Rumor Bye Bye (Tiki) Birdies?

[EPCOTCenterLover]

I miss the days of old when you didn't have to plan everything you did. Made things much more relaxing and you still saw most all of what was on your list.

 

[jakeman]

It depends on your personality. Some can wing it and don't care if they see everything. They just want a family vacation. If, on the other hand, you want to "do Disney," and you need to get on Frozen, Soarin', and Test Track on your one Epcot day, that takes planning and knowledge of the entirety of the system. When do I wake up? How long should I plan for transport? What order of rides? Which FP do I choose? You can't wing that.

And then you want to eat at Le Cellier because your friend Cindy said the $60 steak is better than Ruth's Chris?

And the next day you are doing Jedi Training for your kids Liam and Gavin who you've been promising this to for the entire 342 days of your "countdown to Disney?" And Friday you've promised your daughter Skylar three hours of pampering in the Bibbiti Bobbity Boutique IN THE CASTLE followed by lunch in the Castle while Dad Tim takes Liam and Gavin to the Fort Wilderness Lodge for horseback riding, archery, and lunch at Whispering Canyon (let's hope Tim realizes Mom got a little confused while highlighting Birnbaum's). Then we will all meet for dinner at Be Our Guest.


It takes a lot of planning and despite what some would suggest, the fact that many folks have some MUST-DOs that ARE hard to book last-minute requires that they plan EVERYTHING. If you need to know when you'll be eating in the Castle, going to BBB, eating at Be Our Guest, and eating at Le Cellier many months out, and when you'll be taking the family on Frozen, Flight of Passage, and Mine Train 60+10 days out, you also need to know when you'll be everywhere else.

It's easy to forget this when we go frequently and don't feel like we have to see, eat, buy, and do everything.

I guess the counter to that would be that level of activity would require a massive amount of planning regardless of the system in place.

Taking a step back, the absence of FP+ would introduce a high level of variability to the attractions aspect of it. With paper FP, what if you got to Epcot first thing in the morning and your issued Frozen FP was at the same time as your Le Cellier reservation? Or let's say there were still walk up reservation. They aren't going to be instant. Are you going to miss your paper FP at Frozen because you have to hang out in Le Cellier lobby for 45 minutes waiting for a table?

You couldn't wing it before...except you were forced to and you had a higher risk of missing something.

Disney could do a better job with their own schedule and standardizing booking windows would probably go a long way to help that (everything at 90 days as an example), but to list the activities above and imply that it's more complicated now I think is disingenuous. Yeah, you have to plan all that in advance, but the flip side of the old way was you didn't plan it and you probably would miss part of it at the point of transaction.

 

[jakeman]

I miss the days of old when you didn't have to plan everything you did. Made things much more relaxing and you still saw most all of what was on your list.

You don't. Unless you have a massive list of activities that @MansionButler84 denoted (which is possible), you can still do almost everything on a whim. There's over 50 restaurants available for lunch today (including Le Cellier). Everything at MK except BTMR, Pooh, the Mine Train and the meet and greets are available (and I bet the standby lines for those are open). This is the week right before Memorial day. So it's not like it's a slow season. If you give yourself even 24 hours of notice almost everything is available.

You don't have to plan EVERYTHING you do. That's a falsity that has been repeated so much people here believe it.

 

[ToTBellHop]

I guess the counter to that would be that level of activity would require a massive amount of planning regardless of the system in place.

Taking a step back, the absence of FP+ would introduce a high level of variability to the attractions aspect of it. With paper FP, what if you got to Epcot first thing in the morning and your issued Frozen FP was at the same time as your Le Cellier reservation? Or let's say there were still walk up reservation. They aren't going to be instant. Are you going to miss your paper FP at Frozen because you have to hang out in Le Cellier lobby for 45 minutes waiting for a table?

You couldn't wing it before...except you were forced to and you had a higher risk of missing something.

Disney could do a better job with their own schedule and standardizing booking windows would probably go a long way to help that (everything at 90 days as an example), but to list the activities above and imply that it's more complicated now I think is disingenuous. Yeah, you have to plan all that in advance, but the flip side of the old way was you didn't plan it and you probably would miss part of it at the point of transaction.

Oh I agree--I think I had mentioned it earlier. WDW has long required a lot of planning. I was just pointing out that the average vacationer undergoes considerable planning.

 

[grnflash]

I guess the counter to that would be that level of activity would require a massive amount of planning regardless of the system in place.

Taking a step back, the absence of FP+ would introduce a high level of variability to the attractions aspect of it. With paper FP, what if you got to Epcot first thing in the morning and your issued Frozen FP was at the same time as your Le Cellier reservation? Or let's say there were still walk up reservation. They aren't going to be instant. Are you going to miss your paper FP at Frozen because you have to hang out in Le Cellier lobby for 45 minutes waiting for a table?

You couldn't wing it before...except you were forced to and you had a higher risk of missing something.

Disney could do a better job with their own schedule and standardizing booking windows would probably go a long way to help that (everything at 90 days as an example), but to list the activities above and imply that it's more complicated now I think is disingenuous. Yeah, you have to plan all that in advance, but the flip side of the old way was you didn't plan it and you probably would miss part of it at the point of transaction.

So taking the Le Cellier/Frozen example and switching it to DLR...getting an RSR FP first thing in the morning but the time being issued conflicts with something else, I'd ask a CM if I could wait for a later FP. CM would invariably say no problem and ask me to step aside where I would wait until an agreeable return window was being issued. As fast as those FP's were issued, we're talking about a wait of minutes, not hours.

For rides not selling out FP's asap in the am, checking the app to see what return window is being issued is easy peasy, requires no preplanning and lets one decide if they want to pull say a Space FP before actually hoofing it over to Space.

My point is that it's not disingenuous at all to say WDW is more complicated now nor that there are other methods than FP+ that reduce missing out while still "winging it."

 

[brb1006]

To be fair, Disney has made it A LOT harder for people to understand how to have a WDW Vacation properly.

I miss the times before Disney introduced the Food Reservation to WDW.

 

[RSoxNo1]

It's definitely overwhelming but I do think it's much much easier than say 6-7 years ago. As much as we all destroyed Disney for implementing My Disney Experience it works and works well. I was a big time doubter but it's clearly the future of theme parks everywhere and I'm on board 100%.

Put me down for Pro Birds.

It works, to say that it works well is a big leap. It is still too inconsistent for being the driver of all park activities.

 

[jakeman]

So taking the Le Cellier/Frozen example and switching it to DLR...getting an RSR FP first thing in the morning but the time being issued conflicts with something else, I'd ask a CM if I could wait for a later FP. CM would invariably say no problem and ask me to step aside where I would wait until an agreeable return window was being issued. As fast as those FP's were issued, we're talking about a wait of minutes, not hours.

For rides not selling out FP's asap in the am, checking the app to see what return window is being issued is easy peasy, requires no preplanning and lets one decide if they want to pull say a Space FP before actually hoofing it over to Space.

My point is that it's not disingenuous at all to say WDW is more complicated now nor that there are other methods than FP+ that reduce missing out while still "winging it."

Eh, complication is in the eye of the beholder.

In your scenario, I've got to make sure I'm up and at the park before opening. Then work my way up to the FP line, hope that it's available and then hope that it's not at a time that conflicts with other activities. That's a lot of variables just to be able to "wing it".

I was never a fan of the rope drop dash just to get a FP+ for 6:00 p.m., but that's just me.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

FP+ is so much better because you don't have to run back and forth across a park for a FP. At DLR it may be nice bc the park is the size of the lagoon at Epcot, but in WDW it is q huge time and energy saver.

 

[HauntedPirate]

FP+ is so much better because you don't have to run back and forth across a park for a FP. At DLR it may be nice bc the park is the size of the lagoon at Epcot, but in WDW it is q huge time and energy saver.

If you were running back and forth across a park for a FP, you were doing something wrong. And now if you don't book your FP+ times 60 days in advance, you run the risk of being completely shut out of FP+ for certain attractions, whereas in the past everyone had the same opportunity for FP when the park opened. I still prefer the old FP system, but that's just me.

 

[grnflash]

Eh, complication is in the eye of the beholder.

In your scenario, I've got to make sure I'm up and at the park before opening. Then work my way up to the FP line, hope that it's available and then hope that it's not at a time that conflicts with other activities. That's a lot of variables just to be able to "wing it".

I was never a fan of the rope drop dash just to get a FP+ for 6:00 p.m., but that's just me.

You have great reasons to prefer FP+ - you want to do the hot new ride without ropedropping and like the assurance of a locked in time. These are valid reasons some people prefer it. My point remains though - that the system makes planning a trip more complicated than before, and imo, more complicated than necessary.

 

[Goob]

We just book all the fast passes we want, 60 days out, and then we just do whatever we want across WDW during the time that's not in our fast pass times. So, the only thing we plan are dinner reservations and fast passes. It's simple really.

 

[jakeman]

You have great reasons to prefer FP+ - you want to do the hot new ride without ropedropping and like the assurance of a locked in time. These are valid reasons some people prefer it. My point remains though - that the system makes planning a trip more complicated than before, and imo, more complicated than necessary.

Um...no. You're making assumptions about my preferences.

Both systems have their positives and negatives and having used both extensively I don't tend to favor one more than the other.

If you were running back and forth across a park for a FP, you were doing something wrong. And now if you don't book your FP+ times 60 days in advance, you run the risk of being completely shut out of FP+ for certain attractions, whereas in the past everyone had the same opportunity for FP when the park opened.

Except those that hit a snag in the bus. Or want to eat breakfast after 8:00 a.m. Or are unable to get to the park at any point past 9:30 in the morning. Or you were travelling with someone who couldn't make the rope drop dash to the FP.

No, not everyone had the same opportunity for a FP any more than everyone has the same opportunity at the 60 day mark.

People act like there are no attractions open to you if don't book right at 60 days. It's hyperbole and tired rhetoric. I just checked and everything but the meet and greets is open at MK right now. More than what was available this morning.

 

[Scuttle]

It works, to say that it works well is a big leap. It is still too inconsistent for being the driver of all park activities.

We still need to be able to split FP+ for park hopping. I thought that would have been rolled out by now.

 

[jakeman]

We still need to be able to split FP+ for park hopping. I thought that would have been rolled out by now.

It probably won't ever be. Time you spend on transportation to another park is time you aren't in proximity to a shop or eatery.

 

[grnflash]

Um...no. You're making assumptions about my preferences.

Both systems have their positives and negatives and having used both extensively I don't tend to favor one more than the other.
Except those that hit a snag in the bus. Or want to eat breakfast after 8:00 a.m. Or are unable to get to the park at any point past 9:30 in the morning. Or you were travelling with someone who couldn't make the rope drop dash to the FP.

No, not everyone had the same opportunity for a FP any more than everyone has the same opportunity at the 60 day mark.

People act like there are no attractions open to you if don't book right at 60 days. It's hyperbole and tired rhetoric. I just checked and everything but the meet and greets is open at MK right now. More than what was available this morning.

Hmmm

Well no I'm not really making assumptions, I drew logical conclusions from your prior post.

The what if examples don't hold up imo. Pretty sure your bus could be delayed on your way to using reserved FP. Can't ropedrop or want an 8am breakfast (don't want to ropedrop)....well I agreed in my post that those are good reasons to prefer the FP+ system.

As for no attractions open, hyperbole, yada, yada. I said it's more complicated. Period. FP+ isn't a deal breaker for me. It is more complicated.

 

[networkpro]

You have great reasons to prefer FP+ - you want to do the hot new ride without ropedropping and like the assurance of a locked in time. These are valid reasons some people prefer it. My point remains though - that the system makes planning a trip more complicated than before, and imo, more complicated than necessary.

Oh so rope drop rushing to TSMM and the first FP you can get was afternoon was a good thing ?

 

[ToTBellHop]

It probably won't ever be. Time you spend on transportation to another park is time you aren't in proximity to a shop or eatery.

There is also an issue of fairness. Will Soarin at 9, RnRC at 11, Flight of Passage at 2 be allowed?

 

[Communicora]

The pre-fastpass days often involved lengthy lines at every attraction, but I was a kid and it didn't bother me that much. I liked the paper fastpass days, because I was able to see everything I wanted and sometimes ride my favorites 2-3x. It seems harder to do that now with FP+. Perhaps it was because the paper fastpasses gave an advantage to people who understood it and with FP+ the playing field is leveled a bit.

Anyway, back to the Tikis. It would be a real shame for them to get rid of this attraction. It may not be the busiest, but you need to give people some respites from the crowds. Heck, even if you don't enjoy it, it's a nice place to rest your feet and get some air conditioning. It's a classic of the Disney parks and I wish WDW would hold some respect for that.

 

[Scuttle]

If you were running back and forth across a park for a FP, you were doing something wrong. And now if you don't book your FP+ times 60 days in advance, you run the risk of being completely shut out of FP+ for certain attractions, whereas in the past everyone had the same opportunity for FP when the park opened. I still prefer the old FP system, but that's just me.

But for people that want to arrive later in the day it's a gem. Remember on those busy days all fastpasses would be distributed by early afternoon in the old system. There's certain things I miss about the old system (building up fastpasses and returning at whatever time) but overall this is much better for later arrivals. During busy season with the old system you'd show up at MK at noon and Space Mountain would have a return time of 8:00-9:00 or something stupid. Under that scenario the new FP+ system is infinitely better.