The Spirited 8th Wonder (WDW's Future & You!)

Jennifer66

Jennifer66

Well-Known Member
"Walmarting" is the perfect term to discuss what Disney is doing with its resorts, both DVC and others. Walmarting is the homogenizing of the retail sector to emulate the "success" of Walmart's business model. Like Walmart, Disney will eventually make their resorts so homogeneous that the specialness may disappear even more. It may work in the short term, but is bound to fail in the long. I for one, have no desire for a Walmart vacation. (Or a regular Walmart, for that matter.)
 
S

seascape

Well-Known Member
BWV said:
@WDW1974, you have done it again. Well done. You're the best. The Disney careers web site has a new posting for a V.P. of Deluxe Resorts.

https://sjobs.brassring.com/tgwebhost/jobdetails.aspx?partnerid=25348&siteid=5039&jobid=204925
Click to expand...
All that post shows is that Disney will not get rid of the deluxe hotels. They may put in more DVC's, but that is what the market wants. Marriott is still expanding their timeshares so why shouldn't Disney? Also the average hotel occupancy in the country is well below what Disney has in Orlando and anything over 80% is considered fantastic and Disney will have over 80% occupancy this year and was at 79% in 2013. I know it's not the 86% they had in 2006 but it's still a great number no what anyone here says.
 
Cesar R M

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
CDavid said:
Page 7, post# 133.


One point (I'll just throw out) about Disney deluxe resorts and comparable off-site competition is that the Hotel Plaza establishments tend to be almost ignored, despite being technically on Disney property and having very similar complimentary bus transportation to the parks. Of course, they are a fraction of the price of Disney's deluxe properties - and in fact less than Disney's own value resorts.

What these hotels primarily lack - and critically - is that it doesn't say Disney in the name. That's a far more powerful incentive than it should be by any reasonable standard. As the least expensive on-property rooms, yet with typically greater amenities than Disney offers, Hotel Plaza ought to be booked solid - but it usually isn't. People are instead opting for Disney value, moderate, and deluxe rooms at several times the price.

If Disney really want to know why it currently (and will continue to) have trouble filling its deluxe resorts, the executives need only look in the mirror. It is a problem of Disney's own making, and as usual of late, the powers that be fundamentally do not understand the business of theme parks (or, in particular, the Walt Disney World Resort), so they don't understand how to fix the problem.
Click to expand...
Seems the PLAZA hotel is gone? I try to search for it and the address sends me for "bhotelsandresorts" .

did they change ownership?
 
scout68

scout68

Well-Known Member
xdan0920 said:
Real quick...

The topic is, TDO is cannibalizing one of it's signature resorts to make more DVC villas. Most of us seem to agree this is BAD news, and indicative of a deep seeded management culture that is adversely affecting WDW. The topic may have run out of steam a bit, and that's fine. Let the thread simmer. Eventually, someone, wether it's 74 or Lee or @George, or whoever, will come through, and post something that spurs the discussion on.

A lot of people are just posting because they want to post, OMG, it's so important for me to post!!!!


Edit to add....

If you don't like the way this forum is moderated, then go somewhere else to post your super important, super interesting, thoughts.
Click to expand...

Well summarized! Although It might be a bit long for a thread title. :)
 
Cesar R M

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
seascape said:
All that post shows is that Disney will not get rid of the deluxe hotels. They may put in more DVC's, but that is what the market wants. Marriott is still expanding their timeshares so why shouldn't Disney? Also the average hotel occupancy in the country is well below what Disney has in Orlando and anything over 80% is considered fantastic and Disney will have over 80% occupancy this year and was at 79% in 2013. I know it's not the 86% they had in 2006 but it's still a great number no what anyone here says.
Click to expand...
You cant compare the average rates of a country vs a very hotspot tourism zone as big as orlando.
Specially when you have some heavy weights as Universal, Seaworld and Walt Disney World in the close vicinity.
Even more when these heavyweights attracts insane amounts of worldwide visitors.
 
S

seascape

Well-Known Member
Comparing Disney hotel occupancy to the rest of Orlando would then be fair and Disney is higher that the Orlando occupancy rate. Disney also has higher rates as we all know. In fact the rates for Disney value hotels are more like the rest of Orlando mid priced rooms and Disney midpriced are actually high priced. I will also agree the deluxe rooms are over priced and under delivered.
 
Last edited:
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
Jennifer66 said:
"Walmarting" is the perfect term to discuss what Disney is doing with its resorts, both DVC and others. Walmarting is the homogenizing of the retail sector to emulate the "success" of Walmart's business model
Click to expand...

Huh? Isn't that like saying "putting 'ing on the end of a noun makes it a verb meaning to emulate the noun"?

The Walmart business model is not homogenization. It's about ruthless cost controls and scaling to be able to gain the greatest price control possible -- usually at the expense of quality and customer service. Drive costs down, drive volume up, and bully your vendors and competition through scale.

Walmarting in the hotels is more about the lowering of quality and aiming the product at the lowered expectations of an audience that doesn't know what it's missing or doesn't care... all in the pursuit of the dollar taking priority over obligation or service.

Instead of aspiring to be the best or deliver a quality product, the model is success through cost controls and volume. I don't see how that connects with "homogenizing of the retail sector" or "homogenizing of the hotels". Rather than making them all the same in trying to make them uniform.. it's making them all the same through cost cutting leaving only the common elements behind.
 
Pumbas Nakasak

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
flynnibus said:
Huh? Isn't that like saying "putting 'ing on the end of a noun makes it a verb meaning to emulate the noun"?

The Walmart business model is not homogenization. It's about ruthless cost controls and scaling to be able to gain the greatest price control possible -- usually at the expense of quality and customer service. Drive costs down, drive volume up, and bully your vendors and competition through scale.

Walmarting in the hotels is more about the lowering of quality and aiming the product at the lowered expectations of an audience that doesn't know what it's missing or doesn't care... all in the pursuit of the dollar taking priority over obligation or service.

Instead of aspiring to be the best or deliver a quality product, the model is success through cost controls and volume. I don't see how that connects with "homogenizing of the retail sector" or "homogenizing of the hotels". Rather than making them all the same in trying to make them uniform.. it's making them all the same through cost cutting leaving only the common elements behind.
Click to expand...
Nothing to do with milk then.
 
crispy

crispy

Well-Known Member
So...moderates turning into DVC. Is that actually happening? If so, how is that going to work? GoofGoof made some good speculations, but I would love to hear how this would work. Also, any idea if they would turn something like the AoA suites into DVC? They are a good idea in theory, but the prices are high and they seem to be always offering a discount so I would speculate they aren't as popular as expected.
 
Jennifer66

Jennifer66

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
Huh? Isn't that like saying "putting 'ing on the end of a noun makes it a verb meaning to emulate the noun"?

The Walmart business model is not homogenization. It's about ruthless cost controls and scaling to be able to gain the greatest price control possible -- usually at the expense of quality and customer service. Drive costs down, drive volume up, and bully your vendors and competition through scale.

Walmarting in the hotels is more about the lowering of quality and aiming the product at the lowered expectations of an audience that doesn't know what it's missing or doesn't care... all in the pursuit of the dollar taking priority over obligation or service.

Instead of aspiring to be the best or deliver a quality product, the model is success through cost controls and volume. I don't see how that connects with "homogenizing of the retail sector" or "homogenizing of the hotels". Rather than making them all the same in trying to make them uniform.. it's making them all the same through cost cutting leaving only the common elements behind.
Click to expand...

Yes, I am well aware what Walmart is/does with their business model, which is why I have not stepped foot in one for over 12 years. Walmart IS making cheap retail the same across the US with their "pursuit of the dollar" and, IMO, WDW is doing the same thing with their cheapening of the brand, which seems obvious in their DVC expansion. It's an overall business model that I cannot support.

And, yes to your first statement about the ing on a noun--it does. It harkened back to Max Apple's story "The Oranging of America."
 
WDW1974

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
GrammieBee said:
In any case, if someone was telling us not to, we wouldn't pay any attention to them. I agree that a deluxe resort hotel room may not be worth the rack rate. They are, except maybe the Grand Floridian, four star hotels. If we could not get a discount we would book a campsite in Fort Wildernes and rent a fifth wheel trailer. A much better financial value and we would still be on property. Value is such a subjective concept. At our age the value of a hotel roon on property has much more to do with intangibles such as memories, convenience and a leasurely pace to just enjoy the surroundings.
Click to expand...

I would say the VAST majority of WDW resorts are of the 2.5-3.5 star variety in the real world. A few, DAK Lodge comes to mind, gets pushed to 4-star based on its incredible theming, dining and a truly 'only at WDW' follow (the animal viewing areas).

Most WDW resorts are just not that special, largely because they are poorly maintained and neglected and missing the type of services one would expect at that level.

Towels, across the board, are embarrassingly bad.
 
WDW1974

WDW1974

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Cesar R M said:
isnt the Waldorf Astoria better quality than the Orlando Four Seasons?
I'm unsure how they rank in the US(quality wise).

but the RIU, Waldorf and Four Seasons are usually of the top of the top in my country.
Click to expand...

Four Seasons is generally considered the very highest end of the luxury chain market. Waldorf is not far behind. And since FS-WDW hasn't opened yet, I don't know how it can be ranked anyway.
 
omurice

omurice

Well-Known Member
WDW1974 said:
I have used DVC points THREE times to stay at WDW in my life. Two were points gifted me from friends for one bedroom units at the BW. Last year, my girlfriend and I stayed at OKW (studio) and DAK Lodge (one bedroom) on points that she purchased before she met me.

I have never paid a penny to stay at WDW DVC resorts except when I booked units (with CM or AP discounts) many years ago through Disney as a 'cash renter'.
Click to expand...

This is not an attack on you, I'm trying to get to the heart of where this thesis of "DVC is destroying WDW" came from. Because I think it has a lot to do with this concept (or call to arms?) of not spending.

That you don't spend at WDW, you're saying something there loud and clear, and you do repeat that from time to time. But what are you calling for and why do you suppose we should follow if you are calling for that?

Those of us who spend at Disney are doing wrong? I can't maingate into the park or stay for free, there's no morality decision for me at all. I can go there or I cannot go there is my decision. Going there costs.



PS - My assumption above is, you're positing that spending at Disney is somehow immoral. And that spending on DVC is perhaps the worst possible thing in existence. And it's hard to agree with that, totally. I can agree that DVC is NOT entirely good for WDW. There are aspects to DVC, the speed with which it can alter a well-loved resort permanently, that are shocking. But it appears to stem from a bedrock belief of "spending at Disney, esp. anything DVC related, is immoral", a belief I'm not on the same page with (yet, but closer than a year ago certainly). If you're NOT saying any of those things, then sorry and please disregard.
 
Last edited:

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom