Bloomberg - No Disney Fun for Orlando Workers as Poverty Nears 20%

[seascape]

Just remember that for about the first 15 years of WDW, Disney's hotels at the time (today reclassified as "Deluxe") charged today's equivalent of around $150 to $200/night.

At today's equivalent of $200/night, it was not a cheap room and many families had to stretch to afford that but service was outstanding back then. Year after year, Disney consistently reported occupancy rates of 95%. People knew they were getting a good value.

Heck, it wasn't that long ago (mid-2000s) that I remember getting a room in the Garden Wing of the Contemporary in the spring for about $230/night, no discount.

Today, that same room lists for $436/night.

So, when you write, "Especially when compared to the past", I'm still not with you.

We will disagre on this one, but maybe some here can learn that it is possible to have a debate without insults and such. I think we both made points and unless Disney ever desides to breakdown their numbers we will never know. However, you are correct and Disney has not invested enough in WDW. It will be interesting to see what Comcast does the next few years while they invest billions in China. At least Disney is just about finished with their China investment.

 

[WDW1974]

In our country today, everything ends up being political, eventually- even ebola. This is sad. Odds are this thread gets locked by the end of the day.

Perhaps that is for the best if only one side of the coin is going to be represented.

I can't wait for SDL open, not simply because I will be there, but to read all the ignorance and half-truths and 1980s Cold War BS being tossed about here.

 

[Gomer]

Most of the people in support of the higher wage have also said they would be willing to pay higher ticket prices in exchange. I know I would gladly cough up 14 dollars a day to know that my favorite place on earth was paying their employees enough to live on. Knowing they don't, makes the experience less enjoyable for me.

*Edit- As the poster above pointed out though. Not really necessary. I'm sure Iger could spare it on our behalf.

 

[BigTxEars]

Not all Walt Disney World parks are having record attendance.

I was referring to WDW (the resort as a whole) in Orlando, it's the one we go to so it's my point of reference. I believe the articles I linked were just talking about WDW itself but I could be wrong.

 

[BrittanyRose428]

Here's my issue with all of this. I'm currently on the college program working in Merchandise, and sometimes when I'm at work, I overhear people complaining about how little they make. I don't mean to dumb down the job, because I absolutely love working here, and it's all the extra touches for various roles like Merchandise that make it such a special place to work, but there are days where I get paid to play with plushes and use a bubble gun, and maybe hop on the register 4-5 times. I would not expect to get paid a lot for what I'm doing, in my opinion the work is not difficult. I think that it is extremely unskilled, and generally unskilled labor means you get paid minimum wage. Are there times when my job is difficult? Yes, of course. Sometimes guests can be difficult and make your day stressful, but that would happen with nearly any job. At a higher paying office job, I would likely still have clients who make the job more stressful than it needs to be. Is it hard working outside in Florida heat and humidity? It was at first, now not so much. It's uncomfortable at times, but it's not the end of the world.

This whole thing just blows my mind, because I have worked retail for 6 years and know a lot of people who are trying to support families on this kind of job. I've had coworkers at Staples in the past (which by the way paid me less than Disney does, and it was honestly harder work) who could not support their families working there, and so they had second jobs. I've had other coworkers who were fine working there because their spouses got paid more at whatever they did so it evened out. I also knew people who lived in motels and could hardly afford anything, and they were constantly looking for something better. I guess my big issue is that I would not expect to be able to support myself with any of the front line jobs at Disney. But this doesn't just go for Disney, it goes for anywhere. I wouldn't be home in Massachusetts with my 3 children thinking, "welp, better apply to McDonalds or Target." If that's all you can get at the time then that's great, any job is most certainly better than no job. I completely understand staying at a low-paying job for an extended period of time if that's all that was available, but the person still knew the pay going into it and chose to do it. To me, this is just one of those situations where I don't understand how people can complain when they knew what they were going to get paid when they were offered the job. It's not like it was a surprise, you know?

I've also looked into what I will be doing financially if I extend my college program (and my fiance is accepted). We would not be able to live together in college program housing, and I would much rather live with him than with roommates. We've been doing the math, and with the minimum amount of hours we would work per week with Disney (32), we could definitely afford a 1 bedroom apartment. While we do have no children, like the person mentioned in the article, we still have a lot of bills between the two of us, plus utilities and whatnot if we got an apartment, and things like groceries and gas money, but we would still have a decent amount of money leftover. It would not be the ideal situation for one person trying to support a larger family, but for 1 student and 1 recent graduate I see nothing wrong with this.

I don't mean to sound snobby here or anything like that, so I hope I'm not coming across that way. I don't come from a particularly wealthy family, and neither of my parents went to college. They started out with minimum wage, unskilled jobs, and worked their way up to being able to support themselves and me.

 

[CDavid]

Disney World employs between 66,000 - 70,000 Cast Members depending on the season. At $15 an hour that would be equivalent to an avg. of a $6 raise. Disney would have to pay an extra $396,000 p/day, $2.77 million p/week, and $144 million a year in extra payroll. Who do think is going to pay that? We the consumer are going to. Disney would need to raise the avg. Ticket price $14 per person per visit to cover that. It already costs $107 with tax for a 1 day at Magic Kingdom.

Where do you get these numbers, particularly the $14 per person per visit figure? In rough numbers there were 50 million visitor days (one person visiting one or more of the Walt Disney World theme parks for one day) in 2013; To produce increased profits of at least $144 million would require an increase of less than $3 per person per day. That is, of course, from admission tickets alone; Disney routinely raises prices on all manner of goods and services (food, merchandise, room rates, etc.). I'm not sure the necessary price increases to support increased Cast Member wages would even be all that noticeable, given the aggressive pace of WDW annual price hikes already.

 

[kjb101791]

I don't know if I would call the majority of Disney's current CM's 'high quality' considering they are generally guest workers with extremely limited English skills. Which for better or worse is the language used by the MAJORITY of visitors to WDW.

I find I frequently need to dust off my high school Spanish to even communicate with many of the supposed 'front line' CM's.

Nothing wrong with an accent no matter how heavy, However I DO expect basic fluency in English none of this 'no habla anglais' which is far too common among mousekeeping and F&B staff at WDW.

Believe me, I worked at WDW. It's still 100 times better than going into a Walmart in Orlando and trying to find a worker that speaks English. Given the seemingly low rates, the quality of workers is still much higher than anywhere that I can think of for the same pay.

 

[Phil12]

Now we have to consider total inventory.

Despite the expansion in recent years, DVC still makes up only 11% of total room inventory at WDW. 21% is at Deluxe Resorts, 28% is at Moderate Resorts, and 39% is at Value Resorts.

Let's see here, 11% + 21% + 28% + 39% = 99%. You mean to tell me WDW knows about all the times I slept in my car? That's makes me a true 1%er!

 

[ParentsOf4]

Let's see here, 11% + 21% + 28% + 39% = 99%. You mean to tell me WDW knows about all the times I slept in my car? That's makes me a true 1%er!

Well, really it's 11.3%, 21.3%, 28.2%, and 39.2%, but who's counting.

That might make you a 0.01%er!

 

[Fleis76]

People are entitled for wanting to work 40 hours a week and NOT be in poverty? Odd. Odd in the sense that people can work at entry level jobs in Japan and still be able to support themselves WHILE receiving universal healthcare so their work force is as healthy as it can be. So odd indeed.

Putting aside all that why is it okay for guests to expect 5 star expectations while at Disney when their employees are getting paid worse than those at McDonalds? I am not saying either deserve poverty rates but at Disney there is a huge difference in regards to nonpaid time to get just GET into position and what you are allowed to look like at work. I mean why would anyone want to go through all the trouble of working at Disney when it is easier to work at McDonalds with an easier ladder of success and raise opportunities?

I mean...people want a golden experience at Disney. I think paying better for better quality and long term employees would help the overall experience at Disney. Instead of dealing with a new batch of kids every six months we would have cast members who are there for years who actually KNOW things and can give out answers other than I don't know. If we can't think humanely about the situation can't we think selfishly about it and how paying cast members more would better our vacations? Or should cast members just take up another job to make ends meet because life is unfair and kids don't need to see their parents and sleep is overrated?

Could'nt agree with you more! Took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[Fleis76]

Threads like this make me angry. Truly. A deep rage at what I perceive and firmly believe is ignorance, arrogance and just plain nastiness. The underlying thoughts are:

1.) Poor people are lazy and unmotivated and want to sit on their arses and do nothing and , worse, they want us to help them through social programs;
2.) Since 'I' worked my way up and am doing pretty good today, that means that any/every one must have the same opportunities and options available to them;
3.) There are plenty of jobs out there in the USA of the post-economic apocalypse and they are good jobs and well paying and people who don't want them are just snobby entitled kids.



I know people who used to make high five figures and six figures who have been unemployed for YEARS ... many have given up and rely on savings, family and friends to live. Not all is the BS American Dream that some fools still believe is the rule and not the exception.

I will admit right here that I am underemployed. The best work and most lucrative I have made in the last six years has sent me to Asia (something again, I know isn't open to any/every one).

I don't get the sheer stupidity of so many who think that this economy can sustain a healthy society without giving every American willing to work 40 hours a week enough money to pay for the basic necessities of life without major problems now and down the road.

And I come from a wealthy family, a VERY wealthy family and I still can't fathom this 'tude of (let em sink or swim, but I sure don't want any of my money going to help them and I also don't want business to be 'harmed'' -- the great lie of fair wages -- by giving people living wages.)

Nicely said!

 

[Fleis76]

What a lot of people on here don't seem to get is that the whole purpose of the minimum wage was to keep people OUT of poverty. The fact that it is no longer sufficient enough to do so is reason enough to raise it. End of argument.

 

[rael ramone]

I've posted this in other threads, but here's a thought to those who feel 'I don't want to have to pay for the CM's to get more $$$':

You already are.

You are paying for premium service. Premium maintenance. Premium cleanliness. Premium safety (which isn't just provided by security, but ride operators as well). It's implied that that is what you are getting. (The 'Disney Difference'). And it is priced into everything you spend $$$ on while you are on property. And part of the cost of premium service is the compensation to those who provide such service.

But when a CM isn't getting premium service compensation, and as a result is providing a level of service in line of what they are getting paid, YOU as the guest are being shortchanged. In essence, funds that are meant to go towards providing you the premium service that you paid for are being redirected to inflate the profit margin and, more likely than not, go towards even more stock buybacks of already inflated shares.

 

[BuddyThomas]

I just don't get the concept of tipping for someone who just hands you some food, does basic waiting on a table etc. That's a core required of the job and it's cost should be included in the price of the product.

Someone who makes a comment like this has clearly never waited on a table in their entire life. Before running your mouse trap, why don't you go pick up a couple of shifts at the Waffle House for less than minimum wage and then you can preach to us about your tipping philosophy.

 

[BuddyThomas]

Threads like this make me angry. Truly. A deep rage at what I perceive and firmly believe is ignorance, arrogance and just plain nastiness. The underlying thoughts are:

1.) Poor people are lazy and unmotivated and want to sit on their arses and do nothing and , worse, they want us to help them through social programs;
2.) Since 'I' worked my way up and am doing pretty good today, that means that any/every one must have the same opportunities and options available to them;
3.) There are plenty of jobs out there in the USA of the post-economic apocalypse and they are good jobs and well paying and people who don't want them are just snobby entitled kids.



I know people who used to make high five figures and six figures who have been unemployed for YEARS ... many have given up and rely on savings, family and friends to live. Not all is the BS American Dream that some fools still believe is the rule and not the exception.

I will admit right here that I am underemployed. The best work and most lucrative I have made in the last six years has sent me to Asia (something again, I know isn't open to any/every one).

I don't get the sheer stupidity of so many who think that this economy can sustain a healthy society without giving every American willing to work 40 hours a week enough money to pay for the basic necessities of life without major problems now and down the road.

And I come from a wealthy family, a VERY wealthy family and I still can't fathom this 'tude of (let em sink or swim, but I sure don't want any of my money going to help them and I also don't want business to be 'harmed'' -- the great lie of fair wages -- by giving people living wages.)

^
^
THIS.

You took the words right out of my mouth. Thanks for posting exactly what I was thinking.

 

[PhotoDave219]

I find it interesting that the same people who defend the free dining plan seem to be the same ones arguing against giving CMs a raise.

 

[CDavid]

Someone who makes a comment like this has clearly never waited on a table in their entire life. Before running your mouse trap, why don't you go pick up a couple of shifts at the Waffle House for less than minimum wage and then you can preach to us about your tipping philosophy.

While I completely agree that employees should be tipped appropriately (and generously), I really don't think anyone should be paid less than minimum wage. Those in service positions which are customarily tipped stand to make much more in tips than they do from an hourly wage, but they should still be assured of the same minimum which everyone else receives even if guests cheap out, somehow don't understand, or honestly forget to tip appropriately.

 

[tahqa]

While I completely agree that employees should be tipped appropriately (and generously), I really don't think anyone should be paid less than minimum wage. Those in service positions which are customarily tipped stand to make much more in tips than they do from an hourly wage, but they should still be assured of the same minimum which everyone else receives even if guests cheap out, somehow don't understand, or honestly forget to tip appropriately.

Federal law requires that tipped positions make at least minimum wage after all is said and done. However, and this is a big however, sometimes they don't. This is especially true of certain third party restaurants at Downtown Disney. A person I know used to work at this DTD restaurant and there were days that, once you take into account gas and tolls, she basically paid them to work that day. This restaurant has a tip pool that requires the servers to tip a portion of THEIR SALES, not their tips -- their sales, to the bartender, the sommelier and the bus boys. Regardless of whether they used any of those services. There were days that she paid out more from the tip pool than she got in tips. Not because she was a bad server, but because some people just DON'T TIP. Not only that, but at point they were tipping out to a bus boy that wasn't even working! The bus boy was on sick leave and the managers decided to pay the bus boy from the tip pool rather than on wages. I tried to get her to go to corporate or to state law enforcement, but she wouldn't because she needed the job to make ends meet and on most days she did make more than minimum.

Sorry for the rant, but there are huge problems with tipped position in the US in general and it irritates me to no end!

 

[Nubs70]

Federal law requires that tipped positions make at least minimum wage after all is said and done. However, and this is a big however, sometimes they don't. This is especially true of certain third party restaurants at Downtown Disney. A person I know used to work at this DTD restaurant and there were days that, once you take into account gas and tolls, she basically paid them to work that day. This restaurant has a tip pool that requires the servers to tip a portion of THEIR SALES, not their tips -- their sales, to the bartender, the sommelier and the bus boys. Regardless of whether they used any of those services. There were days that she paid out more from the tip pool than she got in tips. Not because she was a bad server, but because some people just DON'T TIP. Not only that, but at point they were tipping out to a bus boy that wasn't even working! The bus boy was on sick leave and the managers decided to pay the bus boy from the tip pool rather than on wages. I tried to get her to go to corporate or to state law enforcement, but she wouldn't because she needed the job to make ends meet and on most days she did make more than minimum.

Sorry for the rant, but there are huge problems with tipped position in the US in general and it irritates me to no end!

So why not pay decent wage and do away with tipping?

 

[ford91exploder]

While I completely agree that employees should be tipped appropriately (and generously), I really don't think anyone should be paid less than minimum wage. Those in service positions which are customarily tipped stand to make much more in tips than they do from an hourly wage, but they should still be assured of the same minimum which everyone else receives even if guests cheap out, somehow don't understand, or honestly forget to tip appropriately.

Especially since WDW bills itself as an international resort and in many countries you do not tip.