One Lil Spark
EPCOT Center Defender
Quote of the week!
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Slash and Burn ...
- Thread starter WDW1974
- Start date
Pumbas Nakasak
Heading for the great escape.
Saw him when he toured the UK many moons ago, fan bloody tastic.
WildcatDen
Well-Known Member
Okay Digger. While you are "Checking" I will offer my coaster opinion. You want to ride a real coaster - Move to OHIO
whylightbulb
Well-Known Member
True but some have called it a masterpiece. Also the fact that you have that site lauding it as "everybody's favorite AK attraction" shows that you consider it to be much greater than it truly is. Obviously I don't have to point out that you have every right to believe that and every right to post a website declaring your opinion. Maybe I need to develop a site with the opposite position.:lol:
Wow, you have just partially admitted what I've been trying to point out all along; Everest is not as good as any of the other attractions within the same scope. Of course where you and I disagree is in just how much it strays from the standard set by the WDI "old guard."
Yes Japan is certainly in a class all its own. I brought those examples up because anytime I can point out how pathetic most of the US attractions are compared to these I will take the opportunity. I'm not here to win arguments, I'm here for a cathartic release as well as to stir up as many readers as possible to think about where Disney is heading.
This is where I have to disagree vehemently. I don't think that Everest belongs on that "list." I think its scope was mostly compromised to hide some real problems within WDI's management at almost all levels. To me the point that you are making and will defend to the end is at direct odds with my main message. Everest is not one of the best and is a far cry from the product that WDI should be releasing in the coming years. I'm not repeating this to step up the argument, I'm disagreeing because I think the more people that agree with you the more the Disney standards will continue to slip.
I do agree that each attraction's success should be measured by the overall product and not by each individual element. That has been my mantra all along. But because you have asked for reasons behind my position I have had to break it down part by part. In many people's opinion, including the average every day guest, Everest does not belong on the list of "classics" because the overall impression is one of minimalism with respect to show. It comes off with the impression that they did just enough to get by but not enough to make most people exit the ride with any more than a sense that they had fun on a family coaster, but not to the level of a Disney fully themed experience.
I'm sorry but I can't agree. In terms of principals of attraction design this gets a pretty low grade in just about every category with the exception of ride technology and queue themeing. Specifically the use of available resources in budget, scope of show elements with respect to quantity, mix and quality, integration of show elements with the environment etc. are areas they missed the "train" in.
EpcotServo
Well-Known Member
This part's actually better written and valid, so I won't bring up my qualms with it.
ANNDDD here we go. (Yeah, you're not arguing TO me, you're just arguing to a crowd and I happen to be in there.)
A: Nothing wrong with a little reading.
B: You can't make an objective list of the "situation" if the "situation" is based on your opinion being true, which that does. Same with the "substance" remark.
I don't have much time this week to be reading or posting ... and Servo's salvo in the never-ending war of how great or crappy (and it's really no where near either) took me almost five minutes to read!
I'm sorry about that, you didn't have to read it.
:lol:
It's just (and I'm sure you understand how this feels) when you just come in that night and see all the posts you have to respond to, counter, while trying to not result to all-out name calling ( :lol: ) you just feel like you want leave the thread, let those comments stand, walk away and never come back.
That's a darn good idea, but right before I really do it, I hear this in my head...
[YOUTUBE]<object width="480" height="295"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/d6wRkzCW5qI&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/d6wRkzCW5qI&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="295"></embed></object>[/Youtube]
:lol: :wave:
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Is this thread approaching historic levels for this forum?
With regards to the original thread topic. It does appear that maintenance is the biggest thing that's slipping. What bothers me are things like a $10 million plus stuffed animal in Everest, consistently broken effects in Splash Mountain (although it seemed to be in pretty good shape when I was there in December), cool effects like the Angler Fish or charging Shark not working in Nemo, etc. There's no point in having these effects for a short period of time as a teaser if they're not going to be maintained.
When I went with newbies, some comments that I heard that weren't provoked by any dialogue on here were things like. "I was underwhelmed by Pirates of the Caribbean, you couldn't hear anything they were saying." We had the same complaints on here about skimping on the refurb. That same friend said of Finding Nemo, "it would have been cool if the shark would jump out at you."
With regards to the original thread topic. It does appear that maintenance is the biggest thing that's slipping. What bothers me are things like a $10 million plus stuffed animal in Everest, consistently broken effects in Splash Mountain (although it seemed to be in pretty good shape when I was there in December), cool effects like the Angler Fish or charging Shark not working in Nemo, etc. There's no point in having these effects for a short period of time as a teaser if they're not going to be maintained.
When I went with newbies, some comments that I heard that weren't provoked by any dialogue on here were things like. "I was underwhelmed by Pirates of the Caribbean, you couldn't hear anything they were saying." We had the same complaints on here about skimping on the refurb. That same friend said of Finding Nemo, "it would have been cool if the shark would jump out at you."
With regards to the original topic, Disney is really taking an unnecessary gamble that will put them behind the competition. Disney is waiting to find out if Rip, Ride, Rockit (Universal) and Manta (Sea World) will pay off for their respective resorts and using the economy as an excuse.
If the rides fail to spark an attendance increase and more interest in Orlando's non-Disney offerings, Disney will be content to sit on their laurels even longer, and when the economy improves they'll have no new rides to attract guests in a more confident market.
DON'T LET THIS HAPPEN. All you locals and people planning vacations in '09 need to take a day from Disney to check out the new rides. When WDW management realizes they're losing market share, they'll loosen the purse strings to make way for some of the exciting concepts WDI is dying to have built - Star Tours 2, Monsters Inc. coaster, Imagination 4.0, Little Mermaid.
If the rides fail to spark an attendance increase and more interest in Orlando's non-Disney offerings, Disney will be content to sit on their laurels even longer, and when the economy improves they'll have no new rides to attract guests in a more confident market.
DON'T LET THIS HAPPEN. All you locals and people planning vacations in '09 need to take a day from Disney to check out the new rides. When WDW management realizes they're losing market share, they'll loosen the purse strings to make way for some of the exciting concepts WDI is dying to have built - Star Tours 2, Monsters Inc. coaster, Imagination 4.0, Little Mermaid.
CBOMB
Active Member
I'm curious now. Who has WDW1974 run off from WDWMagic?
OK ... I can't help the fact I have connections. I can't help if that makes you or anyone else insecure. And I won't apologize for knowing folks (some of whom I have never mentioned here, but if I did might make your head explode -- so see there could be a positive to this after all!)
I will grant you one thing, and that is I didn't get what this site was all about at the start. I didn't realize just how young it skews. I didn't realize there were so many fans out there who thought WDW was perfect now or had never been better. Or how many fans believed wild Internet/CM/urban myths over facts. ... So, I guess I may have been very harsh when I first started posting here because I hate ignorance and I saw lots of it. Had I known all of the above, I wouldn't have changed my message one bit, but I may have presented it a bit differently.
What can I say? Back to work ... plus I lose interest easily when people aren't getting it.
But my main argument about the way WDW is run isn't ever going to change unless TWDC changes significantly. ... So that main idea is going to come through in any substanitive discussion. I don't like seeing WDW being WalMarted and hearing fans say it doesn't bother them (unless of course it effects their favorite park, attraction, entertainment, dining facility etc ... in which case it's Adventurer's Club end of the world crap all the time) ... I see WDW through the big picture.
I always play well with others ... well, no I don't. But that's largely because I seem to threaten people and make them feel insecure (if it makes you feel any better the same thing happens in the real world often with people who make a whole lot more money than I do and who have a whole lot more power too!) and they respond by cheapshotting me and I don't just let it go (although I'm learning to).
As to running off anyone, I honestly wasn't aware of it at all because I don't take this all that serious. Anyone who would run away because they can't handle online debates/ discusions about theme parks likely has serious issues and should seek medical care.
That is for sure. There's paranoia and then there is Mouse paranoia. Not magical at all.
If I wanted to prove how smart I was I wouldn't even be here! But yeah, I was real good in debate. It's why I could sit here and totally argue WDW's management's do-nothing approach, even when I 100%disagree with it.
And making people think and talk about things is the absolute main reason I am here. And to help wean some of the kiddies off the pixie dust!
Lee
Adventurer
Dude...seriously...you had to go there...
Besides, I'm pretty sure the AC closing is one of the signs of the end times.
(Kidding.....kinda...)
Lee
Adventurer
One Lil Spark
EPCOT Center Defender
:lookaroun
I'm going to demand pics with them wearing tiny mouse ears.
But I hearby nominate them as our official thread mascots.
All in favor?
One Lil Spark
EPCOT Center Defender
That's a question for the powers/oldtimers here.
I have the feeling this one will go on and on and on ... at least until WDW announces real changes ... and some kind of plan ... or vision for the future .... then, and I think it's years away, we could start a new thread looking forward to all the exciting things headed our way.
But until then ... well, I think this one's got legs.
Good points. All said before, but all bear repeating. Show quality is nonexistent these days at WDW ... and I don't care if many fans don't care about it ... because most guests (the casual kind that are supposedly so much more important to the company than we are) do care ... and when you overhear newbies making comments like 'this place is such a rip off' and 'I thought it was supposed to be so clean' and 'where are all the nice workers you hear about' etc ... you realize the issues are a whole lot bigger and deeper than some fans here would have you believe.
Me too.
We could make a list and I can send them all 'I'm so sorry for your loss' cards ...
Dude...seriously...you had to go there...
Besides, I'm pretty sure the AC closing is one of the signs of the end times.
(Kidding.....kinda...)
You know I loved the AC as much as anyone (well, maybe not quite), but I did enjoy it a lot.
But the bigger point there was too many fans seem to only care when WDW dumbs down/WalMarts its product if it directly AFFECTS THEM.
In other words, if you hate Small World, you don't care if Disney closes it and puts an ECV parking lot on the site. Or if you hate the Contemporary why would it matter to you if they DVC'd it? etc ... etc ...
I look at the entire picture. What's good for WDW, not so much what's good for WDW as far as my likes/dislikes but in general.
Too many fans are ... well ... self-involved when it comes to what WDW does.