New Disneyland Parking Garage and Transportation Hub

[Darkbeer1]

But that's outrageous. The hike from the bus stops at Harbor and Ball into the Harbor CM lot to the CM shuttle stop is yet another hardship for minimum-wage CMs. This is ridiculous. Closing the city bus stops on Harbor close to Harbor Point is absurd.

Sorry you feel that way, but this project, and many other related ones, are designed for everyone, but Disney is looking at Guests first.

Moving CM Parking farther away to allow closer guest parking. How does the CM's that are being forced to park at Angel Stadium feel now?

The city is trying to improve traffic flow for everyone. Maybe Disney will opt for a CM Shuttle just for bus CM's at the new Transportation Hub Stop?

We are looking forward, and based on someone who works with OCTA for the city of Anaheim, there are preliminary plans in place for a study the impact of the route change.

And what do the CM's that take OCTA route 50 do now? As I understand it, exit at Clementine and walk to the Katella CM lot and its shuttle.

 

[Old Mouseketeer]

. . . How does the CM's that are being forced to park at Angel Stadium feel now?

Generally, screwed, I believe.

And what do the CM's that take OCTA route 50 do now? As I understand it, exit at Clementine and walk to the Katella CM lot and its shuttle.

That's a much more reasonable distance than what you are suggesting for H-Lot.

 

[Deleted member 107043]

But that's outrageous. The hike from the bus stops at Harbor and Ball into the Harbor CM lot to the CM shuttle stop is yet another hardship for minimum-wage CMs. This is ridiculous. Closing the city bus stops on Harbor close to Harbor Point is absurd.

I agree. The logistics around this thing as we know it sucks unless you're a customer arriving to the property by car or in a shuttle.

 

[Darkbeer1]

I agree with the CM's getting the short end of the stick, but Disney wants to expand, not just with Star Wars Land, but future DCA expansion (Marvel?), and then a 4th Hotel that will take way a lot of current Downtown Disney Parking for guests. And then what to do with DtD guests and the new 4th Hotel guests, underground parking might be part of the Hotel project, but won't be enough to replace what is lost and the extra needed.

The Guests in a lot of ways pay the paychecks that CM's get.

And what about the Anaheim Convention Center Expansion and the need for the city to use the Toy Story Lot more often, that will force more CM's to give up their spaces in the Katella Lot.

So will the Anaheim Lot become a temporary home for those currently on the Ball Road lot (H-Lot), to allow construction of the Structure to be built?

We are looking into the future, but then Disney needs to get city permission for all these new CM parking spaces to be added/built, so Disney will have to work with the city to come up with an workable plan that addresses everyone, and yes, that does include CM's. But also many other groups.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Also, Disney has other issues with minimum wage and those using public transit.

Los Angeles County is raising their Minimum Wage faster than Orange County is. So if you currently taking LA Metro 460 to go to work, which is better? Finding a job that might pay a bit better, and less transit time? Universal Studios is right off the LA Metro Red Line subway service, and if you can get an extra $1 per hour and save on commute time, why not apply there?

Disney does have to deal with what to do, as they do need to keep the CM's happy for multiple reasons.

Heck, the Knott's employees that use the LA Metro route 460 currently have a long walk to the main Western Gate that employees use.

My guess, the H-Lot gets a major revamp, and that a new CM Shuttle stop is added close to Harbor Blvd, and not just in the middle of the lot.

 

[LongLiveTheKing]

I have a problem with the numbers here. There is already a permit for a CM lot on Anaheim Way and the land has been cleared. This would ostensibly be replacement for CM parking in Pumbaa.

But I have issues with your conjecture about Simba and Ball Lots. Are you positing that a structure at Harbor Lot will replace CM parking in those? But what will mitigate the lost parking while H-Lot is closed for construction. Do you really expect them to force CMs from all three hotels to shuttle in from H-lot, along with CMs in DL Park on the NW side? This covers everything from Critter Country to the future SWL, TT, and various Entertainment and Facilities departments.

Combined with the possibility of closing the Harbor bus stops, this is a hot steaming manure dump on CMs. If the economy continues to improve and Disney returns to the massive turnover rates and high CM vacancies of 10-15 years ago, the last thing they need to do is further degrade the CM experience.

So basically Disney is screwing over the Harbor hotels, the people staying at them AND CMs.

 

[Old Mouseketeer]

The Guests in a lot of ways pay the paychecks that CM's get.

Mostly, aside from corporate sponsorships and tax breaks. More accurately, they pay constantly rising admission fees for ever-decreasing quality and grossly inflated executive salaries and corporate profits. Walt was no saint, but he had a much more enlightened view of balancing profits against quality of product.

 

[Darkbeer1]

LLTK, alas there is only so much land, and the plans all have more vehicles coming to the area, and that HAS to be addressed.

But once again, it is the City in the "driver's seat" in regards to the traffic issues, and Disney has to play along. Can they try and get some changes made? Of course, but you still have city codes in regards to how many parking spaces you need for a project anywhere in the city, and that is hard to get changed.

OCTA is a government agency in charge of traffic in general in the reagon, and not just bus service. They are the agency in charge of the freeway improvements and other types of transit, including bike lanes, and bus service. Anaheim's Mayor, Tom Tait is on the board.

So it is tough to try and blame Disney in these matters, as stated, they need to work WITH the city and other governmental agencies to move forward.

Edited to add, OM, yeah, I know, but in reality, guests don't have to go to Disneyland, they can use their feet and vote by picking other options. Also, CM's have the same right, use their feet and find a new job. I know in this day and age, not that easy, but I know plenty of CM's that work elsewhere, and some stop working at Disney as they are getting better pay and treatment elsewhere.

 

[MoonRakerSCM]

So basically Disney is screwing over the Harbor hotels, the people staying at them AND CMs.

Yup, and further catering to high paying customers staying on property and the new high end hotels over near Gardenwalk. They're a business and will cater accordingly.

As far as I'm concerened, in the end, Disney knows it'll own the Harbor hotels... way down the line, they will. In my opinion they'll turn the whole space into the first east side Disney hotel (we're talking several years/decades down the line). Disney is and has always been in it for the long game... this is just another step of Mickey slowly but surely tightening the noose.

 

[Old Mouseketeer]

LLTK, alas there is only so much land, and the plans all have more vehicles coming to the area, and that HAS to be addressed.

But once again, it is the City in the "driver's seat" in regards to the traffic issues, and Disney has to play along. Can they try and get some changes made? Of course, but you still have city codes in regards to how many parking spaces you need for a project anywhere in the city, and that is hard to get changed.

OCTA is a government agency in charge of traffic in general in the reagon, and not just bus service. They are the agency in charge of the freeway improvements and other types of transit, including bike lanes, and bus service. Anaheim's Mayor, Tom Tait is on the board.

So it is tough to try and blame Disney in these matters, as stated, they need to work WITH the city and other governmental agencies to move forward.

No, it's very easy to blame Disney on a whole host of short-sighted decisions.
1. Waiting so long to start on the East Parking Structure that has been part of the Master Plan since Westcot.
2. Being profligate with their real estate, especially with DCA. The only thing they can't make more of is land on the site of the original parking lot/DCA. I love Grand Californian, but it eats up a lot of land on the East side of West St./Disney Dr. They have built multiple support facilities at grade, including the CM cafe. They could have placed the green buildings that are on Harbor South of ToT on the back of the Cadillac range and made them three or four story glass office buildings facing Katella.
3. Not building a structure for CM parking at Harbor and Ball from the beginning.
4. Constructing single-story facilities in Ball Lot (North of Mickey and Friends) instead of multi-story. Granted, the smaller building which contains pyro storage probably couldn't be multi-story, but the Emergency Command Post takes up a lot of space.
5. They show no signs of having a coherent master plan. Every decision seems to be more reactive than proactive. First they were relocating WDI to the building North of USCIS, then it went in with Company D on Lewis St. Now they're moving Maintenance Base out of the basement parkside in the Old Administration Building (under DL Security) and offsite and many longtime CMs are transferring out because they don't want to relocate off-site. They convert several CM gates, including Hollywoodland and DCA Disney Drive to be unmanned, then have to set up folding tables with staff for bag check. Now they are bring MSEP back from FL, but keeping Paint with no room for five resident parades in the float building or costuming.
6. WDI is being so tight-lipped about SWL, the operational departments have virtually no info to start pre-planning. Yes, I know you have your rebel spies just like I do, but even department heads are completely in the dark. Hell, I know a lot of CMs including managers who come to sites like this to find out what the hell is going on.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Oh my gosh, Old Mouseketeer, you are hitting the head on so many things...

I truly feel and care about CM's, many have been long term friends, and from every level of chain of command.

It is scary that I can find out more than a DLR manager by talking to a "rival" company senior exec, or a retired CM who still communicate with the current replacements.

I am not trying to give Disney a pass, but when you first posted, you were talking about rerouting the OCTA and LA Metro buses for a couple of blocks and its impact, and that really falls onto the city and other government agencies.

And by no means have they been smart, just look at ARTIC and how much they spent on Monorail and rail system plans and studies, and now looking at maybe if we are lucky a Rapid Bus service, plenty of blame to pass around.

 

[TP2000]

Sorry you feel that way, but this project, and many other related ones, are designed for everyone, but Disney is looking at Guests first.

Bingo. The paying customers need to come first, then once they are taken care of you can figure out how to take care of the employees. The bus routes will be reworked, new stops will be created.

Quite frankly, that bus stop on Harbor right on Disneyland's doorstep is an eyesore. Every time I drive by there I see homeless folks camped out, or the mentally deranged talking to the monorail beam while a handful of CM's in their uniforms try to pretend its not happening.

That type of transit facility needs to be moved elsewhere, it's just not a good visual at Disneyland's doorstep. Neither the homeless camps or the uniformed CM's sprawled out on their phones still wearing their Haunted Mansion uniforms.

 

[TP2000]

No, it's very easy to blame Disney on a whole host of short-sighted decisions.
1. Waiting so long to start on the East Parking Structure that has been part of the Master Plan since Westcot.
2. Being profligate with their real estate, especially with DCA. The only thing they can't make more of is land on the site of the original parking lot/DCA. I love Grand Californian, but it eats up a lot of land on the East side of West St./Disney Dr. They have built multiple support facilities at grade, including the CM cafe. They could have placed the green buildings that are on Harbor South of ToT on the back of the Cadillac range and made them three or four story glass office buildings facing Katella.
3. Not building a structure for CM parking at Harbor and Ball from the beginning.
4. Constructing single-story facilities in Ball Lot (North of Mickey and Friends) instead of multi-story. Granted, the smaller building which contains pyro storage probably couldn't be multi-story, but the Emergency Command Post takes up a lot of space.
5. They show no signs of having a coherent master plan. Every decision seems to be more reactive than proactive. First they were relocating WDI to the building North of USCIS, then it went in with Company D on Lewis St. Now they're moving Maintenance Base out of the basement parkside in the Old Administration Building (under DL Security) and offsite and many longtime CMs are transferring out because they don't want to relocate off-site. They convert several CM gates, including Hollywoodland and DCA Disney Drive to be unmanned, then have to set up folding tables with staff for bag check. Now they are bring MSEP back from FL, but keeping Paint with no room for five resident parades in the float building or costuming.
6. WDI is being so tight-lipped about SWL, the operational departments have virtually no info to start pre-planning. Yes, I know you have your rebel spies just like I do, but even department heads are completely in the dark. Hell, I know a lot of CMs including managers who come to sites like this to find out what the hell is going on.

Some of that sounds like just normal change-of-plans in any big project or large piece of property, but some of that sounds like dysfunctional leadership. Disney often seems like an organization where the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. I can only imagine how frustrating that would be for the CM's.

But then again, a few of those things sound like just normal big-company struggles.

 

[NobodyElse]

There is already a permit for a CM lot on Anaheim Way and the land has been cleared.

Can you help specify where this future lot is? I'm unclear on the location.

Thanks.

 

[180º]

I have a problem with the numbers here. There is already a permit for a CM lot on Anaheim Way and the land has been cleared. This would ostensibly be replacement for CM parking in Pumbaa.

But I have issues with your conjecture about Simba and Ball Lots. Are you positing that a structure at Harbor Lot will replace CM parking in those? But what will mitigate the lost parking while H-Lot is closed for construction. Do you really expect them to force CMs from all three hotels to shuttle in from H-lot, along with CMs in DL Park on the NW side? This covers everything from Critter Country to the future SWL, TT, and various Entertainment and Facilities departments.

Combined with the possibility of closing the Harbor bus stops, this is a hot steaming manure dump on CMs. If the economy continues to improve and Disney returns to the massive turnover rates and high CM vacancies of 10-15 years ago, the last thing they need to do is further degrade the CM experience.

I feel you, particularly about BCML which I loved as a cast member.

But even more infuriating than giving up my parking space to a guest to park in Angels Stadium or spending fifteen minutes circling the TDA structure for a spot was the fact that traffic in the area was horrible and so was parking and Disney was doing nothing about it. I'd spend up to a half hour gridlocked on Ball Road.

That is why this whole Eastern Gateway thing is so needed. Things will get a little worse before they get a lot better, but I believe this will greatly improve the situation for everyone in the long run. Honestly, fixing Disney's relationship with its cast must go well beyond parking, though I do believe this will actually help and not hurt Cast Members once it's finished.

 

[flynnibus]

Wonder what the access to Gardenwalk will be like... this seems like a god send to that struggling property.

 

[NobodyElse]

Wonder what the access to Gardenwalk will be like... this seems like a god send to that struggling property.

Yes, I've been thinking about them in the grand scheme of things. It seems like there's a bit of a perfect storm brewing. Consider the illustration below:

With three adjacent, above average hotels going in (plots in blue) and the new pedestrian portal (little green spot) I'd be putting plans in place to do everything possible to funnel hotel guests through my mall as they go to and from the parks. And if I had extra cash (a tall order considering all the rent they must be losing due to their chronic vacancy rate) I'd consider working with the city to run some sort of pedestrian bridge from their second level (near the future HOB) to a convenient spot across the street (orange line would be an example route).

We'll see...

 

[Disney Analyst]

Oh my gosh, Old Mouseketeer, you are hitting the head on so many things...

I truly feel and care about CM's, many have been long term friends, and from every level of chain of command.

It is scary that I can find out more than a DLR manager by talking to a "rival" company senior exec, or a retired CM who still communicate with the current replacements.

I am not trying to give Disney a pass, but when you first posted, you were talking about rerouting the OCTA and LA Metro buses for a couple of blocks and its impact, and that really falls onto the city and other government agencies.

And by no means have they been smart, just look at ARTIC and how much they spent on Monorail and rail system plans and studies, and now looking at maybe if we are lucky a Rapid Bus service, plenty of blame to pass around.

I know it's been said but I am so excited you are here!! As Micechat was the first real community I found back in 2005 I have followed your posts for so long. I was wondering where you were! I was reminiscing on all those great world of color construction updates.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Wonder what the access to Gardenwalk will be like... this seems like a god send to that struggling property.

As I mentioned, the city would LOVE to have a Pedestrian bridge over Disney Way near the new Disney owned Pedestrian entrance to help with traffic flow.

We know that the JW Marriott has a deal with AGW, which as I understand AGW owns the land and will lease the property to the JW Marriott owners (Prospera in combination with O'Connell Hotels & Hospitality) .

We also know that Wincome will build on the current Anaheim Plaza Hotel lot.

But can the city get them to pay for the entire thing (Based on what Las Vegas paid for one Pedestrian bridge on the strip lately, estimated about $5 million). Or will the city help chip in to make it a group deal (and of course, the city would go looking for grants from other government agencies (just the way it works).

The city planners currently are working with the fact no bridge is going to be built, but they do have "future considerations" in their planning, which can be implemented quickly if the city can make a deal. But neither new 4-Star Hotel has gone in front of the Planning Commission yet. (The city agrees that the proposed properties meet the zoning requirement and the basics to qualify for the tax break, so long as they meet the "4 Star" standards built into the agreement). But the "details" are still in the works.

As for AGW, they got a winner with Live Nation, owners of the House of Blues, but alas, struck out, as Toby Keith's new place fell through about 2/3'rds the way during construction due to the Toby Keith's group running out of money, and have difficulties with other locations.

Amazing, the group of restaurants at AGW facing Katella have been successful and happy. (I am headed to a cooking class at Roy's later this month), but the internal areas have struggled, with some original stores doing OK as they had the right mix of products.

If Toby's Keith was completed, AGW was in a very good position to grow and profit. Now, they are looking for a company to take over the Toby Keith's location, which already had some of the internal equipment installed (and becomes AGW property due to a lease improvements clause that is standard in the business), so if they can find something of a restaurant/entertainment group that is a good mix with the restaurants on Katella and the House of Blues, then the smaller locations can come in to sell merchandise that matches up with those guests, the JW Marriott guests, the Convention Center attendees (which has been better for the complex than Disney visitors). But AGW is going nowhere.

 

[Darkbeer1]

I know it's been said but I am so excited you are here!! As Micechat was the first real community I found back in 2005 I have followed your posts for so long. I was wondering where you were! I was reminiscing on all those great world of color construction updates.

I find it interesting, since I would say more people have seen my work and information since I left MiceAge. Just found out one of my projects that I worked on is finally being released in early January. (and my cousin who lives in Canada freaked out as she is a big fan of the show when it was announced, and I could finally let the cat out of the bag).

And it isn't just TV stuff, it is still print, but now it is presented differently and in different formats.

A couple of stories in regards to my past that I am happy about. First is the famous July 18th, 1955 opening day issue. History is History, and while Disney has every right to change things today, they can't erase the past. (Pretty sure a lot of Disney folks would like to have DCA version 1.0, plus all the 1.XX projects go away, and focus on DCA 2.0) Anyway, both Bob Gurr and Tim O'Day have come out after they retired and have agreed that to Walt Disney and the original group, opening day was July 18th, and was treated as such until Walt Disney passed on. (They had to tow the company line when still employed by the company)

The other one which is TV related (and I have plenty, most of which I can't talk about). We were filming at a casino that had a roller coaster as part of their property. And as is typical, early morning filming to have less impact on operations. I was sent out to find "first time riders" who were willing to ride and be part of the show. So at 7 AM I am talking to a group of let's say, female "retirees" have a quick breakfast. I came over, introduced myself, and went into "sell" mode to see if they would ride.... I think they thought the devil showed up to tempt them to join him in being placed on the ride causing their deaths... At the end, I got the answer NO WAY, but we did get a laugh and I made sure the casino wouldn't come after us (production company). (And heck, giving them some free play vouchers helped out a lot

Now back on topic.... But thanks Evan