DVC has changed the resell rules

[Disneykidder]

For a person like me who is interested in DCL and ABD, we will now have to buy in direct. So, yeah, they are now making more money off of me. Instead of me looking for a resale that works for me, I will now buy new and they will get that extra cash.

 

[DVC Dave]

Doesn't bother me at all. Price may go down if i sell, but i wouldn't really wanty to sell anyway!

 

[tjkraz]

It seems that using DVC points on Disney resorts would be a win for them. It's one of the least desireable ways to use DVC points based on the $ value per point formula. It's also keeping customers at Disney, which helps in the overall product sales category. I guess you could argue that pushing resale contract trades out to RCI would bring new faces to DVC resorts, and add exposure to the "Best Kept Secret", but that's a weak argument. Shifting empty rooms from Disney Resorts, and DCL to DVC just keeps empty rooms in their overall system; accounting-wise keeping resale contracts in DVC would help DVC show higher occupancy rates than Disney Resorts, or DCL, but in the end, even that is a wash.

I think you're reading too much into it there. It's just about selling more points direct.

IMO - DVC is specifically trying to shift current DVC owners from resale market add-ons, back to direct sale add-ons.

More about prospective owners than current. Current owners are more likely to have established patterns for using their points. If your initial contract(s) were purchased direct, they probably represent enough points for any non-DVC use. Buying a resale add-on wouldn't necessarily harm those members if they just use the resale points for the 11 DVC resorts.

It's more about getting new buyers to go direct instead of resale. Gives the salesperson an easy comeback when asked "why should I buy from you when I can get the same thing for ___ less via resale?" Being completely blocked from all of those non-DVC options is a pretty big pill to swallow.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

DVC has just changed the resell rules on DVC points. I was planning on adding additional points this year, but now I am going to hold out to see if this is just the first of many rule changes to come. I have already written to DVC and would suggest all DVC members write to DVC and tell them what you think. Below is the letter I sent to DVC:

I was planning on buying an additional 100 points this year at Bay Lake Tower direct from DVC. I have 250 points in which I purchased 150 from DVC and 100 resell points. The new resell rules have changed my mind. I have always felt that if bad times hit my family (lost my job or illness in the family) and I could no longer afford DVC, I could resell my points. Now that DVC has made this first change in the rules, I feel that more are to come. I will not be looking to expand my points past what I now have. I have also recommended DVC to two friends that have purchased points directly from DVC. I will not be recommending to anyone to purchase into DVC until we find out if the rules will continue to change. If DVC kills the resell market than DVC is going to be the one that hurts in the long run.

For once, I get to say...

<ahem>

I SAW THIS ONE COMING AND CALLED IT! :fork:

And I'm also very willing to bet that these aren't the only changes coming. This is the first change to see how strong a reaction DVC receives. A "toe in the water", if you will. If and when they determine the negative reaction to be at an acceptible level, get ready for more.

Death by a thousands cuts.

 

[DVC Mike]

I'm not too upset at these changes.

Things like the Disney Collection, the Adventurer Collection, the Concierge Collection, and AP discounts are all offered by Disney Vacation Development (DVD), the unit that builds the resorts and then sells the memberships. They are not part of our "ownership interest" and the cost of these programs is not passed on to members and is not included in the annual dues we pay.

They are - pure and simple - sales and marketing tools to entice people to purchase an ownership interest.

I am not defending DVD but I can see how they'd want to differentiate resale versus direct and make it more enticing to purchase direct. They now have an answer to the sales prospect who asks "Why buy direct when I can buy resale for less?"

Since it's really a waste of points to use your points for the Disney Collection, the Adventurer Collection, and the Concierge Collection, it's no great loss to potential resales buyers anyway. It's more symbolic at this point.

It may, however, lead to lower resale values and cost existing members who wish to sell their points, which is the real shame.

 

[ncstate7991]

Do the changes mean if I buy points via resale after March 2011 that I cannot exchange points for a Disney Cruise? Thank you!

 

[Pioneer Hall]

Do the changes mean if I buy points via resale after March 2011 that I cannot exchange points for a Disney Cruise? Thank you!

That would be correct.

 

[216bruce]

Just as an aside on this topic. Usually it takes about 6 business days for the buyer in resale to get their papers to close a purchase after Disney passes on ROFR. I am now at about two weeks of waiting for my paperwork. I don't suppose Disney is dragging their feet to have some resales pass the magic March date to close...hmmm. I would like to think not, but they are either overwhelmed with a mass of paperwork on resales right now or being just plain nasty. Thoughts? Info? Insight?
I e-mailed the title company and they said "soon". That was a week ago.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I'm not too upset at these changes.

Things like the Disney Collection, the Adventurer Collection, the Concierge Collection, and AP discounts are all offered by Disney Vacation Development (DVD), the unit that builds the resorts and then sells the memberships. They are not part of our "ownership interest" and the cost of these programs is not passed on to members and is not included in the annual dues we pay.

They are - pure and simple - sales and marketing tools to entice people to purchase an ownership interest.

I am not defending DVD but I can see how they'd want to differentiate resale versus direct and make it more enticing to purchase direct. They now have an answer to the sales prospect who asks "Why buy direct when I can buy resale for less?"

Since it's really a waste of points to use your points for the Disney Collection, the Adventurer Collection, and the Concierge Collection, it's no great loss to potential resales buyers anyway. It's more symbolic at this point.

It may, however, lead to lower resale values and cost existing members who wish to sell their points, which is the real shame.

I see a handful of problems with this... Some of which are bigger than others:

1. While not a good use of points, SOME people do use them for the DCL, CC, AC, etc. (small issue, because those folks should know better!)

2. The idea that this is the first of many changes to come. Everyone should be very worried about this. I think anyone that doesn't think there's more on the way has their head in the sand. (BIG issue, as common sense would say that this first change would be the smallest in impact in order to get people used to the idea of change)

3. The fact that they're saying "members asked for this". That's a slap in the face, IMO... And at the very least, a severe twisting of the truth to get the result they wanted. It's these sort of things that seem to show a change in focus (perceived, at least). It's spooky.

4. The biggest issue, and one that you mentioned. Resale values. So many on other boards are saying "It doesn't matter to me!!!"... But it might. Someday. For any variety of reasons. And the product will no longer be what you expected it to be (and in many cases, it was a big part of the sales pitch!!) when you bought it.

If they wanted to create a difference between resale and direct, the best way to do it with the most positive PR attached, would have been to ADD benefits to those who buy direct, rather than take away from those who buy resale. There would be not one single rational person that would be upset about that. It would increase value of membership rather than devalue, and would put a carrot out there to buy direct. But... I'm certain they didn't want to do that because it would invariably add cost to the bottom line. So they broke out the scissors instead.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Just as an aside on this topic. Usually it takes about 6 business days for the buyer in resale to get their papers to close a purchase after Disney passes on ROFR. I am now at about two weeks of waiting for my paperwork. I don't suppose Disney is dragging their feet to have some resales pass the magic March date to close...hmmm. I would like to think not, but they are either overwhelmed with a mass of paperwork on resales right now or being just plain nasty. Thoughts? Info? Insight?
I e-mailed the title company and they said "soon". That was a week ago.

Meh. I don't have any sort of actual insight to be sure, but usually the simplest answer is the correct one... And the simplest answer would just be that they're just slow.

 

[DVCOwner]

A lot of people are saying this will not effect them, but I think it is going to effect every DVC owner.

I have just looked at one site that resells DVC (The Timeshare Store) and there is over 73,00 points now on sell at that one site.

They cover ever DVC resort as shown here:

AKV - 8,572
BLR - 3,380
BCV - 3,615
BWV - 12.309
GCV - 882
HH - 2,718
BWV - 20,482
SS - 11,188
VB - 4,575
WE - 5,812

Total - 73,533

If the owners can not resell these properties, than they will defalt on the paying the dues. The cost of running the resorts will than have to be paid for by less members and the yearly cost will go up. If the annual cost goes up than DVC direct sales will decrease.

Than DVC is going to have to take over the points that it has loans on and resell them. I do not know what happens to points that a paid for that people defalt on annual payments. Remember this is just one site of many selling DVC.

DVC has not planned this out to well. I have already emailed them (no reply) and I plan to call them this week.

 

[Phonedave]

I see a handful of problems with this... Some of which are bigger than others:

1. While not a good use of points, SOME people do use them for the DCL, CC, AC, etc. (small issue, because those folks should know better!)

That is not really an issue.

Anyone who is currently doing that will be able to continue to do so - current owners are grandfathered no matter where the bought their points.

Anyone buying in the future goes into the transaction with clear information. If you think you will be using points for DCL, CC, ABD, etc then you need to pony up the dough and buy direct.

The people it does impact are the ones that are in the resale buying process right now. They may have started the transaction thinking one thing, but if ROFR and closing takes too long, they may end up with another.

As for me, I was thinking of adding on points, sometime in the future (have other priorities for cash right now) and was going to go with after market. Now, I don't know. While I know how bad it is to use points for a Cruise or DCL, I do like to have that option available to me if circumstances end up that way. I may just buy an add on block via DVC.


-dave

 

[Pioneer Hall]

That is not really an issue.

Anyone who is currently doing that will be able to continue to do so - current owners are grandfathered no matter where the bought their points.

Anyone buying in the future goes into the transaction with clear information. If you think you will be using points for DCL, CC, ABD, etc then you need to pony up the dough and buy direct.

The people it does impact are the ones that are in the resale buying process right now. They may have started the transaction thinking one thing, but if ROFR and closing takes too long, they may end up with another.

As for me, I was thinking of adding on points, sometime in the future (have other priorities for cash right now) and was going to go with after market. Now, I don't know. While I know how bad it is to use points for a Cruise or DCL, I do like to have that option available to me if circumstances end up that way. I may just buy an add on block via DVC.


-dave

From what I heard, and this may be wrong, if an offer is submitted for ROFR prior to the magic march date, those points will still be grandfathered. This would save Disney and buyers a lot of headaches, but I am not sure if this information is accurate.

 

[DVCOwner]

I am sure there are a lot of people on this web site wanting to tell me told you so. I have defend buying DVC over and over and even ask on one time why there are so many people that hate DVC. I am now not real happy with DVC and I think this is not the last change but just a foot in the door. If people do not complain to DVC than they will folllow up with additional changes that may not apply to everyone and not just new resells. I now think every DVC member is going to pay the price in order to increase new sells.

 

[Phonedave]

From what I heard, and this may be wrong, if an offer is submitted for ROFR prior to the magic march date, those points will still be grandfathered. This would save Disney and buyers a lot of headaches, but I am not sure if this information is accurate.

That would stop a lot of complaints and would make sense. It is the first I am hearing of it though.

-dave

 

[Blueliner]

From what I heard, and this may be wrong, if an offer is submitted for ROFR prior to the magic march date, those points will still be grandfathered. This would save Disney and buyers a lot of headaches, but I am not sure if this information is accurate.

That is what I was told by the Timeshare Store, Inc.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I am sure there are a lot of people on this web site wanting to tell me told you so. I have defend buying DVC over and over and even ask on one time why there are so many people that hate DVC. I am now not real happy with DVC and I think this is not the last change but just a foot in the door. If people do not complain to DVC than they will folllow up with additional changes that may not apply to everyone and not just new resells. I now think every DVC member is going to pay the price in order to increase new sells.

Told you so.

:lookaroun

:lol::wave:

 

[toolsnspools]

I am now not real happy with DVC and I think this is not the last change but just a foot in the door. If people do not complain to DVC than they will folllow up with additional changes that may not apply to everyone and not just new resells. I now think every DVC member is going to pay the price in order to increase new sells.

Giving feedback, positive or negative, to any Disney company is always easy. In the case of DVC, you can send it directly from their website, or use the phone. If you are a current owner, this change takes value away from your contract, and you should let them know about it. My response to them was:

"DVC Member Services,

It sure has been a tough few years on timeshares. I see many timeshares going for pennies on the resale market, and I keep a close eye on how DVC resale prices are holding up as well. Relative to the market, we are doing very well. This is why I find it hard to beleive that you would make a change to resale contracts that will directly impact that value of my contract, if I ever need to sell it. The only thing your change does is attempt to shift sales from those of us who may have hit hard times and need to part with our contracts, to direct sales contracts for new resorts. I appreciate the fact that DVC is continuing to build and offer more resorts, even in this bad economy, but when you take out your problems with too much inventory on your current owners, it is a slap in the face to those of us who are loyal to the DVC brand. It is a disturbing trend and if it continues, I don't think you'll need to worry about sales, resale or direct.

Sincerely, "

While this may not change their minds for this particular change, if they get enough bad feedback like this, they will think twice about the next change they are considering.

 

[MouseRight]

A lot of people are saying this will not effect them, but I think it is going to effect every DVC owner.

I have just looked at one site that resells DVC (The Timeshare Store) and there is over 73,00 points now on sell at that one site.

They cover ever DVC resort as shown here:

AKV - 8,572
BLR - 3,380
BCV - 3,615
BWV - 12.309
GCV - 882
HH - 2,718
BWV - 20,482
SS - 11,188
VB - 4,575
WE - 5,812

Total - 73,533

QUOTE]

How many Old Key West points were available for sale? Thank you.

 

[googilycub]

A lot of people are saying this will not effect them, but I think it is going to effect every DVC owner.

I have just looked at one site that resells DVC (The Timeshare Store) and there is over 73,00 points now on sell at that one site.

They cover ever DVC resort as shown here:

AKV - 8,572
BLR - 3,380
BCV - 3,615
BWV - 12.309
GCV - 882
HH - 2,718
BWV - 20,482
SS - 11,188
VB - 4,575
WE - 5,812

Total - 73,533

If the owners can not resell these properties, than they will defalt on the paying the dues. The cost of running the resorts will than have to be paid for by less members and the yearly cost will go up. If the annual cost goes up than DVC direct sales will decrease.

Than DVC is going to have to take over the points that it has loans on and resell them. I do not know what happens to points that a paid for that people defalt on annual payments. Remember this is just one site of many selling DVC.

DVC has not planned this out to well. I have already emailed them (no reply) and I plan to call them this week.

I am pretty sure that is incorrect.....If the owners default and the points go back into the DVC bank, then DVC would be responsible for the dues.