.

I know all the reasons why DLRP has Smaller versions of Parades, and i know how financial problems can be a very big demoralising factor to staff in a large public company.

From what i heard part of the issue with Fantillusion was that alot of the floats were damaged in transit, as well as the cost of remodeling the to EU standards.

I guess my main point with DLRP (The few staff issues aside) was i got too excited, we were going for my Birthday, i'd been to WDW of four different occasions during the year, and was reallhy looking forward to being back in the "Magic". When I got there and not a single cast member wished me Happy Birthday, even after I said its my Birthday, and having problems with the pool facilities and the condition of the Newport Bay, i was just in a bad mood.

I think because of these factors alot of the smaller things (i.e. the scale of the parades and the way the rides were run etc). Just got me more than they usually would.

If i was to be honest tho, i prefer the WDW way of doing Disney, It may not look as nice, but it feels alot more Magic.
 

RonAnnArbor

Well-Known Member
DLP and France

I don't know about the specific things that went wrong on the original posters visit, but as an American who visits France every couple of months and has been to DLP a dozen times, I have never really encountered anything there that is not typical of French culture as a whole. If you are expecting the "Florida Experience" go to Florida...although many of the complaints voiced here are also voiced in the WDW parks at times these days.

1) DLP is NOT completely composed of French employees - like the American parks, the employees come from all over the world in order to fill all the positions. Like the Florida parks, non-native speakers are often in the food concessions and in the operations crew. French/English speakers are primarily assigned to the rides and other attractions.

2) The French don't smile and say hello for the sake of smiling and saying hello...that being said, I have never encountered a rude cast member at DLP. It is true that on occasion, the Space Mountain cast members look harried and upset - but that has as much to do with the uncomfortable work angle in bending over all day to strap in riders as it does with the loading pace of the ride itself. All in all, this ride hits interval every day, happy employees or not.

3) Smoking is permitted everywhere in the park - try stopping Europeans from smoking! WHile it is unusual to see the cast smoking while on duty, it does happen. Recall: the cast members almost shut down the park when it first opened because Disney tried to force them to not smoke, to cut their hair, to not have earrings, etc...French mores are very different from US mores, and they discovered that quickly at the park and adjusted to the French mores. Don't expect American (or even British) mores at a European park.

4) The french don't understand the concept of "wishing happy birthday because you say it is your birthday" as another poster mentioned -- that is not a big deal there. Similarly, the French do not say "hi" when they pass each other on the street. That is an american more.

5) Finally - take a look at a social science book like "50 million frenchmen can't be wrong" or read one of Stephen Clark's hilarious novels about working in Paris, and you will get a good taste for the beaurocracy involved at every level of working in France -- classes are classes, and there is a sense of entitlement that the French believe that they have - this sense of entitlement finds its way across all levels of employees in all companies. The american concept of "service professional" is, well, literally, foreign in France and you can't expect that mentality in any ride operator or cast member.

Overall, my experience has always been very positive at DLP. If anything, their cast members seem much more "americanized" than most employees in France. Still, there are cultural differences that will always be different there.

I think you can always write a letter to express your concerns about the experiences you had -- but there is pretty much nothing you can do to change the mores in a foreign country that are not the same as the mores in America.

I have worked in Paris for years, and the types of things I have to put up with there are things that would never occur here in the States, but that does not stop me from working there and loving Paris. What you see at DLP is an extension of that.
 

DisneyWales

Member
Original Poster
Disney Thing

Everything you said all makes perfect sence, my friend who was with me at the time told me about the france and Birthday thing (That it doesn't translate directly as Birthday, they have a slightly different holiday).

What bugged me most was the inconstancy, when walking onto Cinemagic and Animagic, we were greated by two cast members in what i call not the American way The Disney way, I say this because I dont get greated like this in Universal, sea world or Busch.

Our Hoast in Armageddon was fantastic, spoke 90% French, but just because of his effort and expression I really enjoyed the preshow.

The Lady we spoke to in guest services would have put some Guest Services cast to shame in WDW.

And all entertainment staff were 100% professional staying in character even when friends were heckling them from the sidelines.

But then in the same day you get the total opposite side of the scale, as ive decribed elsewhere.

Cultural issues asside the things ive written about are things i belive should not happen in any Theme Park. Let alone a Disney Park.
 

Martin2k5

New Member
DisneyWales said:
Martin i would like to thank you for offering constructive feedback to my comments, instead of taking the low ground, you took on board what i had to say, gave your opionion and gave reasons.
You're welcome. There's no point pretending everything is fine and dandy at DLRP at the moment because it's not. However things are beginning to look up. With the opening of Buzz, Toon Studios, Tower of Terror and the 15th Anniversiary.

DisneyWales said:
From what i heard part of the issue with Fantillusion was that alot of the floats were damaged in transit, as well as the cost of remodeling the to EU standards.
Yes the floats weren't packaged very well by TDL and were damaged in transit. Also after TDL was finished with the parade they left the floats outside with the elements which caused large amounts of damage. As you point out all the floats had to be completly converted to EU standards as well as the cockpits expanded for the generally larger European drivers.

DisneyWales said:
And all entertainment staff were 100% professional staying in character even when friends were heckling them from the sidelines.

Really? There were actually people heckling them? I find that appalling.

DisneyWales said:
I think because of these factors alot of the smaller things (i.e. the scale of the parades and the way the rides were run etc). Just got me more than they usually would.
You will be pleased to know that DLRP will be getting two 'new' parades in 2007 for the 15th anniversairy. Disneyland Park will get a brand new parade called the "Once Upon a Dream Parade" which will feature a brand new soundtrack and all-new floats which will contain snowglobes similar to the parade at the MK in WDW. The Walt Disney Studios will get the "Disney Stars and Motor Cars" parade from the Disney MGM studios in Florida.

Thanks,

Martin
 
Living in the UK and being a WDW park fan it is good to goto DLRP when you just want a few days of Disney magic.

Though to be honest DLRP is not even in the same league as WDW. If DLRP had opened first it wouldn't of spawned numerous parks across the world!

Besides if you have a week or more to spare I'm sure the difference in cost between a week in the WDW area or at DLRP is not that different.

DLRP has a beautiful Magic Kingdom park which I really enjoy exploring. Many of the rides that have been cloned from the american parks are on paper superior. It just seriously lacks "magic". There is no mystery to the place and my experience is that the Cast Members at DLRP are no different to the ride operators at a normal fun fair.

I found WDS quite good. What they had I thought was good but to be honest it wasn't "WOW" by anymeans.

I really believe though that even though DLRP has serious money issues it isn't always about that. There is some "magic" missing at Paris and they need to find away of getting in back.
 

PlanetD

New Member
Wow, major clash of cultural views. This thread would be great material for some studying culture.:lol:

Ok, honestly I haven't read all posts but I think I can help clear something up.

Europeans in general do not like to have rules imposed. The squicky clean Disney image you find in WDW, is just less visible in Europe. You can have long sideburns in DLRP as long is it doesn't look "bad" for example. They've had major issues with these things. Europeans don't want to work if they believe it is no use doing something that the employer wants. This is not the French, it is the Europeans. For comparison; I work in a themepark in The Netherlands. Boy, they've had big time issues with forbidding baseball hats and piercings. The employer got "why" and "my rights are..." and "you are discriminating me" and who knows what else. That is a European attitude. Not a French one.

Although service motivation varies per European area, it is true that most Parisians aren't service minded, as for many (especially) metropolitan areas in Europe and perhaps the world as well. This reminds me of a scene in "Don't tell mom the babysitter is dead" where she has to run into a department store and get something and the clerk is calling her friend on the phone and there is a que. Well, that is terrible but it happens. Anyway, unfortunately it is part of local culture and is not helping Disney in bringing this magical way of guest service.

Point to ponder from a cultural perspective: Disneyland was made in Paris vs. Disney World made Orlando.

Not all Europeans and Parisians (or French) are equal. Some (like me for example :p :king: ) would work for Disney the way they want me to. I have no issues there, I do understand why Disney wants to present themselves the way they do. It is a matter of understanding, and it is not 100% understood in Paris.

On the question "for who is this bad?" I would suggest diehard Disney fans and Americans. They come with a certain expectation which is not met in Paris. However, if you would survey Europeans, I think they are very satisfied with the way DLRP operates. Because the park meets the expectations of the European locals. Actually, what I expect is that if Disney would go through any greater lengths to apply the Disney difference you will find Europeans saying DLRP is overdoing things and that it is too much. A tendency you can already read from the other posts. And besides you will get the unions to get mad and knowing the French it means they'll go on strike :lol: !

Culture is one of the hardest things to handel. Many corporations have gone in error in the past introducing their product in foreign countries because they didn't take local culture into account. You can see how this subject clashes on this thread because cultural views are different. You can discuss this subject forever (whish can be a lot of fun!) but the point is that Paris hasn't got the Disney difference as once meant down for 100%, but it is OK for the Europeans because it meets their cultural expectations and demands. For some this perception may change once they visit WDW and for other they will love DLRP more because WDW is "too much" disney difference.

So there you have it, my contribution. Put your braincells to work and think about this. Take eachother into consideration when placing new threads and posts. And show respect for eachother and eachothers culture is my advice!:D

Good luck!

David
 

RonAnnArbor

Well-Known Member
Excellent post! I absolutely agree that the only grumbling I've heard about missing the Disney Magic is either the Americans or the Brits who have been to WDW. My Parisian friends all think that DLRP has AMAZING customer service and attention. I have found no problem there, but then I lived in Europe for years.
 

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