Rooms available for cash, but not DVC?

epcotWSC

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
My wife and I are trying to book a DVC stay in October. It seems that every single resort in the entirety of WDW is completely blocked out. We're on a waiting list right now in order to find a room. Oddly enough, I go on wdw's website and do a search for cash and every single place is available. I don't understand how this could be. Could anyone enlighten me?
 

cbettua

Well-Known Member
Because DVC only has so many rooms whereas the resorts have more. It's one reason why I never bought DVC. Its really difficult to get the low point rooms unless you book far in advance.
 

slappy magoo

Well-Known Member
My wife and I are trying to book a DVC stay in October. It seems that every single resort in the entirety of WDW is completely blocked out. We're on a waiting list right now in order to find a room. Oddly enough, I go on wdw's website and do a search for cash and every single place is available. I don't understand how this could be. Could anyone enlighten me?

Are you saying that DVC rooms are available for cash but not for points?

Or that non-DVC resort rooms are available but not DVC rooms?

I'm not picking on you, being the internet grammar/syntax police, it's just they are two different questions, each with different potential answers.

I'm assuming you mean the first question, but I don't want to be wrong.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
It is true that DVC rooms on points are pretty much unavailable for October (and a lot of November, and most of December as well already). Since you are looking to book only 2 months in advance during Food & Wine, I completely understand that there isn't any availability. The reason that there are rooms available for cash reservations is that DVC does have to allow 2% of the rooms to be available for cash reservations. In addition to these, if anyone has traded out to RCI, or used their points for a cruise during this time, then DVC as to recoup those costs as well.

For those who may not know how the trades work - if someone books a cruise on points, then DVC pays for the cruise - same price as booking with cash. Then they turn around and have to recoup that cost by taking a DVC room, and renting it for cash. If enough people do this, it can take many rooms to recoup that money. There is probably a formula for determining how many of what size room it takes, but that is a closely guarded secret.

Sorry that you cannot get what you need. You really need to book at the 11 month window at your home resort, then try to change at the 7 month window for a different resort for Food & Wine. Same for the first few weeks of December as well. Anything less at certain times, and you will be out-of-luck. It's just how DVC works.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
Is it a direct correlation? What I mean is. I use my DVC points to cruise feb 1st-7.

So DVC rents my DVC room for those specific days?
That's where the secret formula comes in. Only a few select know if the system will free up, say a 1 bdr at your home resort during that week, or maybe they know that is a slow time, so the system uses one in May. We just don't know how it all works, and Disney isn't going to tell us. Heck, it may be that they take the rooms at the busiest times of the year (like during Food & Wine), just to be sure that the room is actually rented for cash. The other issue. If it doesn't get rented then, do they turn around and make it available at a different time, to ensure that they get their money back?? So many questions, and so little information about it.
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
That's where the secret formula comes in. Only a few select know if the system will free up, say a 1 bdr at your home resort during that week, or maybe they know that is a slow time, so the system uses one in May. We just don't know how it all works, and Disney isn't going to tell us. Heck, it may be that they take the rooms at the busiest times of the year (like during Food & Wine), just to be sure that the room is actually rented for cash. The other issue. If it doesn't get rented then, do they turn around and make it available at a different time, to ensure that they get their money back?? So many questions, and so little information about it.

Hmmmm

Feels like, as "owners" we should know this info.

One other question struck me. At what point does the cash room, when unsold, revert back to DVC? Or does it not?
 
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slappy magoo

Well-Known Member
Hmmmm

Feels like, as "owners" we should know this info.

One other question struck me. At one point does the cash room, when unsold, revert back to DVC? Or does it not?
My guess (and it's just a guess) would be that it does not. But I'd also bet that room or those points practically never go unused. If worse comes to worst, they probably "upgrade" someone staying at a Value or Mod they think might be susceptible to becoming a DVC member, see if it "sticks."
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
A very good question! I think that is part of the secret formula.

I don't like secrets.


My guess (and it's just a guess) would be that it does not. But I'd also bet that room or those points practically never go unused. If worse comes to worst, they probably "upgrade" someone staying at a Value or Mod they think might be susceptible to becoming a DVC member, see if it "sticks."

That's probably accurate. And it's definitely annoying.

I do wonder if what we were considering before, that they hoard their cash rooms for busy times is true. Imagine if BWV are 20% cash buyers(high I know) during F&W?!?!

That would drive me insane.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
I don't like secrets.




That's probably accurate. And it's definitely annoying.

I do wonder if what we were considering before, that they hoard their cash rooms for busy times is true. Imagine if BWV are 20% cash buyers(high I know) during F&W?!?!

That would drive me insane.
That is also why they will probably not tell us!
 

slappy magoo

Well-Known Member
Let's slow down a bit....

NEVER FORGET that one of the PRINCIPAL owners of all DVC properties is (ta dah) The Disney Corporation.

As legal point owners? They may rent THEIR points just like anyone else :). There is no "secret" - you are seeing a LEGAL POINT OWNER renting their points, as they see fit. They acquire these points thru foreclosures and ROFR. Then, they RENT them - at whatever price they deem appropriate. Worry when the price becomes $0 :).
Sure, and what they're probably doing is what we as members aren't supposed to do, book rooms during high-point periods (however they acquired or re-acquired those points), and then renting the room out. I'm sure right now you'll find people doing that on ebay, auctioning a room at say BCV or BWV during F&G for ridonkulous profit. Or a MK view at BLT during Christmas.
Of course, those people are doing a "what the market will bear" thing, versus WDW where the prices are set and not subject to a bidding war.
 

sxeensweet

Love a little Disney every day!! ;)
Because DVC only has so many rooms whereas the resorts have more. It's one reason why I never bought DVC. Its really difficult to get the low point rooms unless you book far in advance.
Not true. The resorts do not have the majority of ownership, DVC has the most rooms at each resort. A certain amount is held for paid guests but it is a small fraction/percentage at each resort. The reason they always have stuff available for paying guests is because most rooms at DVC resorts are pretty pricey so therefore do not book up as quickly. We know because we used to pay for these rooms before we joined DVC. So that is not why people cannot get a room in Oct. This time is very popular for DVC members and you need to book at exactly the 11 or 7 month windows to find something. We had no problem getting a room at AKV this year at that time. We even booked in May later than we normally would and had plenty of choices available. :)
 

tjkraz

Active Member
Because DVC only has so many rooms whereas the resorts have more. It's one reason why I never bought DVC. Its really difficult to get the low point rooms unless you book far in advance.

That's true of any timeshare--the low supply & high demand locations will disappear first. But the upside is tremendous savings to those who can afford to book that far in advance.

Is it a direct correlation? What I mean is. I use my DVC points to cruise feb 1st-7.

So DVC rents my DVC room for those specific days?

No. Home resorts are recognized--if you use Bay Lake Tower points for a cruise, BLT villa(s) are sold for cash. But the exact villas and dates are roughly equal across the calendar.

Disney doesn't really have a vested interest in promoting certain villa nights over others. They have tens-of-thousands of their own rooms to rent to guests, with thousands of them vacant any given night. And demand for DVC villas isn't tremendously high due to a variety of factors including the availability of 3rd party point rentals.

To a DVC owner, this may seem like a potential area for fraud and abuse. But Disney doesn't view it as anything more than a paper transaction. Simply put, even during F&W Festival time, there aren't dozens of cash guests lining up to pay $600-1000 per night for a DVC villa at BW or BC.

One other question struck me. At what point does the cash room, when unsold, revert back to DVC? Or does it not?

It never goes back to DVC. Rooms acquired by CRO / WDTC via these exchange programs are theirs to do with as they please. In many cases they simply go unused...like the thousands of empty hotel rooms each night.

Some may be used for upgrades but rarely does Disney send people from a cash resort to someplace like OKW or SSR just because there's a villa opening.

Overall, there's a huge number of nights where rooms just sit empty. That's a big part of the reason why it costs so many points to go on a Disney cruise or stay at a non-DVC hotel. The low success rate in selling villas to cash guests means Disney / DVC needs to acquire a lot of points in order to cover the cost of those trade programs.

Let's slow down a bit....

NEVER FORGET that one of the PRINCIPAL owners of all DVC properties is (ta dah) The Disney Corporation.

As legal point owners? They may rent THEIR points just like anyone else :). There is no "secret" - you are seeing a LEGAL POINT OWNER renting their points, as they see fit. They acquire these points thru foreclosures and ROFR. Then, they RENT them - at whatever price they deem appropriate. Worry when the price becomes $0 :).

While that's true, most of what we're taking about here is due to the exchange programs.

Only Grand Floridian and Aulani are in active sales now. Those are the resorts at which DVC has hundreds-of-thousands (or in the case of Aulani, millions) of unsold points.

DVC keeps some modest inventory of points on-hand for older properties via foreclosures and ROFR. But for the most part, those points merely sit in inventory waiting for a buyer. They aren't converted to hotel rooms.
 

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